Australia Telescopes - anyone had experience with them?

[jtm92]

Hi all,

About a month ago I ordered a motorised mount upgrade for my dobsonian telescope from australiatelescopes.com.

However, it still hasn't shipped, and all of my attempts to contact their customer service have been ignored. As I'm sure you would understand, this is more than slightly worrying after forking out $900.

Has anyone had any experience buying from this company? More importantly, has anyone else been screwed over by them?

I would really appreciate input from others about this.

Thanks

Jarrod

[Tandum]

Never heard of them. How did you pay? Can you get the payment reversed?

[jtm92]

I paid through Paypal, so I should be able to get it reversed if it does turn out to be dodgy. Really disappointing though.

[Tandum]

They might just be on holiday and are too slack to put it on the web site. I got a few customers that are closed till the 7th. I wouldn't buy from them again though :( Also watch the time limit for lodging a paypal claim.

[gb_astro]

Does not sound like good service at all.
As said above they could be closed.
Even a major dealer like Andrews is closed until the 9th.

gb.

[Varangian]

Jarrod I have dealt with them before. I have purchased filters and eyepieces and while they were slow to deliver they did arrive. A month seems like a long time though unless they needed to ship it in from the States (so did not have in stock). They really should be updating you.

[Kunama]

They are very slow to respond to emails, took 4 weeks to respond to my email when I was buying a new mount, ended up buying from myastroshop instead.
Of all their phone numbers only Brisbane seemed to be connected but a message I left for a callback was never replied to.

[LewisM]

Paypal gives 40 days to lodge a complaint (which starts you down the refund avenue). Get onto it NOW!

[jtm92]

That seems to be on par with the pretty horrible customer service I've encountered. I'll keep harassing them and hopefully it will get me somewhere. I was initially going to buy the mount from BTOW, but they didn't have it in stock until March...in hindsight I should have just waited.



Thanks for the heads up Lewis, I'll definitely get started on that.

[brian nordstrom]

:thumbsup: Yes paypal are very good , I accidently payed $2 to much for my Istar 127mm f/8 lense out of the States and they have twice now contacted me to allow them to refund that $2 , yes only $2 but they where right on to it .
Brian.

[mikerr]

As Lewis said, you need to lodge the PayPal dispute NOW. It does not mean that you can't proceed with the transaction if you wish. PayPal will contact the vendor with your concerns and usually that will get a response.

Good Luck.

Michael.

[knightrider]

I too have just recently experienced the same thing. Ordered mid dec, it does say on the website that orders wouldn't be shipped after the 15th, but didn't say when they would start again. After multiple attempts to contact via email and phone with no reply I've given up.

[LewisM]

NEVER give up!

If they debited you credit card, or you paid Paypal etc, GET ONTO IT NOW!!!

[knightrider]

I lodged a paypal dispute earlier today and I got an automated credit email from aus scopes customer service instantly saying it is successfully refunded. No money in my account yet though.

Do I still need to follow through with escalating the PayPal dispute to get the money back?

[torana68]

I would ignore the automated email, why does a compay have an automated responce to a paypal claim????? if you go into your Paypal account you will find a section where disputes are updated, it will tell you where its at. Id say escalate it as soon as you can ( I think there is a certain number of days between opening and escallating?)

[jtm92]

I have since escalated the Paypal dispute to a claim. That was about 4 days ago, and the seller still hasn't responded at all.

I've never had to make a claim through Paypal at all; can anyone tell me what happens if the seller continues to ignore it?

[Larryp]

I bought a generator on Ebay once-the guy sold 20 of them and apparently didn't have them-none were delivered. I put in a claim on Paypal, and after them trying to resolve the problem with the seller, they eventually refunded my money. I don't know if Paypal got money back from the seller, but I got my money back.:)

[Wookie]

If the seller refuses to respond they will decide the dispute in your favour by default and refund your $$$.

Paypal are very good but you need to make sure you're in before the deadline otherwise you don't have a leg to stand on.

Good luck with it all.

[AstroJunk]

The following is all public domain and perfectly fair and legal to reproduce. I have contacts at Queensland Police an the Qld Office of Fair Trading and will be contacting them regarding a number of possible offenses under Australian Consumer Law 2011.

The website and business is owned by:

Domain Name australiatelescopes.com.au
Registrant GIANNOULAKIS, DIONISIA
Registrant ID ABN 81 837 848 243
Eligibility Type Sole Trader
Registrant Contact Email dionisia.giannoulakis@utoronto.ca

The Brisbane phone number belongs to:

Hanceys Turf
Address: Beerwah-Kilcoy Road Woodford 4514 QLD
Phone: 07 3102 9790 Other Phone: 1800 133 064 Mobile: 0439 306 616 Fax: (07) 5493 4352
Contact: Nathan Hancey
Website:www.hanceysturf.com.au
email enquiries@hanceysturf.com.au

Now would be a good time for anyone who knows these people or who is associated with the owner to make good this complaint.

[jtm92]

Well, after being given 10 days to respond to the Paypal claim and ignoring it, I have been refunded my money by Paypal.

However, for anyone who is looking to buy something from Australia Telescopes in the future and comes across this forum, I have one piece of advice for you:

DON'T

It's really not worth the risk.

[eiscaer]

Same experience here. Because of the Christmas period and having too much on my plate, I didn't lodge a claim within 45 days. However if anyone else lodges a claim within the next 6 months, they reinvestigate my claim too. Doesn't matter much. Because my PayPal account is linked with my visa, the bank is sorting it out.

I'll reiterate what has already been said. Not worth dealing with.

[deadsimple]

In the first week of January they informed me they're open for business for the year. I ordered an in-stock item the other day, the website quotes 1-3 business days to receive it. Order has not progressed after many days, the item is still listed as In-stock, and they are not bothering to respond by email.

Why say you're open for business and auto-charge people's accounts if you have no intention of fulfilling orders? Mind-boggling!

Lodging a claim as soon as the minimum required Paypal waiting period expires. Not happy at all.

[eiscaer]

My bank is now seeking to recover the funds. Should take a few weeks.

[knightrider]

I received my funds back just yesterday. 2 days after PayPal said the reversal was successful.

[gaf.flash]

Gee I wish I had found this thread before I placed my order.
Anyway, nothing seen or heard from Australian Telescopes after 4 weeks of constant calls and emails.
Dispute lodged with Paypal so I believe I'll get my money back - eventually!
How do we spread the word about this mod?
What about official complaint. Who and how?

[deadsimple]

To follow-up on my previous post, I attempted to lodge a Paypal Dispute today and it said "Your seller is currently unable to respond to this dispute".

After a bit of research this apparently means that the retailer has either withdrawn from Paypal, or they have current disputes/claims in progress.

However, it gave the option of skipping a Dispute request and jumping straight to making a Claim - which was fantastic.



You could try the ACCC. However the only time I made a complaint (about a brick-and-mortar retailer telling me I have to give my full name and contact details or else my manufacturer's warranty is void), they were a bit rude and not particularly helpful. The gist of it is that they just file away your complaint and if enough build up, then they investigate. They just won't do anything about a couple of complaints.

[RelevantTheory]

What motorised mount kit are we speaking of, JMI? It may be worth pursuing the wholesaler, either local or foreign, it is their reputation on the line too, it is all too easy to set up an account with a supplier, but to actually stock and support the brand is another matter.

[AstroJunk]

Police: Fraud (Local station counter)
Your State Fair trading: Missrepresentation and a whole string of possible offenses under the fair trading act (Probably has an online complaint system)

Please do it -it's the only way to stop this happening again and again.

[gaf.flash]

OK. you have convinced me.
And for anyone else in VIC, here's the relevant link:
http://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/shopping/refunds-and-returns/online-purchases

[LesserBear]

well my brother emailed them about 2 weeks ago enquiring about a SW-Dob...still no reply.

was in Bintel store around same time me bro sent email , tried to do a price
match but Bintel Salesman say no and that Australian Telescopes in trouble, something about not being an australian company and grey importer..

looked in this odd thread http://www.astronomyforum.net/australian-astronomy-forum/116364-australia-telescopes-testimonials-customers.htmlwhere they look good..honestly dont understand admin there, where get quotes from?

[JB80]

That forum has or had a deal with AT as site sponsers, they still advertise on their site but suddenly all the butt kissing has stopped and there is no mention of these great deals this wonderful grey importer once had.

[eiscaer]

Bank got my money back. No sweat. Now to find someone who CAN supply me a bag to fit my scope. Back to the drawing board.

[gaf.flash]

Got your money back from Australian Telescopes, or as the outcome of a formal dispute?
After many email and phone calls, I still have had no response.

As a beginner to this hobby, it has put me right off. Talk about leaving a bad taste in your mouth.

**Moderator** - Time to get any support for Australian Telescopes off this site. It is only hurting this forums reputation. Try and contact them. Bet you don't get a response! http://www.astronomyforum.net/austra...customers.html

[Ausrock]

What got me about these details is 1) the unexplained tie in with Hancey turf, AND 2) the Registrant's contact email being a Canadian addy............not an encouraging sign.

[knightrider]

I just recently got my money back via paypal. Don't sweat it, as long as you've sent your dispute in early enough and raised it to a claim you'll get every cent back.

Also don't let this one bad internet shopping experience put you off the hobby. The hobby is well worth it. Just get what you wanted to by from a reputable seller that many have dealt with on here happily, quite a few threads will show who's been good.

If you're ever dubious about a supplier, give them a call if you can, and ask if it's in stock and how long it might take to get to you.

Here's a link of supported suppliers, I have already dealt with a couple of them with much success.
http://www.iceinspace.com.au/links.html

[Stardrifter_WA]

Hi George,

I agree with Knightrider, there are plenty of reputable companies who deal in telescopes in Australia, so please don't let that put you off, it is a truly wonderful hobby and you will get to meet many nice people.

I have never had any issues with the companies I deal with, so don't let one bad experience put you off. In fact, the people I always deal with have been very helpful over the years.

I would hate to see anyone leave this hobby just because of a disreputable company.

Cheers Peter

[barx1963]

We have a small group of astronomy specialist shops here in Australia who offer great service in my experience.
I have had dealings with

Bintel
Andrews
Sirius Optics
My Astro Shop

In all cases service has been very good, easy communication and good follow up.
Some of these web only stores are potentially very damaging to our hobby as well as to the stores that look after us IMHO. Even places like Aust Geographic I am very wary of as they are overpriced and not knowledgeable.
I think it is important to support the specialists, as without them our hobby is in trouble!

Malcolm

[Steffen]

I bought a filter from Australia Telescopes not long ago (before the Venus transit), they delivered it promptly. Not sure why they're off and on like that…

Cheers
Steffen.

[eiscaer]

When I ordered my bag, I also ordered an eyepiece, which did arrive. Seems like they're more off than on though, especially from this thread.

[gaf.flash]

Says it all really. Austalian Telescopes are no longer.

[toc]

Its a shame, because they are showing the skywatcher EQ8 'in stock'! :)

[monsooncat]

I thought one action would be to complain to the domain registrant for australiatelescopes.com.au, which is www.crazydomains.com.au. Unfortunately they have just as many complaints about them.

[Russ59]

100% agree with Malcolm. Unfortunately there are questionable retailers on the net in every field of interest.

I know for a fact that there are IIS members here. who are moderators of that "other forum" mentioned in earlier posts.

[monsooncat]

Yes, I managed to win one of their 'life bans' for merely warning a user, on the 'forum' mentioned earlier, about the perils of ordering with Australia Telescopes. What a joke.:rofl:

[Octane]

What forum is it? I only use this one for my astro fix. :)

H

[monsooncat]

This one:


fo·rum

/ˈfôrəm/
Noun
A meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.

Well, it is a site in the US, so I guess they are used to controlling individuals from expressing their own views, but 'Admin' claims to be in "Sydney, Australia", so he should know better... Australians cherish our freedom of speech! Besides, I wrote nothing more than facts and tried to warn a user, Chimp (http://www.astronomyforum.net/members/chimp.html), so he didn't get burned like me and many others.

And in answer to LesserBear's Q: Astronomy Forum cut & paste the glowing supposed-customer testimonials straight from the Australian Telescopes web site.

[LesserBear]

thanks for answer,
monsooncat that was rough , try to do good an get ban for life...that is crazy!

well about month ago tried to post a message kindly directed @ that Admin about Bintel said and gave link to this saving thread but got blocked with notice something about my post to be reviewed. Then next day the thread i tried to post in disappeared which was dedicated to Australia Telescopes, maybe a coincidence. The link i provide here is another thread which remember while ago when log in it showed as "CLOSED".
Also my other 3 posts were blocked to be reviewed before being allowed, so couldn't check if made mistake or when or if. Don't think can post there again because need to check post after it "should" post straight away, is like you restricted... hands tied.

My first post here was allowed instantly, cant get any freer than that


EDIT: this post too allowed instantly, thankyou

[bcmalloy]

http://binocularsandtelescopes.com.au

is a great store for guys in WA (division of gerry gibbs camera house)
just ordered a EQ6 off them cheapest price in AUS

[jastro]

Ordered a scope they said was in stock, liars.
Ignored my emails.
Refund only after threatening legal action.
Authourities could not care less even after many complaints.
DO NOT DEAL WITH THEM.

[Ted Manuel]

Try VTI next time.
They provide very good services and they keep you up to date on your purchase status.

[raymo]

Mike, You'd have to go some to beat B.T.O.W. inMalaga
for price and service.
raymo

[Chris85]

From what I've heard http://binocularsandtelescopes.com.au IS Btow. Gibbs must've bought them out. Even their websites are similar.

Chris

[Stardrifter_WA]

Old news Chris.

As I understand it, Jerry Gibbs Cameras (Murray Gibb) own BTOW, which is still managed by Keith, however, it is run independently from Jerry Gibbs Camerahouse. Gibbs also has the Gerry Gibbs Camera "Warehouse" as well, which is their online business which is also run independently from their retail store.

Furthermore, I have found that some of the online prices are considerably better than their retail store. Case in point: I wanted to buy an 8x32 Leica Ultravid binocular, for my upcoming trip to the US to go to Stellafane, and had a look at it in their Cannington store and the price was $2,300, which is about right at retail level. When I came home and did some research online, to be sure that was the model I needed, I went to their "Wharehouse" site to check something and noticed that they had it as a "web special" at $1,999, so I bought it online and picked it up at the retail store. The guy at the retail store wasn't too happy about losing the sale, although I was buying it from the same company. Affects his sales figures, I guess? Strange that a company would be competing with itself, but then, maybe he is trying to establish his online presence.

Either way, I find dealing with Jerry Gibbs to be quite good. Also Kieth at BTOW is good to deal with and his prices are quite good too.

Given the above, it looks to me that the telescope and binocular site is the online version of the retail site (his Camera House sell telescopes as well) and is in competition with BTOW, at a guess. In some ways this is a smart move, as BTOW and Keith have an established reputation.

[Chris85]

I know Peter, I was just passing on the info.
And I totally agree with your comments regarding Keith and Btow. I've purchased 90% of my gear through him and he's always given me spot on advice. Even when when a supplier stuffed up the order 3 times he cut me a deal and upgraded to the better product.
I have noticed that the gibbs website is online only?
Chris

[adammm]

I just jumped online and thought i'd checkout the Equipment thread as im currently in the market for my first scope, gps/goto scope mind you.

was looking at ordering through australia telescopes tomorrow but now i've seen this ill be looking elsewhere

no need to get the word out guys, people WILL find this thread if they do their research.



thanks guys

[Ric]

I have been following this thread for a while and find it strange that after all the complaints they are still being allowed to continue trading.

[Nikolas]

You email australia telescopes and refer them to this thread
Name and shame is more effective than the ACCC
As is facebook shaming.

[martyn01]

Just order the scope from USA even with shipping and gst still way cheaper than in aus

[gaa_ian]

It is appalling that this website is up and running still selling quality telescopes (apparently), I only just came across it today ! It is a very slick looking site, touting it's all Australian ownership:"AustraliaTelescopes.com.au is a 100% owned and operated Australian company based in Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, and Perth and operates under ABN 81 837 848 243. All our employees are Australian citizens, we only sell Australian distributed and warrantied products (not grey-market products unlike other stores) and we intend to honour our store name."
I can understand the concerns of people new to the hobby, as some of the scopes listed here, are scopes I would happily recommend to people coming into the hobby. It shows the value in supporting the Astronomy Retailers that you know will support you.

[Astromelb]

Dear Ice In Spacer's,

Chris (Ausrock) has this basically correct.

I was contacted by the ACCC in my capacity as president of a major Australian astro society, they asked me if I knew these people.

The supplier's email address if you look at it ends with "ca", this is the absolute giveaway, he is in "Canada".

This supplier is not in Australia, they rarely if ever answer your phone calls.

Plus when I checked with some wholesalers regarding products on their webpage they advised they do not have a relationship purchasing telescopes with them, so where are they getting stock from ??

Not very honest :(

Personally I always recommend purchasing from Australian businesses, not overseas crowds, but that's your call - as for me I wouldn't touch this supplier - their over use of Australia, Australia, Australia all over their webpage is a giveaway, isn't very Australian. They should be open an honest and call themselves "Canadian Telescopes", that would be more honest.

I recommend honest suppliers that actually answer their phone, and are actually IN Australia.

Clear skies to you all.

[JB80]

Looks to me as if it has been known for quite sometime that they are not an Australian business. The first few posts are, well, staggering. Not without a point though.
At least 2 years, probably more and.

http://www.astronomyforum.net/australian-astronomy-forum/115399-why-australians-pay-more-astronomy-equipment-everything-explained.html

[Astromelb]

Dear Ice In Spacers,

Looks like this crowd has gone, disappeared.

Their webpage doesn't work any more. Plus their advertisements don't show up anywhere.

Not even any dead (or old) links showing up about them under a Google search.

Most unusual.

I have never seen this level of departure from all internet linkages before, this is more than merely unusual. You would expect that some trace of them would still available on the web, but I can't find anything.

I am aware the ACCC had issues with them, but they have basically ......... vanished - Completely !

Has anyone seen anything from them in the last week or so, if so - add it to this blog so we can all get updated.

I won't miss them, they weren't Australian anyway, not very honest in my humble opinion.

Rgds,
Astromelb.

[Stardrifter_WA]

Maybe the ACCC had the websites completely removed? If so, it took them long enough.

[gaa_ian]

That is good news for both Australian Astronomers and for Honest retailers !

[Tandum]

Sounds to me like they were just collecting eq8 deposits then pissed off.

[Starless]

Good riddance!!:mad2: