New Canon full frame mirrorless camera

[gregbradley]

Canon has just announced a new full frame mirrorless camera with new lenses available.

https://www.canonwatch.com/

It appears to be the same 5D4 sensor with on sensor phase detect autofocus points added. But it may well have excellent image quality.

Articulated 2.1 mp screen, 3.7 megapixel electronic viewfinder, world's fastest AF system plus AF that works in very dim light with an F1.2 lens.


Its the first Canon camera I have seen for a long time I am interested in. I think they have done a good job here.


Nikon also has released 2 full frame mirrorless cameras as well boasting basically Sony sensors 24.5mp and 45.7mp and lots of features. Notably built in intervalometer and time lapse.


Panasonic is releasing a full frame mirrorless on Sept 26 so a lot is happening in camera world at the moment. Fuji is releasing a sensation XT3 with up to 30 frames per second no blackout.

Sony is about to release a high end APSc mirrorless and has a new version of its low light A7Siii soon to be released.

Sony has had this mirrorless full frame market to itself for the last 5 years and has taken a lot of market share of both Canon and Nikon. Canikon seems to be mainly making sure the defections are stopped with these releases.

Whilst neither seems to have really topped Sony's models particularly (in some regards yes and others no) they all seem like intriguing and interesting cameras.

We are lucky to be spoilt for choice. If you have never used a high end mirrorless camera be prepared to not use your DSLR again. Some like the optical viewfinders and have big hands and like the large form factor but many get hooked on the electronic viewfinder and all the benefits it brings.
Plus the small size and light weight (easier on light portable mounts for nightscapes).

Greg

[JA]

Thanks for the info Greg. It's nice to see the race continue....
I also found this review of the New Canon for info:
https://www.dpreview.com/news/498583...debut-of-eos-r

Best
JA

[kencas (Ken)]

About the only thought that popped out to me was that natively it will use the new RF mount for which there are not yet any adapters available in the market (that will also need take into account the shorter flange-sensor distance), but then to use current market EOS T Mount rings you would also need to purchase the new EF-EOS R Mount Adapter. Which makes it up to about a 5DIV depth...

[JimsShed (Jim)]

I love my Sony a6000 but the downside has been the lack of software integration such as BackyardEOS that the canon users get to use. I would expect that software will work on the new Canon mirror less range as well.

[JA]

Originally Posted by JimsShed

I love my Sony a6000 but the downside has been the lack of software integration such as BackyardEOS that the canon users get to use. I would expect that software will work on the new Canon mirror less range as well.

Hi jim,
Check out digicamcontrol software it's free to download and supports many of the Sony cameras. See their supported cameras list it includes many of the alpha series.

Best
JA

[skysurfer]

Originally Posted by kencas

About the only thought that popped out to me was that natively it will use the new RF mount for which there are not yet any adapters available in the market (that will also need take into account the shorter flange-sensor distance), but then to use current market EOS T Mount rings you would also need to purchase the new EF-EOS R Mount Adapter. Which makes it up to about a 5DIV depth...

Huh ?
There are *three* adapters available.
https://www.dpreview.com/news/062818...able-for-eos-r
The simplest costs US$99.

There is no price quoting yet in shopbot.com.au or priceme.com.au.

And all three mount EF lenses with full functionality, so mounting an EF / T mount adapter on a telescope will work as well (except AF obviously).
One version allows popping in filters, which can be used for Ha / OIII / CLS 48mm (2") filters for *all* EF lenses and telescopes + T ring. These filters are far cheaper and more available than the Astronomik XL clip-in filters.

[gregbradley]

Originally Posted by kencas

About the only thought that popped out to me was that natively it will use the new RF mount for which there are not yet any adapters available in the market (that will also need take into account the shorter flange-sensor distance), but then to use current market EOS T Mount rings you would also need to purchase the new EF-EOS R Mount Adapter. Which makes it up to about a 5DIV depth...

Canon sells 3 different types of adapters, one plain, one with a customisable control ring and one with that plus a drop in filter slot.

As far as adapters for others lenses not sure what you would need. Nikon has its own FF mirrorless now with their Z models, Sony lenses will not fit on the Canon as it has a shorter flange distance.

Lenses with EF mounts from 3rd party should work fine.

Greg

[gregbradley]

Originally Posted by kencas

About the only thought that popped out to me was that natively it will use the new RF mount for which there are not yet any adapters available in the market (that will also need take into account the shorter flange-sensor distance), but then to use current market EOS T Mount rings you would also need to purchase the new EF-EOS R Mount Adapter. Which makes it up to about a 5DIV depth...

Originally Posted by skysurfer

Huh ?
There are *three* adapters available.
https://www.dpreview.com/news/062818...able-for-eos-r
The simplest costs US$99.

There is no price quoting yet in shopbot.com.au or priceme.com.au.

And all three mount EF lenses with full functionality, so mounting an EF / T mount adapter on a telescope will work as well (except AF obviously).
One version allows popping in filters, which can be used for Ha / OIII / CLS 48mm (2") filters for *all* EF lenses and telescopes + T ring. These filters are far cheaper and more available than the Astronomik XL clip-in filters.

Good point I didn't think of narrowband lenses although I don't think they would be useful on a non modded camera.

Greg.

[Camelopardalis (Dunk)]

Originally Posted by gregbradley

Good point I didn't think of narrowband lenses although I don't think they would be useful on a non modded camera.

This raises an interesting point, regarding unmodded cameras.

Canon cameras have typically cut out a lot of Ha.

I’ve been having fun doing wide angle shots with a Fujifilm for a while now and their UV/IR cut is a lot more generous with letting the Ha through.

I can’t speak about Sony or Nikon as I’ve never used them.

It’s possible (maybe unlikely) that the new Canons use a different pass band profile than their DSLRs.

Certainly an exciting time for new cameras, especially with the potential super fast lenses promised, and it’ll be interesting to see how they fare for astro.

[netwolf]

Of those announced so far the best value seems to be the XT-3 , I have a FX D600 Nikon but the mirrorless Z6/Z7 is first gen and still has to be proven. As does the Canon R. Will be interesting to see what Panasonic announce later this month rumours indicate a FX mirrorless. Lots of choices and hope the competition also moves prices down a bit. Fuji film XT-3 seems to be best value at the moment. Is there a software like BYEOS BYN for Fuji?

[skysurfer]

Originally Posted by Camelopardalis

This raises an interesting point, regarding unmodded cameras.

Canon cameras have typically cut out a lot of Ha.

I’ve been having fun doing wide angle shots with a Fujifilm for a while now and their UV/IR cut is a lot more generous with letting the Ha through.

I can’t speak about Sony or Nikon as I’ve never used them.

It’s possible (maybe unlikely) that the new Canons use a different pass band profile than their DSLRs.

Certainly an exciting time for new cameras, especially with the potential super fast lenses promised, and it’ll be interesting to see how they fare for astro.

Modern DSLRs like this EOS R, but also the EOS 6D (even the original one) don't need modding anymore. With post processing the weak Halpha signal can easily be stretched to view the red nebulas easily. I have at least that experience with my 6D and the EOS R sensor should be better.

Check the www.clarkvision.com site.

[kencas (Ken)]

Originally Posted by skysurfer

Huh ?
There are *three* adapters available.
https://www.dpreview.com/news/062818...able-for-eos-r
The simplest costs US$99.

There is no price quoting yet in shopbot.com.au or priceme.com.au.

And all three mount EF lenses with full functionality, so mounting an EF / T mount adapter on a telescope will work as well (except AF obviously).
One version allows popping in filters, which can be used for Ha / OIII / CLS 48mm (2") filters for *all* EF lenses and telescopes + T ring. These filters are far cheaper and more available than the Astronomik XL clip-in filters.

Yep - I knew that there are going to be three new RF-EOS adapters, so mounting existing T mounts will work. That's what I said.



But what I was alluding to was that there is not yet a native RF T mount available!



And in using the advertised adapters you are not *actually* going to gain any advantage over that of a 5DIV or 6DII since the subsequent flange mount to sensor plane distance is not going to change with said RF-EOS adapters. You are still going to hang an expensive camera requiring the purchase of yet another adapter (and possibly additional extenders to reach prime focus) at the end of the focusser.



Once vendors start making RF mount T adapters then that would be good as it would be very much like the other mirrorless solutions.

[gregbradley]

For mounting on a telescope yes it will need a T mount but the existing T mount would still fit on the EF adapter that sells with the EOS R.

2 adapters would not be ideal though but it would work. I can't imagine it will take long for a bunch of T mount adapters becoming available on Ebay for the EOS R.

I am not sure EOS R offers much over other Canon models for telescope imaging though. There would be a lot of much cheaper alternatives.

Interestingly I saw a very strong Ha image of the American Nebula on DPR recently using a Sony A7iii which is a very good camera at a low price. The star eater noise filter is much weaker on that model.

Greg.

[skysurfer]

Originally Posted by gregbradley

For mounting on a telescope yes it will need a T mount but the existing T mount would still fit on the EF adapter that sells with the EOS R.

2 adapters would not be ideal though but it would work. I can't imagine it will take long for a bunch of T mount adapters becoming available on Ebay for the EOS R.

As long as these mounts fit well without any play it won't be a problem.
But surely, in the near future tere well be Chinese vendors on ebay offering an RF/T or RF/M42 (the often used Praktica thread mount for many older lenses used in AP) or RF/FD (the old pre-1988 Canon mount) adapters.
AF won't work obviously, but light metering should theoretically work with a non-official lens (as a 6D does correct light metering with a telescope or even a toilet roll + spectacle glass mounted on it), unless Canon blocks out light metering when a non-Canon lens is mounted.

But expensive body ? Well, the EOS R body + EF-RF adapter is barely more expensive than a 6DII body.

If I need a new DSLR now while having a bunch of EF lenses, I'd rather buy an R than a 6DII (actually an R is a 6DIII as it is an 'entry level' full frame DSLR from Canon, despite having a 5DiV sensor).
But my 6D1 still works well.