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Old 26-10-2016, 11:35 AM
mickzoey (Michael)
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Newie looking for portable telescope

Hi,

I know this has been asked a few times and the 8" dob is highly recommended for beginners however I have a back injury and I am unable to lift a complete dob and move it around.

I also have limited storage space so I am looking for a telescope that I can easily store in the garage when not in use and I also want to be able to take it with me when I go camping but I know I'll have to compromise.

Looking to be able to view planets in enough detail to make out features but also see DSO.

I have set a budget of about $700.

I have seen a skywatcher 150x750 reflector with an eq3 mount. Is this a good one to suit the above criteria?

Any recommendations?

thanks
Michael
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Old 26-10-2016, 11:53 AM
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dannat (Daniel)
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yep the 6" reflector should be fine, what price is the store/person asking

I personally find a 150 reflector too big for camping , but depends on what vehicle how god a setup you have

andrewscom have the GS-530 6" f/6 OTA A$299, if you can find a secondhand mount to put it on
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Old 26-10-2016, 12:24 PM
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sil (Steve)
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Michael, a stroke limited my physical capabilities with my scopes. I ended up getting a couple of tripod dollies (like these , not endorsing vendor in any way) so instead of having to carry gear outside, I have some scopes set up with covers in my garage on these dollies and i can easily wheel them outside with ease. Such a solution may be of help for you. I bet dob owners use something similar (board and wheels from bunnings?) to save their backs.
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Old 26-10-2016, 02:25 PM
mickzoey (Michael)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dannat View Post
yep the 6" reflector should be fine, what price is the store/person asking

I personally find a 150 reflector too big for camping , but depends on what vehicle how god a setup you have

andrewscom have the GS-530 6" f/6 OTA A$299, if you can find a secondhand mount to put it on
The 150 reflector is $699 at Andrews Communications. I drive a vitara so fitting it in shouldn't be an issue.

I'll have a look at the scope you suggested.

The camera dolly the other poster suggested might work too. Definitely something to think about.
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Old 27-10-2016, 08:29 PM
AEAJR (Ed)
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I am sure that scope would serve you well. Note that EQ mounts have a reputation as being complex for new users. Will you have someone to help you learn how to use it?

When I think travel scopes I tend to lean more to refractors and, unless you specifically want an equatorial mount, Altaz are more intuitive for new users.

I might suggest you consider this Sky watcher 120X600
http://www.sirius-optics.com.au/tele...telescope.html

Much more compact. Optical tube is 4 KG. includes slow motion controls and refractors don't need collimation.

Because of the center obstruction on a Newtonian reflector I would think this 120 mm refractor would give you similar views to the 150 reflector. And refractors are often spoken of as the preferred design for planets.
http://www.sirius-optics.com.au/tele...telescope.html

If you are going camping and might like to use the scope for daytime use a refractor is a better choice. The package includes a 45 degree correct image angle which is what you would want for daytime use. The reflector would not be suitable for daytime use.

I am not sure if this 45 degree is in addition to a 90 degree star angle. 45 degrre is fine for daytime use but not what I would want for astronomy. Check to see if a 90 is included. If not you would probably need to add a 90 degree for astronomy.


Note that your reflector is a 750 mm FL. This refractor is 600 mm FL. Makes them very compact for travel. They will provide fairly wide views for DSOs. However planet hunters seem to be looking for longer focal length telescopes most of the time.

Not saying you can't use these on planets. I have a 80 mm/400 mm FL refractor that I use on planets but that is not its optimum use. Just raising this for consideration. The SCTs and Maks are typically in the 1500 to 2000 mm FL range.

Other than size and weight I don't know why you selected what you did so I am just raising things for your consideration before you spend your money.

Last edited by AEAJR; 27-10-2016 at 08:39 PM.
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Old 28-10-2016, 04:55 PM
mickzoey (Michael)
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Thanks for the detailed response Ed. I was looking at the reflector because the from my research they are the same as the dobsonian which people recommend for beginners. The refractors add another option to consider. It's probably going to be easier to carry around than a reflector although majority of time the telescope will be used at home.
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Old 29-10-2016, 12:53 AM
AEAJR (Ed)
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Cool

Why do people recommend the Dobsonian? Let me explain because I think it may not be clear.

There are 3 parts to the thing we call a telescope.
  • The optical tube assembly, OTA which is the part that gathers the light. Typically this is a Newtonian reflector, a refractor or a catadioptic (SCT, Mak or other) which is a combination of reflector and lenses.
  • The eyepiece, the part that focuses and magnifies the image
  • The mount which holds the OTA.

When we talk about a Dobsonian we are not talking about the OTA, we are talking about the mount that was developed by John Dobson . It is an altAz type mount that sits on the ground on a turntable. It is inexpensive to make and very stable. Those two characteristics are what make it so popular.

The fact that most, but not all dobsonian systems are based on the Newtonian OTA can lead people to think that Dobsonian means a Newtonian telescope, but that is incorrect.

You can find refractors on Dobsonian mounts too. These are mostly table top units, but they share the same benefit of being very stable and inexpensive because the mount is cheap to make but very stable. And there is no reason you could not put an SCT or a Mak on a dob mount.

One of the downfalls of inexpensive telescope systems is that the mounts are weak or overloaded, to keep the cost down. They wobble and shake and don't aim well because of it. So you put a very good OTA on a poor mount and you have a bad telescope. Often this is the issue with the "department store" telescopes.

A common Dob might consist of an 8" 1200 mm FL Newtonian OTA weighing 20 pounds/9 Kg. This is a great OTA and can be put on a dobsonian base fairly inexpensively. Put that same OTA on a tripod mount of similar stability and the cost could double. Same OTA but different mount.

The OTA that you are looking at is a 750 mm reflector. Why the shorter FL? Partly because putting a 1200 mm reflector on a tripod altaz or equatorial or even a GoTo would mean that that mount would need to handle a lot more weight and therefore be much more expensive.

There are optical and physical reasons one might want to work with a shorter FL Newtonian but the fact that a 750 is lighter than a 1200 is certainly part of the reason.

I hope that helps.


So, as you decide what you want as your first telescope I would suggest the following points of consideration.
  • Where will you store it and how will you move it to the observation location? If it is too much trouble to set-up you won't use it.
  • How much weight can you comfortably handle? I selected my 8" Dob at 42 pound vs. a 10" at 60 pounds strictly based on the weight and I am very pleased with my decision.
  • What are you light pollution conditions? Will you be able to view from home or will you need to load your scope in the car to use it? How big is your car?
  • How will you find your targets? Are you looking forward to working with charts and such to plan out star hops or will you want a Goto or a Pushto system? Do you use a GPS in the car or do you plan out your trips with paper maps?
  • What do you want to see? Everything of course!
  • What is your budget? Discussing telescopes without a budget in mind is useless. What constitutes a beginner scope is driven by budget, not technology.

After you answer these, then look at the technologies that will give you what you want within the budget you can afford. You can get a lot more aperture for your dollar on a dobsonian mount than any other mount and that is why they are so popular. But that might not be the right choice for you.


That is how I approach these things and how I recommend you approach it. Telling you to get an 8" dob without knowing the answer to these questions is a disservice to you. I have an 8" Dob, but it was not my first telescope. My first scope was an 80 mm refractor on a Goto mount. And my 8" Dob is also computer assisted.

Last edited by AEAJR; 29-10-2016 at 01:19 AM.
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  #8  
Old 12-11-2016, 07:09 PM
Sol-Skysailor (Sol)
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Hi Michael,

Hope this is helpful info to check out, for its own logic ie don’t base things on my shared back-careful personal experience and opinion.

Instead of limiting ‘scope size, I use wheels and aids to expand my choices.

Before buying my ‘scope I spent time seeing several at societies, stores and used/lifted/transported some.

I found that a good EQ with weights can be heavy. Mounting a tube on it can be MORE challenging than putting (placing, locating) it on a Dob. mount. A good EQ is much more expensive than a Dob. base, but please check.

Wheels, rollers, pulleys, sliders, ramp, car-loader are fun to make into contraptions for reducing back strain. A solid 2-position dolly is so general purpose, everyone should have one. IF necessary, timber poles, secured to a roof rack, can provide a point for pulleys. I made a tray with 3 castor wheels (with brakes!) and bolt legs - Real easy (not even the lifting with wheel barrow style handles) for home use.

(BTW. Only for ideas what the future could hold or what second-hand could buy…. If with time and skills, check out Albert Highe’s book how to fashion portable ‘scopes. He stated that he uses a wheelchair. His engineering approach makes great reading.)

(BTW. Personally, although a firm fan of refractors, and have one, after all is said and done I'd go for aperture first for general observing. My main ‘scope is a 10” solid tube f/ 5 reflector on a Dob mount, which is as big (aperture) as is practical for me plus wheel-y aids, and for other various factors as Ed described. Not aiming for imaging (read reviews 'Don't' I think probably by Ed Ting), I would prefer an f/ 6, as my wheel-y things etc allow me a longer tube, but none available new for price.)

Lastly, in the budget I’d allow for other ‘stuff’.
For me they were a Telrad and a laser collimator (this latter an easy way out for now –has its own issues), given that my Bintel one came with good eyepieces, a Barlow, a right angle correct image finderscope (reposition to reduce strain). And I made simple things like dew shields, covers, straps. And my own adjustable-height observing chair…..Watch your back there!!!

Cheers
Sol
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  #9  
Old 12-11-2016, 09:20 PM
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AstralTraveller (David)
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There has been a lot of good advice so far. My two cents.

I have a 150mm f/8 frac and like it, though it is a beast. After coming from newts the colour on the frac is noticeable. A Baader Fringekiller helps but there is still a bit of blue on the lunar limb. I expect there to be more false colour in an f/5. A 45 degree diagonal is useless for astronomy. You will need a good 2" diagonal.

Achieving good focus with the stock focusser was always difficult due to tube shake. The shorter tube will be an advantage there but on the other hand my mount is more solid. Initially I added a motor drive to the stock focusser but after after a few years gave up and upgraded to a motorised Moonlite. New scope! On the other hand, the more rigid mounting on my 250mm dobs means that the stock focusser is fine.

A 150mm scope gathers 1.5625x more light than a 120mm scope. Allowing for the secondary and slightly greater light loss you would still have >1.4x times as much light with the newt. However the generally better baffling of the frac vs the stock newt will narrow that gap - especially around light pollution. Of course improving the baffling of the newt is easy and cheap (says he who hasn't done it yet ).

You need to learn to clean and collimate newts. Neither task is difficult but it is a skill you need to learn. Solid tube newts will hold collimation if just moved about the house but after a road trip they generally need a bit of adjustment. After a few years a newt will need re-aluminising, which will cost a few hundred. If you then get an overcoat added you can expect at least a decade before it needs to be done again. Well, that's what I'm hoping - mine was done last year.

Happy decision making! But whatever you choose, just enjoy the scope.
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  #10  
Old 14-11-2016, 10:26 PM
mickzoey (Michael)
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Thanks everyone for all the great advice. After discussing it with my wife, we had to reduce the budget because we decided to start building our house earlier than initially planned. in the end we got a 6" dob. To carry it around I'm removing the OTA and moving it as 2 pieces but will build or get some trolley for it.

The sky finally cleared enough tonight to see the moon and some planets. We have both been bitten by the bug. I can see this becoming more addictive.
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Old 06-12-2016, 02:32 AM
AEAJR (Ed)
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How is your new Dob working out for you?

Any problem moving it around? I keep my 8" Dob on a cart in the garage.
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Old 09-12-2016, 10:16 AM
mickzoey (Michael)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AEAJR View Post
How is your new Dob working out for you?

Any problem moving it around? I keep my 8" Dob on a cart in the garage.
So far haven't used it much but when I had to move it I got assistance from my wife or I removed the OTA from the base and moved them separately.

Happy with the purchase though
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Old 27-12-2016, 11:06 PM
Emc2 (Jon)
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I have not read the whole thread, but have you considered a Celestron C90?
Really hard to beat when it comes to portability! They even come with a small backpack.
90mm of aperture is quite good without too much weight and the optical design minimises the volume too.
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