another newbie with boring 1st scope questions ...

["O"]

Hi All,

I am at the stage of gathering information to
buy my first scope.

I am studying the sky with planisphere/charts, naked eye, binocular, and
have attended a viewing with an astronomical group.

Straight away, I knew what type of scope I want.
Small and portable. Even at a sacrify.

I certainly can see in Brian (Miaplacidus)'s
artical about scope that the best scope is the one that
you use the most.

So this will either be a short tube refractor or
a small Mak/SCT

I have read a bit about telescope and the pros and the cons
of each type.

I now would appreciate a specific information:
Please suggest a specific model of a good/higher
quality scope of either type above. Also which
brands are regarded as maker of high quality eye pieces.

If there is a model with good and reliable computerized system,
that would be a bonus ( I like the Nextar 4GT style but have
no idea if they are good )

Particularly if they are available at these local shops.
http://www.sirius-optics.com.au/
http://www.yorkoptical.com.au/
http://www.staroptics.com.au/

Much appreciate any help.
"O"

[wavelandscott (Scott)]

Can you put a bit more detail around "small and portable"?

The reason I ask is that small and portable means different things to different people...for me, if I can "fit" it into the car I call it "portable"...

While I have no specific recommendation to make (I'm a Dob kind of guy for now) I don't think I can add much more to your quest...

Good Luck in the search!

[acropolite (Phil)]

"O" , Portability is only a state of mind, but aperture is everything. Unless your mode of transport prohibits anything larger than a Nexstar 4 I would suggest that you hold off with a purchase until you have had a chance to look through a few telescopes (at night) at a local gathering. The difference in light gathering power between a 4 inch Mak and an 8 inch is enormous and an 8inch SCT or Mak will be as transportable as the 4 inch (unless you don't have a car). If GoTo is not a necessity it's worth considering a Dob as they represent the absolute maximum performance for your dollars.

[[1ponders] (Paul)]

I'd have to agree with Phil here "O". If you are after goto that is portable and still give good deepsky views then an 8" SCT/Mak would worth serious consideration. Meade LX90/LX200 (8 or 10" though the 10 is definately heavier than the 8) or Celestron in the same range. Alternatively consider an 8" Dob with an Argonavis.

Get on up to Astroron's at the next dark of the moon and you will get to try scopes from 80mm up to 400mm, refractors, Newts and SCTs.

[mickoking]

200mm Dob is good

["O"]

Thanks for the reply.

I am thinking of 80mm size refractor or
4-6" Mak/SCT type.

I simply just want to gather information at present. Definitely I
will look at more scope at different meetings if I can.

As an example, if I don't know a thing about car (and I don't :-))
and am looking to buy one, after looking at
diff. type, I am leaning toword a small sedan.
I am not interested in truck/ 4WD/ station wagon/ mini car
or anything else at present.

I would appreciated advice on specic model in this sort of this way:
(example only, as as said, I don't know much about car)

For good average popular small sedan, there is Holden Astra.

For more money, Mazda 3 is preferred by some.

For higher end car, owner of Holden Astra and Mazda3 will
likely trade their car for a BMW316.

And I definitely don't want to look at a porche or ferrari.

Are the smaller 4-6" MAK goto that bad?

Thanks
"O"

[dhumpie]

In any case from experience I say you won't be happy with anything under 6" of aperture. I have tried scopes starting from 40mm to 250mm and currently own a 80mm ST refractor, a 6" EQ newt and a 10" GS dob and can tell you that my most used scope is my grab and go 6" Vixen on a modified EQ mount (to use in alt-az mode). I had a 4" ST refractor for a while but the views were not substantially better than the 80mm. I subsequently sold it off. You really start to see good detail in DSO's (especially globulars as they are resolved, some to the core and not just smudges with some periphery stars coming through) and it has been said that the minimum size for satisfactory planetary observations starts at 6".

Just my 2 cents worth.

Darren

p/s: small scopes are great for on the whim observations but do not make great only scopes.

["O"]

Thanks, Darren, is your most used 6"Vixen referrling to " Celestron/Vixen C6 6" f/5 " ? Which model Celestron?

Paul, which is considered better brand, Meade or Celestron, and which of the Meade (LX90/LX200) is better? Can you recommend a few specific model of 80mm refractor? May be mid range and higher end model.

Will definitely try to make it to Astroron's next dark night ( if he wouldn't mind ).

Micko, as with most, I'll probably get a Dob one day :-)

Phil, I am leaning toward bigger than 6" now as you suggested ...

Wavelandscott, next time I go to viewing I'll watch closely how people carry their gears, set them up, and pack!

Thanks All, the search goes on ...
"O"

[drmorbius (Randall)]

Originally Posted by mickoking

200mm Dob is good

I'll second that! My GSO 200 was definitely good value for a newbie like me... Robby (the Dobby) and I will be together... forever

[janoskiss (Steve H)]

Another vote for the 8" Dob. All it needs is a couple of drawer handles on either side of the base to turn it into a true grab and go and a pleasure to use. If you want a computer guide then you can get an ArgoNavis for it, or there is the somewhat cheaper option to buy an Orion Intelliscope (the AN computer is reputedly better though).

[[1ponders] (Paul)]

Ahh the ol' meade/celestron debate Just think holden/ford I'm a Meade supporter to the core (with the possible exception of the Celestron 9.25 sct).

I'm not sure which OTAs the LX90s are using these days, possibly still the old type, not that there was anything wrong with them, I have the 8" and it still does the job for me. The LX200s are now "supposedly" of a Ritchey Cretien design. This would be more of a benefit for imagers than visual users. I used to have an LX200gps and I really enjoyed the simplicity of using it, I'd never used an LX90. Now the LX90 comes with GPS I don't see what the difference will be.

As for a refractor; it would take a very strong arguement to go past the Orion/Saxon ED80. This little refractor is a fantastic performing scope for image quality for its price. I've tried the similar scope in the 100mm and I wasn't quite as impressed though I didn't do any imaging through it so it's only a visual comparison.

If you have a look in the Buy, Sell and Trade there is an LX90 with a load of gear going for a very reasonable price, and it's quite handy to Brisbane.

[Ric]

I have a Celestron 8" which I have used for over 30 years, in my opinion it fell into the small/compact range and I found it very satisfying visually and photographically and was able to transport in most types of cars allthough in small cars it likes to have the back seat for itself, they even come with carry cases in those days. I now have the Meade LX200R 12" and I am also very happy with it as well. I would still consider this scope as portable although weight and size are now coming into play so it would reaching the upper limit in my books. I now own a ute so that makes it easier with the 12".

cheers

[Starkler (Geoff)]

Originally Posted by janoskiss

Another vote for the 8" Dob. All it needs is a couple of drawer handles on either side of the base to turn it into a true grab and go and a pleasure to use.

And another vote from me. If easy comfortable portability is your goal, an 8 inch scope sounds about right.

There is a huge difference in what you will see between an 8 inch and 4 inch scope. If you go small for your one and only scope it wont be long before you're wishing for something bigger. Aperture really does rule.

[dhumpie]

Hey O,

Sorry for the lack of replies. Have not been checking the site Yes my 6" is a Celestron/Vixen C6 (6" f/5 newtonian), the ones with the sliding focuser. It is a great little scope and the optics are awesome. And unlike Paul, I am a 100% Celestron supporter (sorry Paul

Darren

["O"]

Many thanks, all. After considering all advices which are very much appreciated, together with my own situation and needs, I am now leaning
toward getting an 80mm refractor first to use it to learn and familiarize myself with the sky. I just can't get pass its smaller size. ( already taken into consideration the fact that a good mount will be heavy anyway! ). I feel that just to learn about brighter objects could already keep me occupied for a long time.

The Dobs (8-10") come hightly recommended so I will probably get that 2nd for viewing of fainter object. Might just park it in the garage for backyard viewing or occasion take out. Who knows, that "later" could come very soon so I can enjoy both the refractor and the Dobs.

This decision is only based on my limited knowledge on the topic and would welcome any comments if anyone feel that this is definitely not the way to go. Please note that I could end up with BOTH. Is that a bad thing and will just be a waste of money?

Rgds,
"O"

[astroron (Ron)]

O it is not a bad thing to have two scopes I have a 16" Truss Newtonian and a 8" SCT both get used, maybe one not as much as the other,but they both have different jobs to do.
Some people have a few scopes and they all get used at different times just look at the other members signitures.

[Starkler (Geoff)]

Originally Posted by O

This decision is only based on my limited knowledge on the topic and would welcome any comments if anyone feel that this is definitely not the way to go. Please note that I could end up with BOTH. Is that a bad thing and will just be a waste of money?

I'll relate my experience to you.
I was viewing for a few years with a 10" dob and decided to get an ed80 as a second scope. I was very dissapointed at what I could see ( or couldnt see) in it. To be honest it seemed barely ahead of a pair of binoculars, and light polution really kills the usefulness of a small scope IMO.

I have since replaced the ed80 with a 130mm Vixen newt on a Porta alt-az mount. A 130mm scope isnt big, but it certainly leaves the 80 way way behind.

I strongly recommend the 8" dob as your first scope, as most people will very quickly outgrow what can be seen visually in 80mm of aperture, and likely get bored quickly. Darrens advice is good, 6 inch as a minimum to give satisfying views.

The dob can do almost everthing the 80mm can do, and do it better, and what it cant do can be done with a pair of binoculars. The same cannot be said for the reverse.

[Nordo]

"O"
When I first became interested in buying a scope, I looked at all the options like you - refractor? reflector? Goto? tracking? different mounts?
In the end "bang-for-buck" won the day, and I bought a 10" dobsonian mounted reflector (a "dob"). A got a 250GSO deluxe version from Andrews Communications which came with 4 eyepieces. The lot cost me just under $800 (I think it is $900 now). I have an old Toyota Corolla. The main tube (OTA) fits nicely across the back seat, and the base goes in the boot. An 8" would obviously cost less, and fit in virtually any small car . Assembly is just putting the tube onto the base - quicker than putting a basic refractor on a basic tripod. I will be buying some better eyepieces as I become more experienced, but it will be a LONG time before I grow out of my 10" DOB.

So far I haven't had the need for a Goto as the friendly guys at Astroron's parties just point out places for me to look at and I'm set. It's a bit different at home, and I have to struggle with my star charts and my limited knowledge of the sky. But that's half the fun. And it makes it far more satisfying when you actually locate what your looking for, or stumble across something else you weren't looking for .

[dhumpie]

I agree with all that has been said. If you can get a small grab and go and a large scope, you are all set. I have three scopes currently in my stable and I don't think I can do without any of them. For instance although I don't use my 10" dob as much as I would like, I would not part with it as it is the instrument of choice for dark sky jaunts for deep views. For quick looks at home, my Orion 80ST on photo tripod does a pretty good job (and this scope is a revelation under dark skies too!) but I prefer my 6" f/5 modified alt-az (it sits ready to go at a moments notice in the garage) and my 20x80LW. So every scope has its place. That being said the best single scope is still a 6" of larger dob....

Darren

[ving (David)]

for visual work "O" the bigger the aperture the better... if you can only afford a 80mm then get it but 6" dobs are only about $300 and one of these would blow a 80mm clean out of teh water! your bet bet tho is to go to your local astro club meetings and check out thier scopes, then you will see the difference aperture makes