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Old 25-04-2019, 11:58 AM
gary
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China announces plan to build base at Moon's south pole within the decade

AFP reports today that with respect China's space ambitions :-

Quote:
Originally Posted by AFP
It now plans to build a scientific research station on the moon's south pole within the next 10 years, China National Space Administration head Zhang Kejian said during a speech marking "Space Day", the official Xinhua news agency reported.
Story here :-
https://www.france24.com/en/20190424...about-10-years
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Old 25-04-2019, 12:17 PM
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Isnt that where all the water is☺
Alex
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Old 25-04-2019, 12:19 PM
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Now surely the US must build one at the North Pole. We should mount a rocket and get a piece.
Alex
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Old 25-04-2019, 01:28 PM
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Hmmm..another South China Sea island eh?
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Old 25-04-2019, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xelasnave View Post
Isnt that where all the water is☺
Alex
Hi Alex,

Indeed it is, though they have started to detect tenuous amounts of water
vapour elsewhere in the lunar atmosphere whenever a meteor makes an
impact.

Where the Chinese would get an enormous head-start in planning is to
pore over the volumes and volumes of publicly available studies for
building moonbases that NASA commissioned from the likes of Boeing and
North American Rockwell in the 1970's.

An enormous amount of engineering time and money must have gone
into these proposals.

For example, imagine the amount of expert knowledge that would go
into this one recommendation amongst thousands from one of the many
Rockwell studies from the '70's :-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunar Base Synthesis Study, Final report Volume II, North American Rockwell, 15 May 1971
Pressure Garment Assemblies (EA)

Based on the present state-of-the-art pressure suit development and
the proposed lunar surface EVA work loading, it appears that more than one
suit plus spares will be required to assure continuous surface exploration.
Lunar dust, daily wear and tear, cleaning and drying, and the 30-day periodic
seal replacement all add to the pressure suit requirements.

To assure the operability needed to support lunar surface exploration,
a conservative estimate is felt to require a total of three pressure suit
garment assemblies for each crewman per six-month tour of duty if he is to
perform regularly scheduled lunar surface EVA'S. The first suit is for
immediate use, the second one for use while the first is being cleaned and
repaired, and the third is a spare in case of complete failure or nonrepairable damage.
Enough spare seals will be required to change the seals in each garment every 30 days,
plus a field repair kit for each suit for patching minor abrasions and
surface tears.

Each EA provides a mobile life support chamber for a crewman and a
100 percent oxygen environment at an operating pressure of 7.0 -/+0.2 psia.
and so on and so on.
See https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...9710016382.pdf

The North American Rockwell proposal concluded at the time the optimal
place to build a base was within Kopff crater supported by an orbiting
Lunar Station. NASA and the University of Houston expanded the study
to build a colony inside Kopff crater.

Kopff Crater was chosen as the site for the lunar colony mainly because
its limb location was more conducive to some of the research effort
envisioned for a colony away from the influence of the earth.

They wanted to perform astronomy there, which sounds like a great idea
to me, and at the time proposed to build multiple telescopes there.
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...9730002509.pdf

This was before they discovered water down at the south pole.

But I like the Kopff crater location simply because the name has this
really good ring about it.

See http://nassp.sourceforge.net/wiki/Moonbases
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Old 25-04-2019, 02:33 PM
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Now this is where our genetic engineering should take over. Cant we play with a humans dna and build a humanoid that does not need a space suit and gets their oxygen from the rocks☺.
I wonder how humans might change if you had multiple generations of folk knowing only the Moon.
I think underground would be the way to go on the Moon..go big like those underground cities in Turkey from ancient times..20,000 population they think☺
So replicate Earth under ground..trees for oxygen and natural systems to manage the water system...so I womder how many trees would each human need to get a handle on how much digging we need to do.
And of course if we found something we could mine deep down that paid for the dream it could work out...hard to imagine major cities underground on the Moon with their own forests...
Alex
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Old 25-04-2019, 03:38 PM
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Yep lets just stuff up the moon as well
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Old 25-04-2019, 03:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xelasnave View Post
I think underground would be the way to go on the Moon..go big like those underground cities in Turkey from ancient times..20,000 population they think☺
So replicate Earth under ground..trees for oxygen and natural systems to manage the water system...so I womder how many trees would each human need to get a handle on how much digging we need to do.
Alex

No need to dig Alex. You are building inside a deep crater, just put a lid on it and you are underground already.


Michael.
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Old 25-04-2019, 04:06 PM
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That is a great idea when you think it through.
Just bring the football stadium builders into the discussion...great way to start but I am now set on gaint underground paradise set ups... hey it would be funny if we dig down bent on colonising the Moon but at 300 feet under and we run into a civilization already set up like I propose☺....and every planet and Moon we check out in the solar system that we can land on all have underground civilizations more advanced than we can conceive...the Chinese dont know what they are getting us into..next thing it will be war between humans and the civilizations underground on the Moon.
I wonder when and if humans will set foot again on the Moon.
Alex
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Old 25-04-2019, 04:45 PM
glend (Glen)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xelasnave View Post
Now this is where our genetic engineering should take over. Cant we play with a humans dna and build a humanoid that does not need a space suit and gets their oxygen from the rocks☺.
I wonder how humans might change if you had multiple generations of folk knowing only the Moon.
I think underground would be the way to go on the Moon..go big like those underground cities in Turkey from ancient times..20,000 population they think☺
So replicate Earth under ground..trees for oxygen and natural systems to manage the water system...so I womder how many trees would each human need to get a handle on how much digging we need to do.
And of course if we found something we could mine deep down that paid for the dream it could work out...hard to imagine major cities underground on the Moon with their own forests...
Alex
Alex I suggest you watch a movie called "The Titan". It's about human DNA engineering to create a being that can live on Titan without a need for a habitat or suit. It's on Netflix. Scary
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Old 26-04-2019, 09:21 AM
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Yes Glen there are few ideas that are original.
Still I do like the idea of underground caves of paradise.
I expect if our species survives that in time we will see colonies on the Moon and maybe Mars..they will find something..rare earth material or something that will make not having a mine on the Moon unthinkable.
We cant inagine what does not exist easily but consider where we were 60 years ago..for me I was trying to understand how they got Sputnik to stay up there..so lucky to see it..and perfect straight above no cloud...seemed ordinary but given how weather hides major events I now appreciate how lucky to see it.
Australia needs to get up there and mark out and claim territory. I see a business ..making knives for rock stars using impact material mined from the Moons craters.
Moon dust for mud packs maybe.
We need to get up there before its all gone.
Alex
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Old 27-04-2019, 09:43 AM
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Seeing that anywhere outside this wonderful planet is extremely hazardous to human life, a genetically modified person may be necessary. Even then it probably won't work. Yes, i am not hopeful about long term space travel, or colonization.
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Old 27-04-2019, 01:08 PM
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Hmmm.. moon bases to me means “mining”
There’s heaps of helium 3 in the regolith of the moon which is used for nuclear fusion
It’s a safe non radioactive isotope which is the prime ingredient in a fusion reactor
Byproduct is H2O amongst other things
It’s years away but fusion reactors could power our planet for centuries
Apollo 17 lunar module pilot Harrison ( Jack ) Schmidt proposed the idea 10 years ago and was ignored
What else do you fly to the moon for .... geology , views of the earth ?
The US has already done that , how many more rock samples do you need to study
Think about it for a while .........
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Old 27-04-2019, 02:34 PM
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You ship smallish space vessel components to the moon, assemble them there, and off you go, with only 1/6th of the earth's gravity to impede you.
No need for an aerodynamically designed craft, unless you are planning on entering another body's atmosphere. I'm confident that barring unforeseen
catastrophes, the moon will eventually become our jumping off point.
raymo
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Old 28-04-2019, 08:12 PM
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Anybody remember that show?
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Old 28-04-2019, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
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Anybody remember that show?
Yes, I do.
It was way before of Prince though....

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Old 12-01-2021, 04:59 PM
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The space race has begun.. When they walk we will talk.
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Old 12-01-2021, 05:56 PM
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I think you need to view the Netflix mini series “Mars” the conflict between science and profit are well explained.
Actually quite a thought provoking set of scenarios, well worth watching.
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Old 12-01-2021, 07:06 PM
Hans Tucker (Hans)
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Anybody remember that show?
Or maybe ...

https://youtu.be/8CvURidpkCY
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Old 13-01-2021, 09:37 AM
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iborg (Philip)
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Hi
Unfortunately,I also suspect that the Moon is the ultimate high ground for warfare.
Philip
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