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Old 29-09-2010, 12:09 AM
Hypnotist (Bartholomew)
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Nikon D40x for AP

Hi,

I only own a Nikon D40x and I don't want to buy a new camera for AP. I wanted to know, since I'm rather new to this all, how to use the camera for AP. What settings do I have to use etc.

Bart
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Old 29-09-2010, 05:38 AM
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Esseth (Alan)
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Awesome, i am just starting basic AP with the same camera, so we can learn together lol.

So far i have bought a IR remote, with manual exposure settings and ISO between 800-1600
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Old 29-09-2010, 10:08 AM
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mswhin63 (Malcolm)
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I notice the specs say it has PAL video out. If you can get that to produce a picture on you PC you can do planetary imaging similar to my latest work on Venus and Jupiter. I have been clouded out for moon but managed a couple in poor seeing too.

I use APT software which is only suitable for canon, maybe there is sometihing you can use for the Nikon
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Old 30-09-2010, 02:04 AM
Hypnotist (Bartholomew)
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Exclamation Nikon D40(x)

Hi,

I didn't get to many responses regarding the Nikon D40x and astrophotography, so I thought I'd start a thread here. More of you tend to read it! I was wondering how to use a Nikon D40x for astrophotography. I just want to know what I need since I'll be using it with a Celestron CGE Pro 1400 EdgeHD. How do I have to set it to take planetary and deep sky images?! Is there a program I can use with the cam etc....?
Thanks and clear skies
Bart
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Old 30-09-2010, 02:24 AM
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Octane (Humayun)
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The reason you didn't get a response is because 0.01% of astrophotographers use Nikon cameras.

Posting multiple threads isn't going to help.

Omaroo offered his assistance as he has Nikon gear. What more do you want?

You'll need a 2" T-mount and a 2" Nikon T-ring. The T-ring attaches to the camera as if it were a lens, and, goes on one end of the T-mount. The other end of the T-mount should screw into the visual back of the telescope.

You will need a camera control cable and a USB cable to download images to a laptop/computer. I have no idea what software works with Nikon cameras. Maybe Nebulosity does, by Stark Labs.

You can forget about taking planetary images with the DSLR, unless you want to capture a small blob with no detail in the middle of your image. You need to use a dedicated web cam-type camera or one of the dedicated planetary imaging systems like the Image Source DBK/DMK series of cameras for best results.

H

Last edited by Octane; 30-09-2010 at 02:43 AM.
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Old 30-09-2010, 04:55 AM
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Thanks for your help H!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Octane View Post
The reason you didn't get a response is because 0.01% of astrophotographers use Nikon cameras.

Posting multiple threads isn't going to help.

Omaroo offered his assistance as he has Nikon gear.
Screw Canon; Nikon makes wonderful cameras! I don't get why so few astrophotographers only use Canon, Nikon is just as good, if not better!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Octane View Post
What more do you want?
If Omaroo offered his assistance, why isn't he posting anything here (not that he has to but...)?

Clear skies
Bart
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Old 30-09-2010, 09:19 AM
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Octane (Humayun)
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Screw Canon? Wow, you sure are insecure. 99.99% of the astrophotographer population are nuts, then? Wake up and smell the coffee, and, perhaps do some reading on the history of DSLR astrophotography.

Canon were the first to bring a DSLR to the market, and, have led innovation in the field all along, bringing new features to each successive line (including being the first to introduce HD video in the 5D Mark II -- you may consider this a gimmic feature, but, consider that it's being used by Hollywood in new movies and TV shows), with Nikon playing catch up.

A simple web search for people's web sites who do astrophotography will reveal to you two things: 1) they use dedicated CCDs; and, 2) if they're using a DSLR, it's Canon. I have not come across a single web page, or user, who is producing world class astrophotography with a Nikon DSLR.

Edit: up until recent times, a Nikon RAW file was not a pure RAW file as it was massaged by a median pass filter before being written to card. The result of this was stars being eaten and softened. I'm quite sure the D40 and D40x were affected by this. You'll also note the colour of nebulae is vastly, vastly different, tending more to the blue/magenta end of the spectrum. I feel Canon renders hydrogen a lot more faithfully.

As for Chris not replying, you did post your thread at 3 AM. I happened to be up at the time so replied. However, I have a feeling he might not reply at all.

H

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypnotist View Post
Thanks for your help H!


Screw Canon; Nikon makes wonderful cameras! I don't get why so few astrophotographers only use Canon, Nikon is just as good, if not better!

If Omaroo offered his assistance, why isn't he posting anything here (not that he has to but...)?

Clear skies
Bart

Last edited by Octane; 30-09-2010 at 10:03 AM.
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Old 30-09-2010, 10:06 AM
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En1gma (Robert)
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I might add a few things, although I agree with H, you can still produce great results from nikon dslr camera. I am not being biased here as I have both nikons and canons

It is the unfortunate fact that canon has taken this market. A couple of reasons below
-infamous star eater plaguing nikon cameras where stars can be mistaken as noise and processed out of the raw image, - canons don't do this.
-plenty of third party support with canon cameras. E.g clip in filters, software, modifications services.

Doing some research, the one main competitor was when the d70 was around. Since then, it has gradually started to phase out.

But to answer your question, which H already answered, you need a t-ring and threaded 2" coupler. Don't bother with 1 1/4 inch as you will produce vignetting.

As you want to try planetary with your d40x, you would be limited to the moon but I can say, my nikon d40 did produce stunning moon images.

Rob
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Old 30-09-2010, 01:40 PM
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Logieberra (Logan)
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I have this cam, and have shared my learner's experience in these posts:

- http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...ad.php?t=61719
- http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...ad.php?t=59234
- http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...ad.php?t=64390

Did we not help out in this post?
- http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...ad.php?t=65414

As for you Q: 'How do I have to set it to take planetary and deep sky images?! Is there a program I can use with the cam etc....?'

- for planetary, get a Phillips webcam: http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...ad.php?t=65905

- deep sky? I normally use ISO 800, with noise reduction turned off

- software? Try OxfordEye TetherPro, the developer is very nice, and takes on board suggestions/input for future revisions.

I was in a similar position as you, I had the D40 lying around. I'm fond of the little fella, but she's no Canon 5D Mark II... Humayan knows the nitty gritty / tech specs.

And finally, you live in the US! We're on the other side of the world! Be patient with Omaroo, he's very helpful, but he's not obliged to respond, so be polite

Cheers,

Logie.

Last edited by Logieberra; 01-10-2010 at 07:03 AM.
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Old 30-09-2010, 02:13 PM
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mswhin63 (Malcolm)
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This camera has Video Output spec PAL or NTSC which I would be comfortable in saying is 30FPS possibly using liveview recording outputted. I found my video output produces MJPG how the nikon work check you manual. I tried to download it but have to be a registered Nikon camera owner.

How it is outputted I do not know but it would be similar to liveview recording on a Canon, I have been doing some imaging with my 450D on live view and it works better than my HD webcam. It is also easier to locate objects at higher magnifaction as well.

As you mentioned you do not want to buy any more equipment at least you can try it. There is another person on IIS using liveview to record planets as well.

My 450D using liveview of jupiter at I believe at 30FPS - http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/a...se.php?a=82664

Recent Venus with my 450D - http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/a...se.php?a=82661

All I need to consider is a more stable mount, better seeing an some filters.
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Old 30-09-2010, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octane View Post
Canon were the first to bring a DSLR to the market, and, have led innovation in the field all along
Ah, not quite. According to here Sony, Kodak and Nikon led the field, to be joined by others (incl Canon) later.

This doesn't say anything about the capabilities of current models of course, in particular their suitability for astrophotography. I've been a Nikon user for a couple of decades myself but proclaiming "Canon sucks, Nikon rules" is utter rubbish won't entice anyone to help out with advice.

Incidentally, I think the Nikon D40 would be better suited to astrophotography than the D40x, because of its better low-light ability and lower noise. But that's mere speculation on my part.

Cheers
Steffen.
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Old 30-09-2010, 05:49 PM
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I stand corrected, Steffen. Thanks.

H
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Old 30-09-2010, 11:52 PM
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Quote:
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Incidentally, I think the Nikon D40 would be better suited to astrophotography than the D40x, because of its better low-light ability and lower noise. But that's mere speculation on my part.
Steffen,

I thought the D40x an improvement of the D40. That would make me think the D40x is better than the D40, even for AP. Please correct me if I wrong!

Thanks
Bart
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Old 01-10-2010, 11:18 AM
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I thought the D40x an improvement of the D40. That would make me think the D40x is better than the D40, even for AP. Please correct me if I wrong!
Yes, the D40x is an improvement over the D40 - in consumer eyes. It has 10 megapixels instead of 6, and as every consumer knows, megapixels are the single most important feature of a digital camera Nikon probably thought their 6MP model would lose out next to the higher MP competition on the shelf, despite its virtues, so they bumped it to 10MP.

The fact is that the D40 sensor, albeit lower res, performs better at low light, has an overall larger exposure range and produces less noise than the 10MP sensor of the D40x. It also has an electronic shutter which makes the D40 the only Nikon DSLR (apart from the discontinued D70) with a hybrid shutter, allowing for very fast flash sync speeds. The latter is of lesser interest to astrophotographers of course

Cheers
Steffen.
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Old 02-10-2010, 12:22 AM
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Does anyone know how long my exposure times would have to be for deep sky objects?


Bart
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Old 02-10-2010, 12:32 AM
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Depends on the ISO and the light pollution of your locale.

This is where you're going to discover just how painful this telescope purchase of yours is going to be.

For any pleasing and/or meaningful results, given a focal ratio of f/11, each sub-exposure is going to have to be between 10-20 minutes each. Anything shorter and you're not going to pick up enough signal.

This is why people start on short focal length instruments, whether they be reflectors or refractors; to cut their teeth; learn the vagaries of imaging, and, once perfected, or at least on solid ground, move on to longer focal lengths.

It's like Olympic-standard smokers -- they don't start out on two packets a day; they work at it until their lungs just don't notice anymore.

H
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Old 02-10-2010, 06:00 AM
Hypnotist (Bartholomew)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octane View Post
Depends on the ISO and the light pollution of your locale.

This is where you're going to discover just how painful this telescope purchase of yours is going to be.

For any pleasing and/or meaningful results, given a focal ratio of f/11, each sub-exposure is going to have to be between 10-20 minutes each. Anything shorter and you're not going to pick up enough signal.

This is why people start on short focal length instruments, whether they be reflectors or refractors; to cut their teeth; learn the vagaries of imaging, and, once perfected, or at least on solid ground, move on to longer focal lengths.

H

H,

You might not have noticed that the EdgeHD has something very practical: Fastar with a focal ratio (whatever that is) of f/2, allowing shorter exposures (that's at least what Celestron says).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Octane View Post
It's like Olympic-standard smokers -- they don't start out on two packets a day; they work at it until their lungs just don't notice anymore.
What a strange comparison!

Regards
Bart
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Old 02-10-2010, 09:19 AM
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At f/2 (5 stops faster than f/11), the equivalent exposure would then be 15-30 seconds.

I don't know anything about Faststar or how it works.

H
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Old 02-10-2010, 10:21 AM
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Fastar capability requires the Hyperstar corrector from Starizona (it doesn't come standard). You need to order this part:

http://starizona.com/acb/HyperStar-L...P3115C773.aspx

If you go down this route you might also consider temperature compensated focusing since at F2 focus is very critical and will be effected by slight changes in temperature.

TL
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Old 02-10-2010, 10:50 AM
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T's right. At f/2, your critical focus zone is going to be in the order of 8.8 microns, which is bordering on the realms of impossibility as far as focusing by hand goes (consider that my Takahashi FSQ-106N has a CFZ of just 55 microns and I had to purchase a RoboFocus unit to do the focusing for me -- the thickness of a human hair is 100 microns). The slightest change in temperature is going to change focus.

H
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