I am not sure of why gets its benefits but it seems the optics are key.
However one aspect that appeals to me, where I can only image an object for one hour a night, is possibly being able to capture ten hours in one.
Andrews have triplet binoculars for 270.
So I buy five set them in a 3d printed bracket to hold ten, remove prisms add tube and camera which is dedicated to one channel. So ten filters ten hours however you use it.
Ten $500 cameras...electric focus for each, ...
How to manage the captures would be a problem.
Could it work.
Or you could get ten high grade triplet 80mm scopes and ten high grade cameras.
But could it work on a simple level of using Andrews $270 binos.
What would it take.
Alex
But I would not venture there. Seems to be a potential source of endless frustration n headaches. I would rather enjoy slow and less troublesome acquisition of quality data
Well I would like to back up North where I could see the sky , darker, but the trees here ...hard to be relaxed when you get an hour a night.
You can bet there probably folk who have built what I am thinking about...
Last night I got in about ten snaps of the Moon but had the image and control on screen...if I had electric focus I could stay inside...
I think as a mental exercise ..its more than just ten cameras , well for a start you are going to be downloading ten times...
Alex
The fly in your ointment is that binocular objectives are designed to work with the prisms in the optical train. The lengthy glass path in the prisms adds spherical aberration. If you remove the prisms the objectives will be less than sharp.
Better to buy a bunch of small APO objectives and assemble the rest yourself, but they'll cost rather more by the time you're done.
The fly in your ointment is that binocular objectives are designed to work with the prisms in the optical train. The lengthy glass path in the prisms adds spherical aberration. If you remove the prisms the objectives will be less than sharp.
Better to buy a bunch of small APO objectives and assemble the rest yourself, but they'll cost rather more by the time you're done.
Well a box of them may turn up...surplus shed...
But leave the prisms in ,happy to less work .
I would like a pair so should get a pair and see how to fit a camera..just take some shots and see how good or bad they may be...
Probably a good thing having only an hour will see me pretty focused.
Alex
I was happy with my $200 set, But who knows.
So I bet you are going to suggest ten of the best...what unit I wonder going 100 mm even 150 mm best glass as you would say Leon.
And best cameras...what could you do ...I imagin imaging over five days and bring in 200 hours...hang the expence ..
Alex
It depends how many I could carry on eq6 I haven't done figures but four maybe five scopes, but five is five hours for every one ...even two scopes three ...but start to approach the game by get max exposure time ...electric leads every where..
Alex
Gave the 8 inch a run.
Captured about five of the Moon but did it from the lap top. Then clouded over.
Investigated the various controls. I could get focus better but had to go between scope and lap top an add on electric focus would be great I could sit in side and do everything in comfort.
I wonder what the cheapest way out would be? I would be happy if two wires coming back to a hand box would be ok but to have control on screen would be great.
I had scope on mount using the dovetail it came with and it was bouncy, the tube is folded to make the tube with a big join, its constructed like a can.
I like my old 6 inch cause it a nice solid tube.
Plans to fix it.
I have a longer dovetail but I am thinking get the longest dovetail and another two tube rings.
In addition baffle the inside such that the baffles will add structure strength.
Proceedure at this stage...insert cardboard cylinder inside bare tube stick to inside of tube, add baffles in card board. paint the lot with resin which makes the cardboard very strong. You could also insert structural features with x in between baffles...follow a line similar to the framed newt.
Take care to use four mount rings and maybe additional support between dovetail and scope..
The focuser it the best I have owned and with the new camera I am reaching better focus than ever in a tenth of the time. I would take a shot examine it on the camera adjust take another shot...took ages and ...well now it better.
Designed the pier for this mini observatory.
Its on a patio so less than ideal but the idea is to lay down some ply make a concrete disk three inches thick and say two and a half feet diameter say three I could got to four....but ti will never leave..mmm a big one and it can stay when I go..with pvc pipe coming up to required height, cement in four blots at the top of your pipe pier, same as up North and use the fitting that I have and goes onto those four bolts.
The disk will be bolted to the patio and the surrounding floor will be ply with heaps of insulation cause in summer the patio gets hot...I see a challenge controlling heat here but whatever it is there the cards I have been dealt.
I wonder how imaging thru a glass sheet would effect things.. but with a glass top my box observatory could be airconditioned so hold at bay the patio heat. I know a flexible covering on the top of the box which goes right up to the scope so it peeks out off a sheet approach...everything inside could be keep cool.
And I need an air conditioner as well the house gets so hot in summer.
Things to do must rush.
Alex
And I have to build my 8 inch a stray light baffled extrusion tube ... still don't test the old one... but I am convinced it helps in my situation with street lights.
Alex
To this day I will never give them a good report not after what they did to me.
Leon
I must have missed that Leon.
I am sorry you have had a sad experience.
So moving forward I suppose the approach should be buy the best as possible and that runs the price up ... I should do a costing mmm a spread sheet where you can put in different prices of units cameras etc...
A scope, filter, electric focuser, flattener camera...easy to spend five k a scope...that's fifty grand for the real deal....ten scopes...
Say five that's still $25k.
But exposure time is so important and there is so little of it that we get, so when seeing is good you need to jump on the opportunity... so when its there you need to be able to guzzle in as many photons as possible...he who gathers the most photons wins... and then you take this rig out to some place real dark and no rain and gather huge numbers of photons.
I myself have started wondering about the advantages vs. cost. Big cost is the cameras and focusers, but with today's cheaper CMOS cams, getting more plausible.
If you have a thermal problem I'll suggest this is much better...In this case it's damn cold outside, you have the reverse.
A company that makes cabinets for industrial control systems could knock one up for much less than what you'll spend doing what you describe - its basically a cabinet for 19" rackmount electronics with door, with a few windows added and the internal rack removed.
To that add some insulation inside, strap on an air conditioner and you'd be cool as a cucumber This particular little number happened to be portable as it also fitted neatly in a box trailer. Details http://www.volnaengineering.com/tardis2-1.php
What's more you COULD cannibalise a PortaLoo for the same purpose - has a door, fan-forced ventilation, readymade seat, and will save you a trip to the bathroom in the middle of a session. Wife will be wondering WTF you are doing in there !
I myself have started wondering about the advantages vs. cost. Big cost is the cameras and focusers, but with today's cheaper CMOS cams, getting more plausible.
Watch this space....or that space?
I was talking to a friend he said yes some web cams are 20 meg..must look into that.
Back to cheap.
Andrews binos say$2000 and web cams maybe $250 each...have to build electric focuser to keep it cheap.
Alex
Maybe use eyepiece projection and use what on the binos...
Would quantity win over quality.
Thinking today getting fifty hours is major for anyone plus you need a run of good viewing.
But with a multi scope rig on a good run you may get 300 hours before that object is gone forcthecyear.
Which raises the question what would say 300 hours produce in a final image???
Alex
You're going to have a heap of "fun" on the software side of things with this setup too - trying to control it all. Going to dither at all? Then you need to coordinate exposures to ensure all are finished before dithering. If you're doing L,R,G,B,Ha - you might need different exposure times.
Then you need to consider flats - going to do those, or just process them out?
And I suspect you're going to have a lot of issues trying to control it from one machine (USB ports/connections). Probably would be much easier with INDI than ASCOM, but that's just guessing on my part with no real world testing.
If you just have 1 filter per scope, you should be able to use a good achromat - no need for an apo. That would save cost.
If you wanted another way to do this, a cheaper and lighter way.
Get 5 cameras that have the older shutter release (non digital, not sure if this one would work) and 5 Samyang 135mm F/2. The reason for the older style shutter release cable is that they can be operated without a powered shutter release, camera powered.
You have one camera that is tethered into the software using a DSUSB connected to the shutter release. You split that shutter release into 5 so that it can be plugged into all 5 cameras. As the shutter release activates the exposure in bulb mode you only need one camera to be activated for all 5 to be controlled and synchronised.
If you don't guide (just have good PE and PEC) you don't have to worry at all about precise alignment as it is the guider that causes differential guiding errors. They are best when they're not even correctly aligned as it is a natural kind of dithering between each camera, you do still need to dither.
I say 5 cameras as these can be mounted on the largest/longest Losmandy/ADM plates without too much of an issue. It'll be tight but should fit.
