#1  
Old 19-08-2018, 08:31 AM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Meade LX90 & Windows 10

Has anyone had success connecting their Meade LX90 to a Windows 10 computer.

I have checked the Meade cable I have with an Ohmeter against the Pinouts shown on Weasler & they are correct & the cable has continuity.

I purchased a Serial to USB cable from Jaycar (Prolific chipset) & have had nil success in achieving a connection.

I am aware that the Prolific serial to USB cables have a patchy success rate despite the fact that is what Meade sells in their cable kit but, I'm also wondering if it could be a Windows 10 / 64Bit OS issues.

Considering taking the plunge & purchasing a Keyspan Serial to USB cable but, they are pricey & I want to see if anyone else has had success before expending a considerable sum of money on a different cable.

Thankyou in advance for any advice or comment on success or otherwise.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 19-08-2018, 10:42 AM
AndrewJ
Watch me post!

AndrewJ is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,905
Gday Carlton
Does the adapter show up as functioning correctly as a COM port in device manager???
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 19-08-2018, 11:30 AM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Hi Andrew,

Yes, the adapter shows as functioning in the device manager. However, i still can't establish a connection through the latest version of autostar suite, autostar updater 2 (64 bit version) or starpatch. I'm out of ideas, id like to test through my mac but, none of these programs are mac compatible.

Cheers

Carlton

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewJ View Post
Gday Carlton
Does the adapter show up as functioning correctly as a COM port in device manager???
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 19-08-2018, 12:18 PM
AndrewJ
Watch me post!

AndrewJ is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,905
Gday Carlton


Have you tried doing a loopback test by shorting the Tx/Rx pins
and seeing if you get an echo???
My PEC editor can detect and scan all ports to try and find a Meade
and will log what it gets back.
http://members.optusnet.com.au/johansea/

It also allows you to send and read data manually, so can be used for loopback testing.

What firmware is in your handbox????
There is a known problem in A4S1 but it shouldnt affect getting a connection.


Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 19-08-2018, 01:48 PM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Hi Andrew,

I will give these tests a go tomorrow & get back to you. Unfortunately, I am on night shift tonight & tomorrow night so, a bit time poor.

What tool/app do I use to see if I get an echo? I understand you used to be able to use Hyperterminal in XP but, that nolonger exists in Windows 10. I will give your PEC editor a go & see what information I can determine from it.

I'm also going to download stellarium to my Imac & see if I can get any sort of connection on the mac.

No 100% sure what firmware is loaded to the Auto Star at present. I presume it shows the firmware load on startup of the handset? I will take note when I fire it up.

Cheers

Carlton

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewJ View Post
Gday Carlton


Have you tried doing a loopback test by shorting the Tx/Rx pins
and seeing if you get an echo???
My PEC editor can detect and scan all ports to try and find a Meade
and will log what it gets back.
http://members.optusnet.com.au/johansea/

It also allows you to send and read data manually, so can be used for loopback testing.

What firmware is in your handbox????
There is a known problem in A4S1 but it shouldnt affect getting a connection.


Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 19-08-2018, 02:35 PM
AndrewJ
Watch me post!

AndrewJ is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,905
Gday Carlton
Quote:
What tool/app do I use to see if I get an echo? I understand you used to be able to use Hyperterminal in XP
My PEC editor has the equivalent functionality of Hyperterminal
built in on the logging tab.
You just send a command from an edit box and the log will show both Tx and Rx data
Quote:
I presume it shows the firmware load on startup of the handset?
Yep, or you can go to the "Statistics" menu option and get the full version no.
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 20-08-2018, 10:06 AM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Hi Andrew,

Well, I think I have done this correctly... can't be 100% sure coz I may not have a clue what I am doing...

Firmware version number is: 31Ee

I bought the scope secondhand, I suspect the firmware may never have been updated. Not necessarily a big deal as the handset functions as it should.

I think I have tested the cable & USB/serial adapter.

Your program certainly found a comm port & looked for a scope (using the auto function. It tried across a number of baud rates & could not find the scope.

I then attempted to loop across the tx/rx terminals on the rj9 plug that plugs into my handset. terminals 1 & 2 using the diagram available on Weasners. Ie: turned the plug upside down so the locking tab was on the bottom & if you look at the plug end on, I believe it should be the first two terminals on the left. I used a small flat blade screw driver to cross connect the terminals.

I then used the send button on the terminal screen using the default code that was in in the edit box ':gc#' and also typed in a string of characters...

All I got back was 'action timed out'

I have to presume I actually managed to cross connect the terminals, not sure how else to do it & not sure how to verify that I did in fact cross connect them.

Should I try other terminals on the plug in case it is wired incorrectly, I did read somewhere that a batch of these cables came out incorrectly wired.

Otherwise, from the tests I have attempted, does it indicate that the either the cable or the serial plug (Meade supplied I believe) don't work?

I am really grateful for your assistance but, wonder if we might be able to speak in real time, via Skype chat or, even Skype video call perhaps?

Regards

Carlton

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewJ View Post
Gday Carlton

My PEC editor has the equivalent functionality of Hyperterminal
built in on the logging tab.
You just send a command from an edit box and the log will show both Tx and Rx data

Yep, or you can go to the "Statistics" menu option and get the full version no.
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 20-08-2018, 10:29 AM
AndrewJ
Watch me post!

AndrewJ is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,905
Gday Carlton
Quote:
Firmware version number is: 31Ee
That is pretty old.
Quote:
I believe it should be the first two terminals on the left.
That sounds correct
Quote:
I used a small flat blade screw driver to cross connect the terminals
Dont understand how you can do that, as there are insulating plates between the contacts. I normally just use a bent piece of copper hookup wire ( like a strand from Cat6 wiring or the like. )
Quote:
not sure how else to do it
You can also short 2 of the pins in the DB9 converter with a short piece of wire. Pins 2 and 3 in the DB9 are the Tx and Rx
If that works, then you probably have a suspect cable ( as you are right, Meade made a lot of dud cables )
If it doesnt work, then the converter may be faulty.
Just a process of elimination.
If you have a multimeter, you can easily check the continuity of the cable to see if it is wired correctly.

Quote:
wonder if we might be able to speak in real time, via Skype
I dont have skype or anything like it. Im still on a crappy ADSL ( 2.8kms from exchange ) so anything real time is not functional.

Andrew
Attached Thumbnails
Click for full-size image (505cable.gif)
25.6 KB20 views

Last edited by AndrewJ; 20-08-2018 at 10:32 AM. Reason: forgot piccy
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 20-08-2018, 10:41 AM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Agree, the firmware is pretty old; I have just been chatting with previous owner - he never attempted to connect to a computer so, never updated the firmware & at least confirms for me that we don't know whether the able ever worked; that is helpful in some ways.

With regards the use of flat blade screw driver, I thought the metal strips on the bottom of the rj9 connector were the contacts & that I could short out across them.. probably not eh??

I will try some very fine fuse wire I have & see iif I an insert into the slots on the plug.

I thought I had tested continuity but, given how I attempted that, possibly not actually.. I'll try that again using the fine fuse wire to give myself something to put the probes of my multimeter against.

Not 100% sure how I go about testing the dB9 connector, I assume it involves carefully removing it from it's casing to get at the back of the pins whilst it is connected to the serial/usb adapter?

Can you advise if the RJ11 slots line up with the RJ9 slots? I can then test that part of the connection independantly.

Can relate to crappy ADSL, we were lucky to get 3Mb/s on ADSL here; NBN for the past 12 months, much, much better but, on Fibre to the node so will be interested to see how our connection fairs in the FNQ wet season.

Cheers

Carlton
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewJ View Post
Gday Carlton
That is pretty old.
That sounds correct
Dont understand how you can do that, as there are insulating plates between the contacts. I normally just use a bent piece of copper hookup wire ( like a strand from Cat6 wiring or the like. )
You can also short 2 of the pins in the DB9 converter with a short piece of wire. Pins 2 and 3 in the DB9 are the Tx and Rx
If that works, then you probably have a suspect cable ( as you are right, Meade made a lot of dud cables )
If it doesnt work, then the converter may be faulty.
Just a process of elimination.
If you have a multimeter, you can easily check the continuity of the cable to see if it is wired correctly.

I dont have skype or anything like it. Im still on a crappy ADSL ( 2.8kms from exchange ) so anything real time is not functional.

Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 20-08-2018, 11:13 AM
AndrewJ
Watch me post!

AndrewJ is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,905
Gday Carlton
Quote:
I thought the metal strips on the bottom of the rj9 connector were the contacts & that I could short out across them.. probably not eh??
They are the contacts, but there are plastic insulation strips between them
so you cant accidentally connect 2 together.
You need something that can get between the plastic strips.

Quote:
Not 100% sure how I go about testing the dB9 connector,
The one on the converter will have pins, so just short pins as noted
( you can use a screwdriver for this )
To test the Meade cable, i normally push a dressmakers pin into the holes and then tape a dressmakers pin to the probe on my meter.
That allows the pin to get to the contacts in the RJ9.
Andrew
have attached the piccy of how the Meade adapter "should" be wired
Attached Thumbnails
Click for full-size image (Meade505Adapter.jpg)
75.3 KB14 views
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 20-08-2018, 11:52 AM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Okay,

successfully shorted out the tx/rx pins on the serial/usb db9 connector & sent & received :GC# command.

So, it appears the adapter is working - Great news.

Carefully prised apart the db9/rj9 adapter & as far as I can tell it is wired as per your photograph.

Retested continuity, this was a bit tricky & I got patchy results. Sometimes I had continuity, sometimes I didn't.

This could be my dodgy technique or, it could be a dodgy cable with an intermittent fault somewhere in the cable perhaps.

I understand that other than buying another meade cable at price ridiculous, I might have another option in purchasing a telephone handset connector which I believe has an rj9 connection standard, then cutting off one end & soldering correct wires to a db9 connector as per your diagram. Would that work?

I will post this online as well so, any other interested folk can follow.

Cheers

Carlton

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewJ View Post
Gday Carlton

They are the contacts, but there are plastic insulation strips between them
so you cant accidentally connect 2 together.
You need something that can get between the plastic strips.


The one on the converter will have pins, so just short pins as noted
( you can use a screwdriver for this )
To test the Meade cable, i normally push a dressmakers pin into the holes and then tape a dressmakers pin to the probe on my meter.
That allows the pin to get to the contacts in the RJ9.
Andrew
have attached the piccy of how the Meade adapter "should" be wired
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 20-08-2018, 12:17 PM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Andrew & I have been communicating via PM to try and establish what is causing the problem.

For anyone following in an attempt to trouble shoot their own connection issues; here was Andrew's response (in Blue) to my latest post:

Gday Carlton

successfully shorted out the tx/rx pins on the serial/usb db9 connector & sent & received :GC# command.

Good, that means the expensive bit works :-)

Carefully prised apart the db9/rj9 adapter & as far as I can tell it is wired as per your photograph.

OK


Retested continuity, this was a bit tricky & I got patchy results. Sometimes I had continuity, sometimes I didn't.

That could be lots of things, but doesnt sound good.
You need solid continuity




I might have another option in purchasing a telephone handset connector which I believe has an rj9 connection standard, then cutting off one end & soldering correct wires to a db9 connector as per your diagram. Would that work?

Thats how i started out, but i had a lot of 4wire flat phone cable and connectors and a crimper. I just crimp a connector on one end then soldered the other to the DB9.

What you could do is see if there is a local phone tech who would make up a short bit of 4 wire flat and one end.
If you dont have a DB9 or supplier nearby, you can always open your Meade adapter and cut the wires close to the RJ11, and then solder the wires , vs solder to a new DB9????
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 20-08-2018, 01:07 PM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Looks like the rj9 to rj11 cable is a probable culprit but, as Andrew states below, I won't know for certain until I replace it.

Now to look at options for a new cable, make my own, find an aftermarket cable made for the job or, buy the meade cable...

I'll figure it out, it's not urgent by any stretch of the imagination.

Thankyou very much to Andrew for his assistance & patience in helping me to nut out the likely cause of my problem.

Gday Carlton

I am now reasonable confident that it is the Meade cable which isn't working properly.

The only acid test is to use a second cable, or try your cable on another handbox.


I've been looking to see what might be available commercially (other than a Meade cable) but, can't seem to find a great deal. I can find curly cable rj9 to rj9 (telephone handset cable) but, I don't know if that would work.

To work with the Meade adapter and a 497 handbox, it requires a 6P4C connector at one end and a 4P4C at the other.
It also has to be wired correctly.
If you put the 2 connectors on your cable side by side and facing the same way, you will see they are wired opposite hand.
That is what the new cable needs to be like.

ie one connector has pins 1,2,3,4 and the other 1,2,3,4,5,6
They need to be wired as

1-5, 2-4, 3-3, 4-2



Getting a defunct handset cable from a tech/junk pile may work OK and then just solder it to a DB9????


If I did indeed find something commercially would it be wired correctly as a matter of course?

Correctly for what :-)
All cables are different for different purposes.
Nothing is "standard" for all things.

You need to look on the net as to how a specific cable is actually wired.
IIRC, a phone handset cable has RJ9s at both ends ( as it can be used to replace the Hbx cable for an LX200 ), soo if it is RJ9 both ends, you would need to cut one end off and solder the free end to a DB9.
At the end of the day, you just do a continuity test, to see if it is wired as per the piccy i posted.


What about if I could find an Rj9 to rj11 cable commercially, would it be wired correctly to the corresponding contacts?

As per above, i dont know that, You would need to see what the pinouts definition is for the specific cable.



Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 24-08-2018, 11:15 AM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
Success!!

Went to Jaycar today & purchased a telephone handset cable, Female DB9 connector, soldering iron plus other sundry items.

Carefully looked at the cable, wire colours etc; carefully checked the pinout guide from Weisner's website, carefully checked the photo Andrew posted.

Upshot is, I made myself a new cable & it works like a charm.

Cost of cable in real terms was about $15 vice buying one commercially for around $60.

So glad I decided to have a go myself...

Grateful for the assistance & guidance provided by Andrew.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 24-08-2018, 12:45 PM
AndrewJ
Watch me post!

AndrewJ is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,905
Gday Carlton
Good to hear it all works.
You can now update the handbox as and when required, and get the benefits of the later firmwares and patches.
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 24-08-2018, 12:52 PM
Outcast's Avatar
Outcast (Carlton)
Always gonna be a NOOB...

Outcast is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cairns, Qld
Posts: 1,285
I assume the patches come through 'Starpatch'?

Which patches would you recommend please?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewJ View Post
Gday Carlton
Good to hear it all works.
You can now update the handbox as and when required, and get the benefits of the later firmwares and patches.
Andrew
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 24-08-2018, 01:02 PM
AndrewJ
Watch me post!

AndrewJ is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 1,905
Gday Carlton
Quote:
I assume the patches come through 'Starpatch'?
That is the easiest and most robust way.
Quote:
Which patches would you recommend please?
You will need 43Eg firmware, and whatever patch is linked to it.
( looks like 43GG.spf )

If you dont have a StarGPS lump, disable the first patch item
that integrates the StarGPS into the std firmware.
The other basic defaults are normally good enough to start with,
but read all the others and what they do, to see if something may interest you.
Andrew
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +10. The time is now 04:48 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.7 | Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertisement
Testar
Advertisement
Bintel
Advertisement