ICEINSPACE
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Waning Gibbous 86.3%
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10-05-2018, 08:29 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 575
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Victorian Dark Site property locations
Hi Everyone,
Just wondering, if you were in a position to purchase a dark sky site, where would you acquire a property in Victoria?
What would be your criteria: - Location
- Average cloud cover
- Near national parks to protect against light pollution
- Accessibility
- Any other suggestions?
Thanks everyone
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10-05-2018, 08:36 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Kyneton
Posts: 840
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My place just out of kyneton.
Farming land 2 sides, state forest the other 2.
Behind 2x mountain ranges to shield from Melbourne pollution.
On northern slope so hidden from stray light
0.13 luminance and only an hour from northern suburbs.
....oh, and has a nice 9mx6m roll off roof obs included.
Unfortunately though not currently for sale.....unless the price is right?
Seriously though.....I’ve got some great dark skies close to melbourne and in a growth corridor so investment should increase in value. Guess I’m saying you don’t have to go too far out
Last edited by Imme; 10-05-2018 at 09:22 PM.
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10-05-2018, 11:22 PM
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Farting Nebulae
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tamleugh, Victoria, Australia
Posts: 1,383
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We spent awhile researching sites,obviously budget is a key issue! Use a dark sky map to help find a really dark place nestled between good towns like we did. And meteoblue site to confirm seeing is good.
Need to be nearish a major freeway for speedy access to Melbourne, or near train if you have plenty of time.
Above the dividing range preferred to improve cloud coverage.
Visit the property at all times to confirm suitability. If you get serious, check out all planning overlays and restrictions.
We bought in a farming area as it guarantees solitude, peace and dark skies, to put it bluntly, in the middle of f%^#n nowhere! Which we love. See my Facebook page in my Sig.
Pm me if you'd like to pop up and get a feel for what it's like in heaven. Being 20 mins from the nearest shop is either hell or heaven. Depends on your mindset.
I wish I had done this decades ago.
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11-05-2018, 12:15 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 575
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location
Hi Imme,
Your place sounds ideal for stargazing.
Can I ask do you get many clear nights on average near Kyneton?
Love to get something - just got to convince the wife the PRICE is definitely worth it
Thanks for sharing,
M11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imme
My place just out of kyneton.
Farming land 2 sides, state forest the other 2.
Behind 2x mountain ranges to shield from Melbourne pollution.
On northern slope so hidden from stray light
0.13 luminance and only an hour from northern suburbs.
....oh, and has a nice 9mx6m roll off roof obs included.
Unfortunately though not currently for sale.....unless the price is right?
Seriously though.....I’ve got some great dark skies close to melbourne and in a growth corridor so investment should increase in value. Guess I’m saying you don’t have to go too far out
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11-05-2018, 12:18 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 575
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Hi Simmo,
Yah, I have been doing the same thing but not sure of the local weather conditions for clear skies in a year.
You have definitely done more research than I.
You have brought up good points that I have not thought of when choosing a location.
Much appreciated for the invitation.
Thanks,
M11
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimmoW
We spent awhile researching sites,obviously budget is a key issue! Use a dark sky map to help find a really dark place nestled between good towns like we did. And meteoblue site to confirm seeing is good.
Need to be nearish a major freeway for speedy access to Melbourne, or near train if you have plenty of time.
Above the dividing range preferred to improve cloud coverage.
Visit the property at all times to confirm suitability. If you get serious, check out all planning overlays and restrictions.
We bought in a farming area as it guarantees solitude, peace and dark skies, to put it bluntly, in the middle of f%^#n nowhere! Which we love. See my Facebook page in my Sig.
Pm me if you'd like to pop up and get a feel for what it's like in heaven. Being 20 mins from the nearest shop is either hell or heaven. Depends on your mindset.
I wish I had done this decades ago.
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11-05-2018, 12:43 PM
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Ultimate Noob
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 6,980
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You want to get north of the Great Dividing Range as it has a better climate for astro than the south side. There are arguements for the south side in places depending on what it is you want to do. Do you prefer clear skies or better observing skies?
I bought in Heathcote because it takes a little over an hour to get to from the northern suburbs where I live and work. There are considerably more clear nights up there than in Melbourne. It is also at a higher altitude but Melbourne sometimes gets some very good seeing.
On the south side of the Great Divide is Ballarat which means that you’ll get more cloud BUT there are spots of 800-1,000m elevation which can mean better crisper skies than Heathcote at 240m or Melbourne (I’m at 70m).
I do a lot more photography than visual and most of my imaging is wider field stuff which is less seeing dependant. Heathcote works better for me than Ballarat but if i was more interested in planetary photography I’d be inclined to look at Ballarat over Heathcote.
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11-05-2018, 12:56 PM
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amateur
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Mt Waverley, VIC
Posts: 6,932
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We (older blokes (almost retired)) must consider other factors, like vicinity of markets, medical facilities, graveyards....
That's why my better half and me decided Ballarat is a place to be. Plus the prices of properties are still reasonable (for Melbourne standars)
And the LP is not that terrible either (yet).
Last edited by bojan; 11-05-2018 at 01:18 PM.
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11-05-2018, 01:14 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Kyneton
Posts: 840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m11
Hi Imme,
Your place sounds ideal for stargazing.
Can I ask do you get many clear nights on average near Kyneton?
Love to get something - just got to convince the wife the PRICE is definitely worth it
Thanks for sharing,
M11
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Hard to quantify how many clear nights really as I don't record them all.
Living on the side of a hill (it's 800m'ish at the top and my obs is at 600m) it seems I often get pretty unique weather patterns......more often than not I have some clear skies above me but if I look out to the horizon I can see cloud coming that ends up going around me. Guess it has something to do with prevailing wind from the west (where my weather comes from) hitting the side of the hill causing a higher pressure area which in turn means any approaching cloud is pushed sideways/around where I am.
This week I have imaged once (Tues night) but there have been 2 x other nights which would have been OK to I think......and we've had some crappy weather this week!
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12-05-2018, 08:28 AM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 575
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Skies
Hi Colin,
Thanks for replying. Alot of people have mentioned the same thing as well which make sense.
In terms of the sky conditions I would prefer clear skies. So frustrating in Melb with the number of cloudy nights.
I prefer visual as it would be more outreach for others.
Thanks,
M11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atmos
You want to get north of the Great Dividing Range as it has a better climate for astro than the south side. There are arguements for the south side in places depending on what it is you want to do. Do you prefer clear skies or better observing skies?
I bought in Heathcote because it takes a little over an hour to get to from the northern suburbs where I live and work. There are considerably more clear nights up there than in Melbourne. It is also at a higher altitude but Melbourne sometimes gets some very good seeing.
On the south side of the Great Divide is Ballarat which means that you’ll get more cloud BUT there are spots of 800-1,000m elevation which can mean better crisper skies than Heathcote at 240m or Melbourne (I’m at 70m).
I do a lot more photography than visual and most of my imaging is wider field stuff which is less seeing dependant. Heathcote works better for me than Ballarat but if i was more interested in planetary photography I’d be inclined to look at Ballarat over Heathcote.
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12-05-2018, 08:32 AM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 575
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Thanks
Lol, only old if you feel it Bojan
So true in regards to modern day convenience as the wife would be wanting those things as well.
Its true the prices are definetelt more reasonable in regional. Also I have no expectation that this will be like an investment property that will go up
Thanks,
M11
Quote:
Originally Posted by bojan
We (older blokes (almost retired)) must consider other factors, like vicinity of markets, medical facilities, graveyards....
That's why my better half and me decided Ballarat is a place to be. Plus the prices of properties are still reasonable (for Melbourne standars)
And the LP is not that terrible either (yet).
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12-05-2018, 08:35 AM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 575
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Thanks
Hi Imme,
Thanks for the observation report for your location. Its always better to hear it from a local experiencing the weather than average weather indicators.
One thing I never understood is how weather works and cloud forms and dissipates. Can make and break a observing session.
M11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imme
Hard to quantify how many clear nights really as I don't record them all.
Living on the side of a hill (it's 800m'ish at the top and my obs is at 600m) it seems I often get pretty unique weather patterns......more often than not I have some clear skies above me but if I look out to the horizon I can see cloud coming that ends up going around me. Guess it has something to do with prevailing wind from the west (where my weather comes from) hitting the side of the hill causing a higher pressure area which in turn means any approaching cloud is pushed sideways/around where I am.
This week I have imaged once (Tues night) but there have been 2 x other nights which would have been OK to I think......and we've had some crappy weather this week!
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12-05-2018, 08:57 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Renmark, SA
Posts: 2,980
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North of the divide is mandatory. The southerlies that are so common in SE Australia often send cloud and moisture from the southern ocean which gets backed up against the dividing range like an overflowing toilet, resulting in southern Vic's notoriously crappy climate.
The ranges cut off this cloud and moisture for the most part, resulting in rapidly increasing frequency of clear skies north of it. Driving towards Melbourne over the ranges it is borderline comical seeing the layer cloud appear and thicken as you get closer and closer.
If it were me, I'd buy a land somewhere near Mildura, very dark skies with the best likelyhood of clear skies and Mildura has just about every modern convenience. Property up there is relatively cheap aswell. Further south in the Mallee has some dirt cheap property, still dark and clear, but the place is a twilight zone. If proximity to Melbourne matters, then somewhere around Bendigo would be the way to go.
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13-05-2018, 10:05 AM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 575
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I was wondering if that was the case. I think everyone has convinced me that going North of the divide is best.
In terms of regional cities I will take a closer look at.
Hmm, never thought of Mildura. Thanks for the recommendation , time to start researching.
A lot of things I haven't even considered you have highlighted.
Thanks everyone for your help and suggestions.
m11
Quote:
Originally Posted by pgc hunter
North of the divide is mandatory. The southerlies that are so common in SE Australia often send cloud and moisture from the southern ocean which gets backed up against the dividing range like an overflowing toilet, resulting in southern Vic's notoriously crappy climate.
The ranges cut off this cloud and moisture for the most part, resulting in rapidly increasing frequency of clear skies north of it. Driving towards Melbourne over the ranges it is borderline comical seeing the layer cloud appear and thicken as you get closer and closer.
If it were me, I'd buy a land somewhere near Mildura, very dark skies with the best likelyhood of clear skies and Mildura has just about every modern convenience. Property up there is relatively cheap aswell. Further south in the Mallee has some dirt cheap property, still dark and clear, but the place is a twilight zone. If proximity to Melbourne matters, then somewhere around Bendigo would be the way to go.
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13-05-2018, 05:00 PM
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Farting Nebulae
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tamleugh, Victoria, Australia
Posts: 1,383
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Yeah Lol Mildura or southern NSW would be great for even clearer weather. And your suntan 😂. Proximity to major cities not so good though
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