#1  
Old 10-01-2013, 11:58 AM
mbaddah (Mohammed)
Registered User

mbaddah is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sydney
Posts: 803
Anyone seen this Canon 6D High ISO test?

The 6D performs incredible at high ISO, check out these examples!

http://blog.planet5d.com/2012/12/the...n-5d-mark-iii/

And

http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?post...sts-impressive

Very useful for astrophotography
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-01-2013, 12:08 PM
originaltrilogy (Petr)
Registered User

originaltrilogy is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Bathurst, NSW
Posts: 116
Quite telling!
http://blog.planet5d.com/wp-content/...ra-Noise-2.jpg
http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?post...l-manual-video
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-01-2013, 08:39 PM
Octane's Avatar
Octane (Humayun)
IIS Member #671

Octane is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Canberra
Posts: 11,158
Yep, do want for landscapes/nightscapes!

H
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-01-2013, 10:47 PM
Peter Ward's Avatar
Peter Ward
Galaxy hitchhiking guide

Peter Ward is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: The Shire
Posts: 6,650
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbaddah View Post
The 6D performs incredible at high ....
Incredibly.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-01-2013, 12:31 AM
rogerg's Avatar
rogerg (Roger)
Registered User

rogerg is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 4,540
Interesting. I had completely ignored the 6D until now.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-01-2013, 08:36 AM
pluto's Avatar
pluto (Hugh)
Astro Noob

pluto is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Sydney
Posts: 1,982
Wow that's pretty impressive!

Also this comparing ISO noise on 5d2 5d3 1dx and 1d4:
http://www.uncagethesoul.com/night-p...-night-camera/
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-01-2013, 09:21 AM
iceman's Avatar
iceman (Mike)
Sir Post a Lot!

iceman is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Gosford, NSW, Australia
Posts: 36,709
The 6D looks very very impressive.

Can't wait to try out the WiFi etc.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-01-2013, 11:09 AM
mbaddah (Mohammed)
Registered User

mbaddah is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sydney
Posts: 803
My "new" 5D Mark II feels so obsolete now The 6d is performing at least 2+ stops better. Quite a jump.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-01-2013, 11:19 AM
Octane's Avatar
Octane (Humayun)
IIS Member #671

Octane is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Canberra
Posts: 11,158
The 5D Mark II was announced in October, 2008. So, the sensor is getting long in the tooth. However, it still takes just a beautiful image today as it did the day it was released. And, same with the original 5D.

It's quite telling that the gap was quite small in release dates between the 5D Mark III and the 6D, and the 6D performs better in terms of noise characteristics. So, even in those few months, there was advancement in sensor technology.

Oh, there's also rumours of a 40 megapixel monster around the corner, too.

I think I might just have to get one.

H
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-01-2013, 11:32 AM
gregbradley's Avatar
gregbradley
Registered User

gregbradley is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 15,454
It lokos terrific although I would say there is a caveat.
It is highly unlikely Canon have developed a new sensor here. This would the same tech as before.

The difference is the Digic V+ and most likely a more advanced noise reduction algorithm going on.

I think Canon have started manipulating RAWs like Nikon used to do. There are posts about this on DPreview.

Your RAW is probably not RAW. Whether that means less faint stars or no difference at all is something future images will show.

But low noise is low noise no matter how they are getting it as long as you don't miss out on detail. Its the final image we are intereted in not how you get there.

A 6D high ISO jpeg I saw on the net at ISO8000 was pretty grainy and lacked a lot of detail, simiar to my little Sony RX100. So jury is out on this high ISO point. I would be surprised if it could beat the 5D3 personally but thats just an opinion. The trend has been for a lot of manufacturers to rely more on the increased processor power and the jpeg engine to do noise reduction rather than the sensor itself being much cleaner or a combo of both.

Greg.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Octane View Post
The 5D Mark II was announced in October, 2008. So, the sensor is getting long in the tooth. However, it still takes just a beautiful image today as it did the day it was released. And, same with the original 5D.

It's quite telling that the gap was quite small in release dates between the 5D Mark III and the 6D, and the 6D performs better in terms of noise characteristics. So, even in those few months, there was advancement in sensor technology.

Oh, there's also rumours of a 40 megapixel monster around the corner, too.

I think I might just have to get one.

H
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 11-01-2013, 01:47 PM
danielsun's Avatar
danielsun
Canon collector

danielsun is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Taylors Lakes Melb
Posts: 1,965
This to me seems a killer camera and now I just gotta get one!! The low noise has won me and being full frame is a new step for me. Really keen to see how the Wifi transfer performs, No cables..... now that to me is heaven.
Darrin (Midnight) has done a great comparison in this thread here.http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...d.php?t=100058
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 11-01-2013, 02:03 PM
iceman's Avatar
iceman (Mike)
Sir Post a Lot!

iceman is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Gosford, NSW, Australia
Posts: 36,709
Once you go full frame, you'll never go back!
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 11-01-2013, 07:47 PM
gregbradley's Avatar
gregbradley
Registered User

gregbradley is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 15,454
I did a post elsewhere. It seems RAW is RAW up to ISO25600 and then a noise routine is run like is run on the jpegs.

That's good news.

Greg.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 13-01-2013, 12:38 AM
naskies's Avatar
naskies (Dave)
Registered User

naskies is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,865
Less noise in single shot images would be a huge boon for the people shooting nightscapes etc

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregbradley View Post
I did a post elsewhere. It seems RAW is RAW up to ISO25600 and then a noise routine is run like is run on the jpegs.
As Craig Stark found, Canon RAWs aren't truly "raw" - it's already had pre-processing before it hits the CR2 file. It explains why In-Camera Noise Reduction works better than shooting separate light+dark exposures back-to-back...
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 14-01-2013, 05:47 PM
gregbradley's Avatar
gregbradley
Registered User

gregbradley is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 15,454
Quote:
Originally Posted by naskies View Post
Less noise in single shot images would be a huge boon for the people shooting nightscapes etc



As Craig Stark found, Canon RAWs aren't truly "raw" - it's already had pre-processing before it hits the CR2 file. It explains why In-Camera Noise Reduction works better than shooting separate light+dark exposures back-to-back...
I am not sure that Craig Starks article is conclusive. ISO response is not linear very often with DSLRs. You can get a drop in sensitivity by going to a nonstandard ISO setting (ie not a standard multiple of 1600, 3200, 6400 etc. That varies by camera maker and model I believe. For example the Nikon D800 does not drop dynamic range between ISO's but other models do.

So he may just be seeing that phenomena. Of course it may be a secret routine is being applied but it smacks of conspiracy theory - in this case against Canon. Who knows but I kind of doubt it as it could hurt their sales and little to be gained by doing that. The pixel peepers would pick it up and crucify them for it.

Greg.

Last edited by gregbradley; 15-01-2013 at 07:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 14-01-2013, 11:29 PM
Octane's Avatar
Octane (Humayun)
IIS Member #671

Octane is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Canberra
Posts: 11,158
Thankfully, the majority of photographers out there aren't pixel peepers or armchair sensor designers a la DP Review forum users.

I love my Canon gear; they make beautiful photographs.

H
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 15-01-2013, 10:44 AM
naskies's Avatar
naskies (Dave)
Registered User

naskies is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,865
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregbradley View Post
I am not sure that Craig Starks article is conclusive. IO response is not linear very often with DSLRs. You can get a drop in sensitivity by going to a nonstandard ISO setting (ie not a standard multiple of 1600, 3200, 6400 etc. That varies by camera maker and model I believe. For example the Nikon D800 does not drop dynamic range between ISO's but other models do.
I think the dark noise investigations are pretty conclusive (pages 3-5 of the article). Based on how imaging sensors work, we know that dark noise only increases over time - thermal noise doesn't subtract from the well counts. However, when extracting data from the "raw" files it clearly does...

Quote:
Of course it may be a secret routine is being applied but it smacks of conspiracy theory - in this case against Canon.
I disagree that it's a conspiracy theory - the methods he used are clearly stated, his findings match what I've experienced, the theory for what he's saying appears legit, and he provides very compelling reasons why this behaviour (scaling) would be highly desirable for normal shooting.

The main point is that the process is being performed before the data is being written to the CR2 raw file - hence there's no way to undo the rescaling. CR2s are a lot more "raw" than JPEGs but they're obviously not equivalent to FITS files from astro CCDs either.

I should point out that this process works extremely well. I can fiddle around with equivalent Exposure Values, e.g. 30 sec @ ISO 25600 gives me a histogram with the same peak location as 8 mins @ ISO 1600. Likewise shooting timelapse sequences on manual doesn't change the location of the histogram peak (that I've noticed) even as the sensor warms up substantially.

In fact, it worked so well that before getting into astro I didn't even realise that there was such a thing as dark current
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +10. The time is now 11:55 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.7 | Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertisement
Bintel
Advertisement
OzScopes Authorised Dealer
Advertisement
SkyWatcher Australia
Advertisement
NexDome Observatories
Advertisement
Celestron Australia
Advertisement
Lunatico Astronomical
Advertisement
Meade Australia
Advertisement
Astronomy and Electronics Centre
Advertisement