Mars was difficult again, too bright I think. Saturn was blocked out by low cloud. But Jupiter was above the cloud and not too bad. I could clearly see 5 moons, and faintly see a 6th. On 480x in 10" dob. Is that even possible or would they have been stars in the background? Definitely looked like 6 moons anyway, I thought there was only 4. Anyway, got a lot of video to go through. Done one image, my best one yet of Jupiter. Even got the shadow of one of the moons on the planet. Should be able to improve on this image with a bit of time and work. This is harder than I thought it would be.
Not sure what gear you have apart from your Dob or whether you are manually tracking or using a tracking amount but rest assured with practice what ever approach you are using you will soon get better pictures of the planets. Only 4 Jupiter moons to be easily detected with your gear I think as the others are far fainter. Jupiter will have a much better window for imaging in a few months time as it approaches opposition but putting in some hours in the meantime will get you up to speed when that comes.
The only issue with improvements is that it can be hard to know when to stop so just find the level you are happy with.
There are many links on planetary imaging techniques, some of these are a bit old or may use different gear than that which you wish to use but they may give you some ideas.
Thanks all. Yes it's a manual dob, no tracking. It's hard to get the camera to focus. What I've been doing is getting the planet on the side of the eyepiece view and letting it drift into the middle, while trying to view it on the camera display. I half push the button down until I get focus, then record. Sometimes I can't get focus then start again. Problem is once I get focus, it quickly disappears out of view. So with my left hand I try and keep the telescope on target, while holding the camera with my right hand. I have a mount for the camera, but have only been using it to steady my camera holding hand.
It's a good time to practice now anyway, so that when opposition comes I won't have to waste time learning when it's good conditions. My gear isn't ideal, but it's what I've got to learn with. Maybe upgrade to something more suited one day.
I have done a little bit of drift fishing for planetary videos using a basic Dob and other scopes using a ZWO planetary camera and putting the ser files though PIPP do deal with blurred or partial captures and then AS3 and Registax 6.
Others here on this site have had some good outcomes with this method or variations thereof. It can be a bit time consuming. I found that some planetary altitudes seemed much easier than others for getting captures.
Jupiter will spend more time higher in the sky as opposition approaches. However I never balanced the scope properly or optimized smoothness of motion of the mount so I expect you can do much better.
When the moon is out it makes an easier target for an initial focus.
Last edited by foc; 11-02-2020 at 08:43 PM.
Reason: Added focus help
It's a good time to practice now anyway, so that when opposition comes I won't have to waste time learning when it's good conditions. My gear isn't ideal, but it's what I've got to learn with. Maybe upgrade to something more suited one day.
I'm a firm believer in doing what you can with what you have & you are doing very well with some very tough challenges.
I assume you are taking the images through an eyepiece (known as afocal) using a small digital camera, is that correct?
Yes that's right, my camera is an Olympus 1030 SW. Just a small digital camera. I'm trying to take photos through the eyepiece (afocal). I have thought about getting a better camera, like a Canon/Nikon DSLR, but not sure if it would work. You can mount them with a T adapter, but wouldn't you then lose all the magnification by not having an eyepiece?
I've read that they can be hard to get to focus too. But if a DSLR would be better I think I'd get one.
I think you might want to keep doing afocal photography until you have read some more background info or gone to a star party to see the many options on gear.
It can get expensive when you start doing other things as sooner of later you will want a tracking mount or a new telescope tracking mount combination and quite possibly that will just be the first of several sets of gear you buy.
But putting aside my initial advice of not rushing in, if you are looking to spend some money on a camera
For the price of a cheap or used DSLR you can get Planetary camera that would operate in conjunction with a laptop. You would then have a full size image on the laptop to help with focus as well. For example the ZWO 1120mc for about $280 or a more top of the range 1224 MC for $400 (MC are color MM versions are black and white) from an on-line order from Bintel in Sydney or likely a SA astro supplier or perhaps the used market on this forum. Such a camera with high speed video will be much better for dealing with shakes from your Dob, would fit into even a 1.25 inch fitting and you would not lose magnification and if you eventually get a guided tracking mount (say a HEQ5pro for a modest sized telescope or a Mak/Cat bought withits own tracking mount) you can still use the ZWO1120mc
On the flip side,
although you would have comparable or higher magnification images and could get better images after you process the video, the small size of the chip means that getting the planet on the chip with an unguided Dob is very tedious and inefficient. I have done it with an unguided Dob but my results tended not to be as good as I obtained with a smaller Cat/Mak on a tracking mount which gave me much longer captures. With more effort than I put in, better results can be obtained so you can do it but you will wish for a tracking mount eventually.
Also unlike a DSLR a dedicated planetary camera would not be very effective for imaging stars and most DSOs and your non-astro interests. So it also depends on your interests. You can have a lot of fun photographing star fields and large nebula with a DSLR/mirrorless, a few lenses or a tiny refractor and a cheap star tracker.
DSLRs can be used to image the planets and there are some top images done this way using tracking mounts. I have not used one with a reflector and I am not sure how easy it would be to get them to focus using a Dob, you might need a 2 inch barlow, someone other than me would have better info on this. Again this is done using video so ideally you would get a Canon (used ones appear here sometimes...a 60 vintage one would work) for the much better video unless you are buying a top of the range and very new camera from the other brands.
I have seen some nice pictures of DSOs taken on Dobs with DSLRs/ mirrorless cameras so that is feasible but whether it is your best path I am uncertain.
I'll second Ross's comments, all very good advice & as he says, this can all get really expensive very quickly....
I think how you are progressing at present is just fine; you can spend all you want on different cameras, this filter, that gadget or whatever & not necessarily make any huge leap in quality of image necessarily....
The biggest challenge you face at present is a non-tracking telescope... doesn't matter if it's a dob, refractor, SCT or whatever... you are going to experience difficulties obtaining razor sharp images no matter what camera you use or what method you use for capture.
However, that doesn't mean you should abandon what you are doing as hopeless, you are producing some images & I imagine, are quite pleased with what you have accomplished so far (as you should be). Each image you have posted is better than the last one so, you are making progress which is great.
I don't know which 'holder' you were referring to but, you may wish to consider something like this:
Although, not necessarily this one... have a look on eBay, they can be obtained for considerably less money. You may find this assists you in managing your camera & your mount by freeing up a hand...
Something else you might try is zooming in the image on your camera to try & get a sharper focus perhaps; you could try using a bhatinov mask on a bright star to use the spikes it produces to adjust focus but, this may prove a lot trickier when you are trying to manage a non-tracking mount & afocal imaging so, might not be beneficial to you... If you are interested in giving a bhatinov mask a go, have a look on eBay, there is a chap in Melbourne who 3d prints them & they cost between $12 - $16 posted which is pretty cheap compared to those commercially available.
I would just keep persisting with what you are doing & keep looking to refine how you are doing things; experiment a little, try different things, you will soon see whether they help or not... You will ultimately reach the limits of what you can achieve with a non-tracking mount & afocal imaging but, wait til you've travelled along the path a little further, decide what standard of images you are happy with (or not) & then, whether you want to take it further & in what direction. When you have reached that decision point, then you start asking questions about what do you need to get to next level.. & it's probably going to start with at the very least a tracking mount possibly even heading down the Equatorial mount road, depending on what you want to do...
Again, I think you are doing quite well with what you have & I would encourage you to keep going with what you have, keep posting your images & just push it as far as you can go with what you have...
Thanks Ross and Carlton, great advice and much appreciated.
I think I'll keep doing what I'm doing, see how it goes, and hopefully improve a bit. It's good fun anyway.
The camera mount I have is basically the same as that one, but a different brand. It wouldn't work with the bigger eyepieces and barlow, but I fixed that by making a simple adapter plate. The idea is good, but it's not rock steady when you have to move the whole telescope to stay on target. You end up getting a shaky video just like when I hold it by hand. Also harder to find the planet when the camera is mounted. But it is good to support my camera hand on it.
I made a counterweight to stop the scope slipping when the planets are very low in the sky. Just tied a small bag of lead weights around the end with string. I can add or remove weights to get the balance right. Seems to work and didn't cost anything. Doesn't seem to be a problem when the planets are higher up and the angle of the telescope is more upright.
Here's another pic from the same morning as the other one. I took 76 videos that morning, most were no good, but some were OK. The shadow from one of the moons is on this one too. I was hoping for the great red spot, but I got a moon shadow instead! Interesting surprise. Also one of Venus I took in the bushfire smoke haze, with a green moon filter as well to try and dim the brightness down a bit:
Thanks Nik, yes lots of great info here. Out of interest I looked up which moon would have caused the shadow at the time I took the photo- looks like it was Ganymede.
Got up early this morning and it was very foggy and dewy. Waited a couple hours and it cleared enough to be not too bad. Not perfect, but I wanted to have a go because I found a GRS predictor online and wanted to see if it was accurate. It was, I got my first views and pics of the great red spot. Much better than just hoping to catch it by chance.
For some I held the camera by hand, then I switched to using the camera mount- and after this morning's session I can say that the camera mount was far better.
Also got my best Saturn to date.
Coming along nicely Nick. Just remember that your views and consequently your images will get clearer as the months progress. At their current elevation you are looking through a large amount of atmosphere to see them. The closer to the zenith they get, the less atmosphere you’re looking though. Keep up the good work
Thanks Ryan, yes they are pretty low still but every morning they rise about 3 minutes earlier. It will be interesting to see how much clearer the views get by July. The other thing I've learned is that the conditions are very important. Sometimes it looks good, but there's high level cloud. Other times I've struck some heavy dews which were no good at all. And this morning was rain and cloud. Hard to get the right conditions when the red spot is there, in the hour or 2 before it gets too daylight. Just have to keep trying. Pics of probably my best Jupiter and Saturn so far:
There's probably a few tricks people here can pass on to get better images but you're off to a good start.
