Budget Entry Level Audiophile Hifi

Outcast (Carlton) · #1 26-12-2020, 12:56 PM

As the title states, I'm looking for some advice on good quality Entry Level Audiophile Hifi gear.

What I have already:

Rotel direct drive turntable
Musical Fidelity A3 Solid State Amp

So, no stranger to Entry Level Audiophile gear.

What I want to move to:

PrimaLuna Evo 100 Valve Amp
Phono Stage: I've looked at a few & I am now confused...

Rega Planar 3 Turntable (in about 12 months time)

My budget for an integrated tube amp & phono stage is between $3500 - $4000...

The Prima Luna Evo 100 & 200 together with an entry level Phono Stage (Rega MM Mk3, NAD Pp2e, Musical Fidelity LX2-LPS, Schiit Mani & there are many others I've looked at) come within my budget.

I'm not in a position to audition any of this gear as no-one in Cairns stocks this (or for that matter any Audiophile gear) gear so, I'm having to rely on reviews, etc... The PrimaLuna Evo tube amps get overwhelming good reviews & comments on user forums for an entry level tube amp. The Phono stage choice is where I'm somewhat bamboozled. However, I'm open to advice, suggestions on both.

I'd welcome any suggestions from members with experience in this area please. Please remember, I'm on a budget... I'm well aware of the limitations this places on me but, believe I should be able to get some pretty good bang for my buck as well as move to the Tube end of town..

Thanks in Advance

Outcast (Carlton) · #2 26-12-2020, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glend

carlton, you certainly know how to pick your hobbies. High end audio and astronomy.

yep.. you're right...

Then add to the mix my bass guitars & amp rig... my wife just loves my hobbies... NOT

JA · #3 26-12-2020, 04:10 PM

Hi Carlton,

based on a former life in the area I'd simply say that by far one will get the greatest benefit in changing things at either end of the chain, where movement is turned in to an electrical signal at the cartridge and where an electrical signal is turned in to motion at the loudspeaker. The phono preamp can also play a considerable part as their is sometimes considerable variation in the RIAA/equalisation. Those areas are where I would focus my attention in an analog system.

Best
JA

rrussell1962 · #4 26-12-2020, 04:29 PM

Hi Carlton, I'm with JA. Most decent amps are very competent so its worth focussing on the cartridge and phono stage. Planar 3 is a good turntable, I had one for years with the old RB300 arm and an Ortofon MC before I got talked into a Pink Triangle Export. Interested in your rationale for valve amplification. The A3 is a classy amp. I used to run Audio Innovations valve monoblocks with a pair of Impulse H3 speakers years ago but moved back to a Quad 99 / 909 Power amp solid state system. I found valve gear to be much fussier re partnering. What are you thinking re speakers? BTW Caxton Audio in Brisbane have great deals on stuff - specials on their home page. I have no connection with them other than being a customer for 20 years.

Outcast (Carlton) · #5 26-12-2020, 04:56 PM

Thanx Gents,

Speakers... forgot to mention.. currently running a set of Jensen QX35 6 Ohm floor standing speakers.

My A3 is having some issues, source selection buttons don't stay selected when powering up. There is an audible click & the light goes out... it's taking me 5 - 6 power cycles to get the source selection to stay connected. I've spoken to an audio technician up here & he suspects dry capacitors & believes he should be able to repair it.

It is a fantastic amp which has served me well for 22 years... I just have a hankering for that warm, analogue tube sound.. which I have experienced with guitar amps but, not hifi... The PrimaLuna amp I'm looking at seems very well regarded in it's price point & has a few features that make living with a tube amp somewhat easier such as an autobiasing function, protection circuit for the amp in case of dead tube, toroidal transformers, quality components & point to point wiring...

As JA says, the snag for me is choosing a phono preamp... I know picking the right one will be the key to the whole experience...

The turntable upgrade will come in time... & maybe if I butter the wife up enough, maybe just maybe some new speakers...

I've got another phono preamp to add to the mix.. MOFI Studiophono... reviews & opinions seem a little less mixed/controversial than others I've been looking at...

xelasnave · #6 26-12-2020, 05:33 PM

I don't know but I think folk get a bit carried away with the difference in sound Calton...I bought a cheap electric guitar, small amp and a looper...$250, $100 and $90 respectively...days ago..only cheap guitar, left he said ... now he did have a $7500 valve amp and various collector guitars but I noticed a telly at $5,500...So just in guitar and amp I could have spent $13,000 to get what?...little more than being able to boast that I had more money than sense I reckon...anyways my $350 investment sounds dam good in the van...the guitar I swears is as good as my Gibson ..it seems to be one of those Japanese guitars that came out that was good when folk still thought Japan could not make good guitars...the amp is a Yamaha and for $100 is brilliant...anyways what made me comment on folk getting carried away ..last night was watching Steve Stevens go thru his gear...he has a rack of maybe 10 or 15 on the tour he was talking about..this one has this and this has that..then his effects..on and on..then his amps...I honestly doubt if his extreme indulgence really comes out in the performance...he is Billy Idols guitarist if you did not know...great guitarist I think but it really is hard to tell thru all his grease....when I am on the electric with buzz and fuzz I sound hot let me tell you...the Gibson is great it generates an accompaniment with neat squeals and zz top type harmonics.

Anyways for me I am very happy to have spent a mere pittance rather than $13,000...I would rather boast how little I paid rather than how much I paid...anyways as I said I have a nice Gibson which I have no idea of value and I nice little Peavey 50 watt to bring up...

I love this looper...do you use one?
Great to lay down a 12 bar progression or a 4 chord thing and then add something else before you do a lead...but perfect to just have it play a cord over and over whilst you experiment with licks... doing it that way leaves no pressure to adjust to a cord change and must perfect the lick.

I guess my reality is I don't stop long enough to appreciate music in itself...usually more a background thing.

So gotta watch getting carried away again with guitars..I just now counted them..including the three strings ( 3 of) I have two acoustics and two electrics...

Anyways sure is nice to hear about your gear.

Addition..the guitar would go out of tune over night something the Gibson never does..It did not worry me but when I hit the hammy bar the guitar just dropped right out..so I retuned it and vowed never to use the yammy again...but I noticed the nut slipped to one slide..the head is offset so that is why..there is the tuning issue right there....anyways I bet that is why the previous owner sold it..after a while going out of tune like it did would send you nuts..and you would not notice because as you retuned the nut was dragged back to the base string side...anyways glued it down and now it's in tune the next morning....

Alex

Outcast (Carlton) · #7 26-12-2020, 08:28 PM

I don't completely disagree Alex & one could easily spend $100k on high-end gear but, if you've never listened to serious hifi gear then I recommend you do... you'll be surprised at the difference..

When I bought my first decent amp, the musical fidelity A3, a SS dual mono block amp (no mixing of channels & tonally neutral) I discovered things in both my vinyl & CD collections I'd never heard before. The reproduction difference was staggering, I kid you not...

The valve amp I'm looking at is extremely modestly priced... I might have French Champagne taste but, my budget is definitely Aussie Beer...😊

ab1963 (Andrew) · #8 26-12-2020, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outcast

I don't completely disagree Alex & one could easily spend $100k on high-end gear but, if you've never listened to serious hifi gear then I recommend you do... you'll be surprised at the difference..

When I bought my first decent amp, the musical fidelity A3, a SS dual mono block amp (no mixing of channels & tonally neutral) I discovered things in both my vinyl & CD collections I'd never heard before. The reproduction difference was staggering, I kid you not...

The valve amp I'm looking at is extremely modestly priced... I might have French Champagne taste but, my budget is definitely Aussie Beer...😊

Before i came to live in Australia from England 30yrs ago i had a Linn sondek,Itok and asak front end or turntable as better known 100 watt pure A class Naim pre and power amp and a pair of Gale speakers all well isolated on correct stands and was incredible but i play a few instruments and think that gives you the understanding of how important separation and tone is in appreciation of music even when you're just jamming with a few mates so i for one agree that money spent on quality hifi just as in telescopes is money well spent that's how i see it anyway

xelasnave · #9 26-12-2020, 10:20 PM

Thinking it thru..I have never listened to music thru good gear.
I do like "live" music...it can't be better than live music can it?
Alex

ab1963 (Andrew) · #10 26-12-2020, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xelasnave

Thinking it thru..I have never listened to music thru good gear.
I do like "live" music...it can't be better than live music can it?
Alex

I believe not but that's why audiophiles spend fortunes to try and replicate that emotion,feel etc that comes from live music

Outcast (Carlton) · #11 27-12-2020, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xelasnave

I do like "live" music...it can't be better than live music can it?
Alex

No but, with a good recording & quality audio gear it's as close as you can get without being in the audience...

JA · #12 27-12-2020, 06:27 AM

Hi Carlton,
The input selection problems on your A3 at startup and then for a few cycles certainly suggests a powersupply/aged capacitor issue, but could also be something to do with switch/relay contacts or even an intermittent contact or circuit trace that changes (improves) as the unit warms up. Capacitors though seem very likely and you can likely know for sure before changing them especially if they are oozing any liquid/gel gunk from their vents or on to the circuit board, or their case is split open usually at their tops or their Equivalent Series Resistance measured by a special meter is highervthan expected. If you need to change capacitors ask your tech to check the ESR in circuit first to help verify that it is a capacitor related fault and also replace the capacitors whilst he is at it with a Low ESR type of the highest temperature rating for potentially longer life and better performance.

Best
JA

Outcast (Carlton) · #13 27-12-2020, 11:37 AM

Thanks JA

Max Vondel (Peter) · #14 27-12-2020, 07:00 PM

I can recommend Eric Chan (McChanson on Ebay) based in Sydney
He recently custom built me a single ended triode based on the 300B.
Using interstage transformers instead of capacitors. So a total of 8 transformers!
Max power 10 Watts but I rarely even run it at 6 Watts.

Matched with a Pair Psvane 300B-T Mark II Treasure Tubes.
I have owned a lot of tube amps over the years, EL34, KT88, KT120 etc
Ultra linear and single ended. This is by far the best I've had n heard. He does have a very minimalist website. And comes with a lifetime warranty (his lifetime...lol)

Price with valves around 3K. I have used them with full range folded horns up to complex 4 way speaker setups. And they drive all loads with ease. Plus you can specify all components you want to use, point to point wiring, ALPS pots, silver wire etc

Eric has built 4 amps for me over the years and never a problem with any of them

Eric: https://www.mcchanson.com/
Valves: https://grantfidelity.com/ (note, lots of tubes on Ebay are counterfeits, this is a reliable source)

morls (Stephen) · #15 28-12-2020, 02:52 PM

My experience of setting up mixing rooms and recording has taught me that the listening environment plays a crucial role in getting the most out of your equipment. Speaker placement, furnishings and floor coverings contribute enormously to the sound. The shape and volume of the room determines which frequencies are reinforced or attenuated. There are some really good, and not too expensive, options for room treatment available. It's worth looking into if you're going to be dropping big bucks (for me, anything over $300 is big bucks) on audio gear. The best gear in a poorly treated and set up room is not going to sound good. A little bit of treatment and careful placement of acoustic diffusers can make a real difference. There are phone apps now (free) which can give basic acoustic analysis.

Having a specific listening position is crucial too. If listening to stereo, the equilateral triangle setup with tweeters at ear level is the most often recommended starting point.

Outcast (Carlton) · #16 28-12-2020, 05:35 PM

Hi Stephen,

You are absolutely correct... no point in putting decent gear in an echo chamber.

Happy I've got my 'listening' room as sorted as SWMBO will allow... carpeted, soft furnishings, material wall hangings, etc....

I won't say it's perfect but, it's as good as the wife is gonna let me get..

morls (Stephen) · #17 28-12-2020, 07:46 PM

Sounds great

ab1963 (Andrew) · #18 28-12-2020, 08:13 PM

You have to remember that to play music live will always be number 1 if i was offered a 3k hi-fi system or 3k of top class live concerts i would jump on the live gigs

Stonius (Markus) · #19 28-12-2020, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xelasnave

Thinking it thru..I have never listened to music thru good gear.
I do like "live" music...it can't be better than live music can it?
Alex

I would have to disagree, my friend. Live audio is full of compromises that a recording studio is designed to address. One of the key aspects of setting up a live gig is to tune the room, subtracting the frequencies that are reinforced by resonant nodes created in structures with invariably parallel walls. So in terms of fidelity, you can get much better control and reproduction in a studio, BUT without a thousands-strong crowd, do you get the same performance? Not usually.

That being said, one of my favorite albums of all time is U2's under a blood red sky. I don't care that it's not the best sound quality, it's the raw energy of the performance that makes that record.

Cheers

Markus

alpal · #20 29-12-2020, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morls

My experience of setting up mixing rooms and recording has taught me that the listening environment plays a crucial role in getting the most out of your equipment. Speaker placement, furnishings and floor coverings contribute enormously to the sound. The shape and volume of the room determines which frequencies are reinforced or attenuated. There are some really good, and not too expensive, options for room treatment available. It's worth looking into if you're going to be dropping big bucks (for me, anything over $300 is big bucks) on audio gear. The best gear in a poorly treated and set up room is not going to sound good. A little bit of treatment and careful placement of acoustic diffusers can make a real difference. There are phone apps now (free) which can give basic acoustic analysis.

Having a specific listening position is crucial too. If listening to stereo, the equilateral triangle setup with tweeters at ear level is the most often recommended starting point.

It's almost impossible to equalise a room.
It is perhaps better to use headphones?