No success with Sirius tonight but conditions were very challenging: High cloud, impossible humidity, persistent mossies and to cap it all ABC in the background were playing very disturbing violin music. However, on a positive note, thanks to John B's suggestion I tried a 4" off centre hole on a plywood mask on the front of the scope and got a much clearer view of the Alpha Crucis binary and even managed Rigel's shy companion. Things are looking up
Looking forward to more. I myself nearly purchased the older version of that Vixen, the 140 NSS f I think it was then from AOS ; good as it was now it's much improved, and by all accounts a cracker on a vast array of objects, with its wide flat field and ample aperture Petzval design-The objectives and all made in Japan now, and the other refractor speaks for itself; still may get one, as I will be in the hunt for a large refractor soon enough.
Keep trying as your attitude and equipment are exemplary.
No success with Sirius tonight but conditions were very challenging: High cloud, impossible humidity, persistent mossies and to cap it all ABC in the background were playing very disturbing violin music. However, on a positive note, thanks to John B's suggestion I tried a 4" off centre hole on a plywood mask on the front of the scope and got a much clearer view of the Alpha Crucis binary and even managed Rigel's shy companion. Things are looking up
Hello Eugene
Glad you've finally bagged Rigel, as I think seeing and not the scope has let you down here, as for some it's not considered a major challenge in most scopes.
Great suggestion from John B also, masking has obviously helped.
Looks also like you were facing a near impossible task with all that goings on.
Meanwhile back at the ranch....nothing happening here either. Glare city for Sirius. Thought I got a brief glimpse once...not enough. Conditions I'd rate at 5/10 really light blue sky and today was quite humid. Tried all sorts of eyepieces and went as far as a 5mm ortho with 2x barlow...480x .no good at all.
To quote an old song...One of those nights...
There is always next time.
Possibly less aperture would have given a better result I've mostly had success in the early hours, which means Spring time.
Will try the 6" f12 another evening.
Meanwhile back at the ranch....nothing happening here either. Glare city for Sirius. Thought I got a brief glimpse once...not enough. Conditions I'd rate at 5/10 really light blue sky and today was quite humid. Tried all sorts of eyepieces and went as far as a 5mm ortho with 2x barlow...480x .no good at all.
To quote an old song...One of those nights...
There is always next time.
Possibly less aperture would have given a better result I've mostly had success in the early hours, which means Spring time.
Will try the 6" f12 another evening.
Yes Matt that's how it is with the PUP, you think it's there then it's not ; absolutely frustrating.
I'll wager though, that marvelous unobstructed (no diffraction spikes etc), long focal length well corrected refractor will be easier to do just this given the right conditions, as it seems you had Buckleys of doing this tonight in those conditions.
Cheers , goodluck, and hope to hear more of your reports soon.
I forgot...I did a sketch...of sorts Not quite Alex Massey quality but this is as good as I get. This is in fact my first ever sketch....probably my last
Sirius is the big one round blob, the pup is just above. E is marked so the pup is about 4 o'clock. Just the briefest of looks on this. I marked a star red as thats what it looked like...no idea what it's name/number is.
Rigel has always been a fairly easy split with my C925, so I think I should have a try at Sirius at the upcoming SVAC next month.
Good to hear you will do this also Paul.
With possibly the best type of SCT ever made, who some have compared to a Mewlon, because of its sharpness, contrast and longer focal length primary and coatings, I would expect you will have a great chance of cracking Sirius.
I think we would all hope to get a report from you, if you do or don't.
I forgot...I did a sketch...of sorts Not quite Alex Massey quality but this is as good as I get. This is in fact my first ever sketch....probably my last
Sirius is the big one round blob, the pup is just above. E is marked so the pup is about 4 o'clock. Just the briefest of looks on this. I marked a star red as thats what it looked like...no idea what it's name/number is.
I don't keep notes of what I've looked at either.
Great idea Matt. I must remember to do just this next time the seeing will permit me to have another crack at Sirius.
I tried a range of magnifications up to 360x tonight with my ED Vixen 115. No luck again.
I have been trying with lots of different telescopes since 1970 but to no avail even though Sirius is almost directly overhead here.
I have read that it is more difficult to see in humid climates, so I guess that this adds to the difficulty.
This is a direct quote from the Royal Canadian Astronomical Society website that I thought we Pup Hunters would find useful. The 'Superior Power," which I emphasized in red is obviously a reference to BigJoe
Seeing the star
There are several things you can do to increase your chances of success:
be familiar with the orientation of Sirius B relative to Sirius A in your optical system - this will tell you where to look
practice on a double star with a similar separation, but less dramatic contrast in brightness between the members - this will give you a sense of the angular separation to expect. Try practising on Rigel (β Orionis) or Almach (γ Andromedae)
the customary minimum aperture is 200mm, but some have used 100mm - can you detect it with a smaller aperture?
use a magnification of 200x-300x, and try to place the primary star (Sirius A) on the edge of or just out of the field of view
make a semicircular filter out of plastic (use a violet, or blue, or green. or red, or brown, or grey [neutral density] colour), and place it either: a) in a regular filter cell; or b) at the field stop or other accessible internal position within the eyepiece (easiest in a modular eyepiece). This half-field filter will diminish the brightness of Sirius A, while leaving the brightness of Sirius B unaffected. As an alternative, you could make a half-field occulting mask and install and use it like the filter (as is demonstrated in this video). If you are unsure about modifying your equipment, do not attempt taking apart an eyepiece for b) - try a) instead
make a hexagonal diagphram. The central opening should have the shape of a hexagon, and be as large as the aperture will allow. According to Duplessis and Souplet, the angles of the hexagonal diagphram "canalize" the brightness of the primary into "feathers", enhancing the contrast in the zones between those features. Simply position the mask so that an inter-feather zone is where the companion star should be to enhance your chances of observing it. The great E.E. Barnard (a RASC member - also see here) published a description and drawings of this most useful of DIY mods
owners of go-to telescopes (or traditional equatorial or alt-az telescopes with drives) may wish to use the drift method to find the position of Sirius B. It's simple - turn off your drive! Since the companion is fairly close to due east of the bright primary it will "follow" behind it quite closely. So as Sirius A drifts away from the centre of your FOV, Sirius B will approach it. By a rough estimate, Sirius B trails Sirius A by 2/3s of a second (of time)
allow sufficient cool-down time for your OTA, and ensure it is well-collimated
try to pick a calm night of good seeing (fortunately, our winter-wonderland of the frozen north does offer these). It is worth trying in less than optimal conditions, but in such a case remember to choose an observing location shielded from the wind. It is worth attempting the observation from light-polluted areas, provided the full moon isn't near the Sirius system
dress properly for the weather
be patient, and rest your eyes! And, to paraphrase William Herschel, "it should be remembered, that when an object is once discovered by a superior power, an inferior one will suffice to see it afterwards" (RSPT 90, 1800, 29). You won't need an 18.5" Clark to detect Sirius B, and once you see it, you'll be able to find it again with comparative ease!
This is a direct quote from the Royal Canadian Astronomical Society website that I thought we Pup Hunters would find useful. The 'Superior Power," which I emphasized in red is obviously a reference to BigJoe
Seeing the star
There are several things you can do to increase your chances of success:
be familiar with the orientation of Sirius B relative to Sirius A in your optical system - this will tell you where to look
practice on a double star with a similar separation, but less dramatic contrast in brightness between the members - this will give you a sense of the angular separation to expect. Try practising on Rigel (β Orionis) or Almach (γ Andromedae)
the customary minimum aperture is 200mm, but some have used 100mm - can you detect it with a smaller aperture?
use a magnification of 200x-300x, and try to place the primary star (Sirius A) on the edge of or just out of the field of view
make a semicircular filter out of plastic (use a violet, or blue, or green. or red, or brown, or grey [neutral density] colour), and place it either: a) in a regular filter cell; or b) at the field stop or other accessible internal position within the eyepiece (easiest in a modular eyepiece). This half-field filter will diminish the brightness of Sirius A, while leaving the brightness of Sirius B unaffected. As an alternative, you could make a half-field occulting mask and install and use it like the filter (as is demonstrated in this video). If you are unsure about modifying your equipment, do not attempt taking apart an eyepiece for b) - try a) instead
make a hexagonal diagphram. The central opening should have the shape of a hexagon, and be as large as the aperture will allow. According to Duplessis and Souplet, the angles of the hexagonal diagphram "canalize" the brightness of the primary into "feathers", enhancing the contrast in the zones between those features. Simply position the mask so that an inter-feather zone is where the companion star should be to enhance your chances of observing it. The great E.E. Barnard (a RASC member - also see here) published a description and drawings of this most useful of DIY mods
owners of go-to telescopes (or traditional equatorial or alt-az telescopes with drives) may wish to use the drift method to find the position of Sirius B. It's simple - turn off your drive! Since the companion is fairly close to due east of the bright primary it will "follow" behind it quite closely. So as Sirius A drifts away from the centre of your FOV, Sirius B will approach it. By a rough estimate, Sirius B trails Sirius A by 2/3s of a second (of time)
allow sufficient cool-down time for your OTA, and ensure it is well-collimated
try to pick a calm night of good seeing (fortunately, our winter-wonderland of the frozen north does offer these). It is worth trying in less than optimal conditions, but in such a case remember to choose an observing location shielded from the wind. It is worth attempting the observation from light-polluted areas, provided the full moon isn't near the Sirius system
dress properly for the weather
be patient, and rest your eyes! And, to paraphrase William Herschel, "it should be remembered, that when an object is once discovered by a superior power, an inferior one will suffice to see it afterwards" (RSPT 90, 1800, 29). You won't need an 18.5" Clark to detect Sirius B, and once you see it, you'll be able to find it again with comparative ease!
Thank you Eugene I love this!
And yes I'm still trying to be HUMBLE.
YES...... It's so hard being a role model now.......so very hard
Seriously though what great tips! Practised on Rigel first- Yes I did and high power -yes ; East as I said , and let it drift as Pup will follow -yes etc.
And the diagphram and mask- what a tip; Im using them next time!
Thanks guys for all the hints on how to find Sirius B. I have done the prelude of looking at viewing Rigel first to have an idea of the distance. So tonight, I am going to use my C8 Edge and see if aperture does the trick. Instead of Rigel, I intend to use Delta Gemini as my comparison star (Mags 3.6, 8.2, separation 5.8"). At least the secondaries of both stat are about the same brightness, even if Sirius itself is some 100 times brighter than Delta Gemini. (Delta G is near the Eskimo Nebular, so I will check that also.)
Here's hoping that tonight's the night to see a pup!
I tried a range of magnifications up to 360x tonight with my ED Vixen 115. No luck again.
I have been trying with lots of different telescopes since 1970 but to no avail even though Sirius is almost directly overhead here.
I have read that it is more difficult to see in humid climates, so I guess that this adds to the difficulty.
I've heard this before also too Tropo-Bob.
This makes it all the more harder for you , even though you have outstanding optics there; so good luck and keep perservering -you'll get it sooner or later- I have no doubt with your doggedness.
Joe,
However, for Joe and Double Camp Followers I found out that the excellent "Double and Mulitple Stars," by James Mullaney, is available on Kindle for a free trial period. (not to be confused with a sample few chapters); Some great chapters on viewing, equipment and anecdotes, measuring techniques, the great double hunters, plus two large and detailed sections on the best doubles. No commitment to buy.
Is this Double Star Festival never to end? Let's hope not! Eugene
In case the time poor star splitter missed it in a previous post I grabbed this link from the last on Sirius and is a great article by the famous William Herschel on his viewing techniques, with a lot on optics and light.You will need time and a cloudy night to fully absorb this. PS: you can see I am getting viewers' cabin fever
Using a C8Edge & a Tak 6mm Ortho EP, I found it, a bit further from Sirius A than I was expecting. Using Delta Gemini as a guide worked well. Delta G is like a fainter Rigel, but the secondary's magnitude is similar to the Pup so gave me a much better idea of what to look for than does Rigel.
Joe,
However, for Joe and Double Camp Followers I found out that the excellent "Double and Mulitple Stars," by James Mullaney, is available on Kindle for a free trial period. (not to be confused with a sample few chapters); Some great chapters on viewing, equipment and anecdotes, measuring techniques, the great double hunters, plus two large and detailed sections on the best doubles. No commitment to buy.
Is this Double Star Festival never to end? Let's hope not! Eugene
Looks good Eugene!
Also of course there's the Cambridge Double Star Atlas, authored by Bruce MacEvoy and Wil Tirion (FEB 2016) of which James Mullaney contributed so much to the original book and concept.
I should mention that earlier, USE OF SHORTHAND is used in describing the position of a component in a double star system; the Cardinal directions are used : North , South , West (preceding) and East (following) , as is the case with the "PUP"
This can also be broken down to north preceding etc, all of which can prove very helpful, if you want to use the field stop method etc.
But once again one MUST be careful with your orientation , VIZ : Is your image upright or inverted, or reversed East/West as in a di-electric diagonal etc.
Joe,
Is this Double Star Festival never to end? Let's hope not! Eugene
Indeed, lets hope not. Just to keep things bubbling along I have posted a new thread putting it out there to see if anyone is contributing to Sissy Haas’ Uneven Double Star Project.
Well done Bob in resolving the Pup. I am still completely cloud bound.
.no good at all.
I've mostly had success in the early hours, which means Spring time.
Not quite Alex Massey quality but this is as good as I get. This is in fact my first ever sketch....probably my last 
; so good luck and keep perservering -you'll get it sooner or later- I have no doubt with your doggedness.
Joe,
