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Old 30-06-2008, 07:02 AM
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astropolak (Joe)
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Canon 40d annoyances

Hi
I have a brand new Canon 40D and I am very happy with the purchase except for 2 things:

White balance is way out in both day light and artificial light shooting.
The camera defaults to a rather soft (not sharp) images.

Both of those settings are in the "Basic shooting modes" so I am unable to change those as custom functions are not available in Basic mode.

I can change the white balance and sharpness in "Expert modes" as well as post processing on a computer but I do not see why I should have to - the camera obviously is not doing the right thing.
Does anyone know what can be done to fix this? I have the latest Firmware 1.0.8.

And yes I have a good quality lens - Canon 24-105L F4
Joe
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Old 30-06-2008, 07:30 AM
Dennis
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Hmm, that’s not good news. I wonder if you may have a faulty camera body?

My fist step would be to take it back to the shop from where you purchased it, with a lens attached and CF card fitted and take some test shots with the sales person and then ask them to put the lens and CF card on one of their demo bodies and do a comparison.

Good luck!

Dennis
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  #3  
Old 01-07-2008, 08:32 AM
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astropolak (Joe)
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Thanks Dennis
I did not get many responses here...
I do not believe that this problem is isolated to my Camera as I see similar complaints from reviewers on the Net.
I guess I am looking at ways to set the White balance and sharpness parameters in Basic modes.

Joe
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Old 01-07-2008, 08:37 PM
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I've never used my 40D on stupid mode, so took my daughter and the 40D down to the park and took a few photos on stupid mode and compared them with normal mode - program, AP, SP etc.

I see what you mean... while the colour balance was OK, the images were nowhere as sharp and were generally quite overexposed and very contrasty.

By the looks, I'd say the sharpness aspect is due to different software filtering, not actually the lens focus. ... Just having a look at the images, I'd also say it has to do with the fact that in stupid mode they are saved as compressed JPGs while in normal mode they are uncompressed RAW.

As for the exposure, it might also be some weird filtering/compression artifact.

The two attached images are of a flower at about 5 metres with a Canon 17-55 f2.8 lens and enlarged at 200%. They are both jpgs - I converted the RAW to a jpg, but you can still see the difference.

I never use stupid mode as it always tries to do stupid things, like pop up the flash or set the ASA to 1600 in bright sunlight, as well as only giving jpgs.

However I'd also do what Dennis suggested - try a different lens as well as a different body.
Attached Thumbnails
Click for full-size image (Stupid mode.jpg)
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Click for full-size image (Normal mode.jpg)
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Last edited by Suzy_A; 01-07-2008 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 01-07-2008, 10:05 PM
Zuts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzy_A View Post
I've never used my 40D on stupid mode, so took my daughter and the 40D down to the park and took a few photos on stupid mode and compared them with normal mode - program, AP, SP etc.

Well from comparing your images all i can say is that stupid mode looks kinda stupid....

I have a Canon 400D and usually use it on landscape or portrait and let the camera worry about the rest, is this stupid mode or just semi stupid mode?
I really got the camera for astro stuff, when i use it in daylight i tend to treat it like my IXUS 700......

Paul
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Old 01-07-2008, 11:50 PM
Ian Robinson
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I have only taken a few snaps when I received my 40D so I will note there is a stupid default mode and avoid it .... my old XD5 has only 4 modes : autoapeture , autoexposure , flash and manual (I always used manual by preference as I think I know more about getting a camera than a camera control chip will ever know).

I can see , when I get my EF 70-200 f2.8 L IS USM and start using the 40D, I'll be on a steep learning curve (this being my digital camera of any kind).

Thanks for making me aware of this issue.

I think it is also worthwhile removing the battery from the camera when not using it, I've always done this with my XD5. Nothing worse than a battery leak inside something expensive - I found that out when it happened to my Astrosystems lasercollimator (luckily I am on friendly terms with Astrosystems and they repaired it very cheaply and made it better that it had ever been before.
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Old 02-07-2008, 07:14 AM
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You Guys talk of stupid mode, I have never seen a Canon 40 D, is this actually a setting, and if it is, Canon should be ashamed.

They obviously don't give much credit to their customers who buy their cameras, Stupid Mode, indeed.

Leon
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:18 AM
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No, there isn't a mode called "stupid"
It is just the fully auto mode. I don't use it but I have used the "sport" mode for action shots of my son kayaking. It worked very well.
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Old 02-07-2008, 09:32 AM
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astropolak (Joe)
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Now, that's better! Thank you for your responses, especially thank you Suzy_A - I treat your posts about cameras and camera optics as Gospel.

I have posted on a web site 2 images:
http://www.webbase.com.au/IMG_0203.jpg
and
http://www.webbase.com.au/DPP_0089.jpg

Top one is the Stupid mode
Lower one is the Stupid mode with post processing applied by DPP - sharpness and saturation.
This is what I complain about - if I wanted a "Happy snaps" then I would have used my crappy Sony camera, I expect quality even from Stupid or Basic modes.
Joe
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Old 02-07-2008, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astropolak View Post
Now, that's better! Thank you for your responses, especially thank you Suzy_A - I treat your posts about cameras and camera optics as Gospel.
Don't believe everything I write....

One thing that annoyed me was how the 40D manual is written - much of it is written like the user is a morron. Same with the manual for my EOS3.

I asked the guy in the camera shop if they are all like that - I said that surely if someone is going to buy a $2000 - $5000 camera they are probably serious amateurs or semi-pros or pros and already know a thing or two about cameras and need not be treated like idiots. He relied 'Nope! Lots of people come in with no idea at all and just pull out a wad of money and ask what can they get with this...'

Note here, that I'm assuming that most people on Iceinspace are not idiots (although some seem to be...) and are actually serious about their camera and astro gear, even if they don't know a lot about it initially, they are willing to learn.

Good luck with the 40D!
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Old 02-07-2008, 12:33 PM
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Terry, well that has cleared that up, like I said I have not held a 40D in my hand, and thought they surly didn't put a mode like that on the Camera's.

Leon
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Old 02-07-2008, 01:04 PM
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Hi Joe,

The reason why white blancing on the 40D as opposed to Canon's older line up 30D,20D is from their new dual filtering layer technology. The visual wavelength is entirely different to the older types hence that is why the 40D can capture more h-alpha photons than the older types unless modifying it. Taking an object with the 40D and 20D colours will be different even with the same lense/settings etc etc. Not much but just have to put up with it or use a grey card and balance the colours in manual mode
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Old 02-07-2008, 02:03 PM
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See Guys, I didn't know that either, so it always pays to go straight to the top, just ask Eric.

Leon
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Old 02-07-2008, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leon View Post
See Guys, I didn't know that either, so it always pays to go straight to the top, just ask Eric.

Leon
thanks Leon
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Old 03-07-2008, 07:15 AM
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astropolak (Joe)
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Thank you Eric for dipping into your incredible wealth of knowledge.
Yet - shouldn't the camera do the right thing in "Basic mode" photography?
I have tested the camera in all light conditions and it does not faithfully reproduce the colours in any of them. I do not see why I should use "Expert modes" just to get my colours right or sharpness that is superior to every day digital snapshot cameras. My Sony snapshot cameras that I hate so much do not have any problems getting the colours right...
Joe
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Old 03-07-2008, 07:53 AM
gmbfilter (Geoff)
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Shoot in < P > . You can adjust everything ,WB, shoot in RAW +jpg. Recently at a wedding my 13 year old daughter using my new 40D (never used a camera before 10 sec of lessons) produced better pics than anyone else there. Includind the "hired photographer",and some "keen photographer nerds. She just pointed and shot. The 40D just did its job.
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Old 03-07-2008, 09:35 AM
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I do a lot of my standard shooting in P Mode and have found it to faithfully reproduce what I expected to see.

Otherwise, I use full Manual (M) mode for the more tricky shots where I want to control specifically what part of the image should be a certain tone. I do this by spot metering on that particular area and dialling in any manual compensation, if it is too light or too dark. An example is a bird in flight photo, where the bright background sky can “fool” the meter into underexposing by a couple of stops thus recording the bird as a silhouette.

Cheers

Dennis
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Old 03-07-2008, 12:14 PM
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I usually do the same as Dennis - usually P mode and sometimes M when I want to do things with the exposure. Also sometimes AP and SP when I want specific shutter speeds or apertures but aren't too worried about the other.

I also find the P mode with the on/off/whatever-it-is switch flicked to whatever-it-is is also useful as then I can easily change the shutter or aperture to what I want and not worry about the metering.
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Old 03-07-2008, 12:21 PM
Dennis
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Yes, Suzy that is a useful function in P mode. I only wish the viewfinder display would stay on a few seconds longer. When using the main dial to select the correct pairing of exposure and f-stop, after depressing the shutter release ½ way to illuminate the settings, I often find that it doesn’t stay on long enough by the time I have worked out what I want the relative values to be.

Or maybe I need to think faster!

Cheers

Dennis
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