Australia Day attended by growing controversy

[skysurfer]

Interesting article about Australia Day (now it is one day after).

https://www.theguardian.com/australi...or-date-change

[AussieTrooper (Ben)]

Changing the date implies that the act of settlement that began Australia in its current form on that date was a mistake.
If people honestly believe that it was, then their best course of action is to leave, and hand over any land they own to Aboriginies.
Remaining on land that you claim was 'stolen/invaded' whilst criticising that exact thing, is totally hypocritical.

[AussieTrooper (Ben)]

Yep.

[Nath2099]

The Aborigine's probably think it was a mistake. That's the whole point.

[PhilTas (Phil)]

Totally agree, Matt,
There are far more important issues to consider than small scale diversions like this. Changing the date is symbolic at best, and will not improve quality of life for anyone in Australia, indigenous or otherwise.

[casstony]

The date probably doesn't matter to most Australians provided it's still a day off work, so why not change it to avoid offending indigenous Australians?

[Nath2099]

Originally Posted by casstony

The date probably doesn't matter to most Australians provided it's still a day off work, so why not change it to avoid offending indigenous Australians?

My thoughts exactly. Then they can join in. Even better, make it the last Friday in whatever month, then it's guaranteed to be a long weekend.

[Larryp (Laurie)]

Leave it where it is!
Warren Mundine advocates January 1st since that is the date we achieved federation. I can understand his point, but we might as well scrap Australia Day altogether, as no-one would bother celebrating again after New Year's Eve.
And I cannot think of any other potentially appropriate dates.

[Nath2099]

June 7th, April 15th, May 9th, September 25th... who cares.I really don't see why it's such an issue. Change the bloody date and move on with more important things.

[AstralTraveller (David)]

Originally Posted by AussieTrooper

Changing the date implies that the act of settlement that began Australia in its current form on that date was a mistake.
If people honestly believe that it was, then their best course of action is to leave, and hand over any land they own to Aboriginies.
Remaining on land that you claim was 'stolen/invaded' whilst criticising that exact thing, is totally hypocritical.

It's a fact that 26/1/1788 was the beginning of an invasion, dispossession and genocide. We can't change that but we also can't unscramble the egg. Whites can no more leave Australia than the Celts can uninvade Britain or white Americans return to Europe. We can't change the past but neither should we deny it; we have to make the best of situation we have before us. If that means moving the date then so be it. And don't forget that from the white perspective 26 Jan 1788 was hardly covered in glory: people carted half way around the world and dragged ashore in chains for, generally, petty economic crimes committed by people desperate to survive in an inequitable and dysfunctional economy.

My biggest problem with moving the date is finding a viable alternative. Unfortunately federation occurred on 1 Jan, which is not a day for another holiday. It can't be a sporting or military commemoration. So I'm a bit stumped. Any suggestions??

[AussieTrooper (Ben)]

Originally Posted by AstralTraveller

It's a fact that 26/1/1788 was the beginning of an invasion, dispossession and genocide. We can't change that but we also can't unscramble the egg. Whites can no more leave Australia than the Celts can uninvade Britain or white Americans return to Europe. We can't change the past but neither should we deny it; we have to make the best of situation we have before us. If that means moving the date then so be it. And don't forget that from the white perspective 26 Jan 1788 was hardly covered in glory: people carted half way around the world and dragged ashore in chains for, generally, petty economic crimes committed by people desperate to survive in an inequitable and dysfunctional economy.

That bad things happened in the past is not in question. That Aborigines are far better off now they were in 1787, is also not in doubt. If any Aborigine legitimately felt that way, then there is nothing to stop them returning to that way of life.
Europeans CAN leave if they actually want to. It's easier now then ever. The fact is, that they are happy enjoying the spoils of what happened, whilst decrying it at the same time, and making no effort to undo it.
This is hypocrisy.

[Eratosthenes (Peter)]

Originally Posted by Kunama

I think people need to Get Over It, this is 2017.
There are more important issues to deal with in Australia than events of the late 1700s.
Perhaps we could all just band together and continue to improve and make Australia the great place it can be instead of digging up the past at every opportunity.....

...cant move forward as a nation without recognising the crimes of the past and reconciling and compensating with the original indigenous owners of this soil.

The Commonwealth under British imperialist expansionism over several centuries resulted in over 70 treaties with those displaced and occupied. Only the Australian colony was conveniently declared under Terra Nullus status over 50 years after the initial 1788 invasion. And remember it was Captain Authur Philip that landed on Botany bay, and he was given explicit orders from London to seek consent and a treaty with the indigenous peoples of this land.

It's very easy to say, come on just move on that happened a few hundred years ago. There are lots of past crimes and genocides that still resonate today and havent been resolved. This is certainly one of them - perhaps the biggest and it cant be ignored and shoveled under the rug.

Incidentally Australia is only one of two states, in the UN that didn't implement the anti-genocide conventions ratified when the UN was first set up post WW2.

Lot's to think about and do before WE move on with some sort of resolution and integrity as a united people imo

[LewisM]

Too right Matt.

Don't fear, Alesia doesn't have any occupation agenda - she didn't like Thompson St. much either lol

[LewisM]

Good god I deplore the term "invasion". Such an evocative (in the negative sense) choice by protagonists of this whole "We are sorry" line.

Let's think about it damn it - EVERY single country on Earth has been invaded, since we know for certain that Homo Sapiens invaded Neanderthal and others...good lord, lets apologise for the African Homo Sapiens decimating the Neanderthals (and inter-breeding with them).

Just wake up all you apologists, forget the past, and MOVE ON. Apologising - what REALLY does it do except appease a very small minority???

[75BC (Brendon)]

What I can’t understand is how anyone can right a wrong from over 200 years ago. I don’t know if just changing the day would appease them. What do indigenous people want exactly? I’m not sure they could all agree on that.

I think for the overwhelming majority of people who do celebrate Australia Day, it’s not about celebrating an event from the past, it’s about what we have now. Inclusive of EVERYONE who makes this country what it is TODAY.

[Hans Tucker (Hans)]

https://thewest.com.au/news/indigeno...-ng-b88367562z

[casstony]

Regardless of arguments for and against, a tiny effort by the majority can make a significant difference to a minority. We should try to include everyone in our community where possible.

[AussieTrooper (Ben)]

Originally Posted by Eratosthenes

And remember it was Captain Authur Philip that landed on Botany bay, and he was given explicit orders from London to seek consent and a treaty with the indigenous peoples of this land.

I'm not sure I understand your point. The actions on 26 January 1788 were peaceful ones. The bloodshed occurred when the instructions you mentioned were not followed through years later.

There appears to be nothing at all wrong with the day, and it is indeed something to celebrate.

[PCH (Paul)]

At risk of being shouted down, and I realise this is just one point of view, but I'm gonna say it anyway...

Notwithstanding that there is truth in the simple fact that the Brits came and took over this land, things could easily have been very much worse.

Consider the current state of the major Anglophile nations, - being the UK, the USA, Canada, Australia and New Zealand - are they not pretty much the most civilised and advanced and desirable places on Earth to live, from a variety of points of view?

On the other hand, consider the lot of the indigenous peeps if the Frenchies had grabbed Australia as they were about to do. How many ex-French colonies would you be happy to live in today? They all kind of fell apart when the colonial power moved out in the last 50 years or so.

Or the Belgians! Maybe a repeat of the Congo would have been more warmly welcomed in hindsight.

Imagine how things may have fared if the Chinese or Japanese had landed first, - the indigenous race may well have ended up on the menu!

So while things are far from perfect here and now for this minority group, there's no doubt that one colonial power or another was going to grab this place at around the same time as the Brits did. That's an in indisputable fact, - so while I get why they may choose not to welcome the 'invasion', it was the best possible outcome in many ways a couple of hundred years later.

That said, I propose we should replace that ridiculous 'sorry' day with a national 'Thank You' day for making this country into the fabulous place it is today

Just my 2c and no offence intended to anyone.

[LewisM]

I was born in Alice Springs in 1973. My mother could not suckle me due to post-delivery issues (she has never forgiven me :p), nd I was suckled by the ladies of the Todd River - several, apparently. My father was the pilot for the TAA subsidiary, QLD and NT Aerial Medical Services - more or less today's RFDS. I grew up with aborigines. I have respect for those in the bush, as they are sincerely good folk!

My family have been farmers/settlers in QLD and Tasmania since first settlement. The Hobart suburb of Rosetta is named after my descendant, Rosetta Heckscher (or Hunsley - I can't remember which as both were in Hobart! Yes, we had MANY first settlers in our family and First Fleeters too - the good and the bad ).

Do I feel the need, as a descendant of these "invaders" to apologise? No. Did my family partake in the genocide of the Tasmanian Aborigines? I have no way of knowing! Is it pertinent to my life today? No.

History is rife with mistakes. We can't change it, and apologising certainly won't.