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Old 25-07-2012, 06:48 AM
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Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)
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Canon catches up - the mirrorless EOS M

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canon-eos-m

Having just ditched my 5D Mark-II for a beautiful and very, very capable Olympus OM-D (http://www.dpreview.com/products/olympus/slrs/oly_em5), I can understand Canon's interest in this genre.

It's a pity that unlike the OM-D, the Canon M doesn't feature a built-in EVF, which to my thinking defines it as a strict consumer-level device. Having diopter adjustment is essential to those of us who wear reading glasses and don't want to have to use them to operate a monitor on the back when shooting - which in the M's case doesn't even tilt or swivel - so overhead or waist-level composition is impractical. Maybe they'll bring out a more serious unit up the track now that they have played a hand. It will be very cool to use your L-Series lenses though, if you already have them, and still maintain autofocus and IS. Interesting astro camera too, without a mirror to have to lock and lighter overall weight - maybe one day there'll be a Canon EOS Ma?
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Last edited by Omaroo; 25-07-2012 at 03:50 PM.
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Old 25-07-2012, 11:47 AM
rally
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Welcome to the Dark side !
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Old 25-07-2012, 01:04 PM
Nortilus (Josh)
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so really, its a 650D without the viewfinder (hence mirrorless), smaller, weighs less. Same features as the 650D, less manual buttons and dials (all been done via touch screen)...

Ok, someone mod this camera and see how it goes for astrophotos...
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Old 25-07-2012, 01:09 PM
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dannat (Daniel)
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Forgot this for now -mod an OM-d, get the new OLY 75mm lens, its excellent
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Old 25-07-2012, 01:16 PM
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Forgot this for now -mod an OM-d, get the new OLY 75mm lens, its excellent
Like this one? I bought one this week - one of the first to get it. AWESOME. It makes my L-Series lenses feel cheap. It's a seriously beautiful piece of glass wrapped in solid aluminium. The focuser is buuuuuuttery-smooth. Can't wait to get out there with it and see how it handles stars in the corner of the frame.

A great review from Ming: http://blog.mingthein.com/2012/07/22...o-four-thirds/
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Last edited by Omaroo; 25-07-2012 at 10:48 PM.
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Old 25-07-2012, 01:19 PM
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so really, its a 650D without the viewfinder (hence mirrorless),
Well, no - you don't need a mirror to still have a VF - unless you insist on optical and through the lens. "Mirrorless" refers to the lack of a mirror, not viewfinder.

I'm getting used to the EVF on the Olympus so fast it's wonderful. All the exposure and focus details right there in your eye - as well as live view magnified and EV-boosted focus.
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Old 25-07-2012, 02:37 PM
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lacad01 (Adam)
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Originally Posted by Omaroo View Post
I'm getting used to the EVF on the Olympus so fast it's wonderful. All the exposure and focus details right there in your eye - as well as live view magnified and EV-boosted focus.
Be interested to know what the EVF is like outdoors on a bright day.
Oops, scratch that - I see the OM-D has "conventional" view finder

Last edited by lacad01; 25-07-2012 at 02:48 PM. Reason: Oops
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Old 25-07-2012, 02:53 PM
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Be interested to know what the EVF is like outdoors on a bright day.
Oops, scratch that - I see the OM-D has "conventional" view finder
Hi Adam I've just gone out in to my back yard under a rather strong overhead sun with the OM-D. The back OLED screen, like any of its ilk, is plainly useless in direct strong sun. The EOS M would be impossible to shoot in these conditions. The OM-D gives you the choice of using the back screen OR/AND a "conventional" finder, in that you put your eye up to a protected light tunnel so the image isn't being viewed in direct sun. It's still an EVF - i.e. electronic, not optical. I'm getting to like it, because in really dark conditions where you can't see squat in an optical viewfinder, you can boost the electronic viewfinder's sensitivity (uses a second, separate imaging processor to the main sensor) so that dark objects a) are clearly visible in near darkness and b) are able to be instantly focus-locked. Under the strong sunlight, it's just as comfortable to view as an optical finder - one giving 100% coverage at 1.15 mag at that. You can alter the refresh rate too, up to 120Hz, if you ever experience flicker under some artificial lighting conditions. A lot of thought has gone into this camera. Apart from this deficiency, I reckon that the EOS M will have some significant features we're yet to find out about. I was at DCW in Sydney the other day and the staff mentioned that they'd see one soon and let me know their impressions.

Last edited by Omaroo; 25-07-2012 at 03:12 PM.
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Old 25-07-2012, 04:34 PM
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Cheers for the info Chris - yep that's what I liked about my old Canon S3, had an electronic viewfinder as well as the flip out back screen.
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Old 25-07-2012, 05:24 PM
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What's the battery life like with an electronic viewfinder?
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Old 25-07-2012, 05:43 PM
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What's the battery life like with an electronic viewfinder?
Not huge Peter. Not only are you powering the EVF when your face is up to the window, but the 5-axis (up and down translate, yaw, pitch and roll) stabilisation system runs the whole time you're in stills mode. The camera actually emits a low hum when it's running - even if you switch IS off. Take the lens out and look at the sensor. It's sagged to the bottom of its cavity. Turn it on and watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTKgjA9Ixr0

It's why I've gone for the additional battery as part of the optional grip system. The camera allows you to choose which battery to consume first. Naturally, you'd choose the one in the grip as it is more accessible. Each one is written up by Olympus to give you 350 shots. Reports from users to date suggest closer to 500 per battery. Not too bad given that - so hopefully 800 between the two which is pretty-well a whole 16Gb card in RAW.

Last edited by Omaroo; 25-07-2012 at 06:32 PM.
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Old 25-07-2012, 06:25 PM
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Throw it on the scope, I'm keen to see what the low light performance is like.
Gary
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Old 25-07-2012, 06:36 PM
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Octane (Humayun)
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The 24-105mm f/4L IS USM looks ridiculous on that body. I don't quite understand how a picture is supposed to be taken with such a little camera.

Full frame DSLRs all the way for me!

H
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Old 25-07-2012, 06:36 PM
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Throw it on the scope, I'm keen to see what the low light performance is like.
Gary
"Cloooooowds...disappear! Clowwwwds...... disappear!"

As soon as I can see some sky Gary! I'll try it on a tripod with some static 30-sec exposures throughout the whole mid ISO range and across the aperture range of the 75mm. One thing I love about this camera is a feature they call "LiveTime". This setting lets you watch the image "developing" in real time on your monitor, letting you fire it off and stop when it looks "baked". You can set LiveTime to go as long as 30 minutes WITHOUT a remote of any kind. BULB is BULB, like on any camera and requires a remote - the Hahnel GigaPro-T II remote timer trigger, which I have coming tomorrow. Even standard Auto mode gives you up to 60 seconds on its own.
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Old 25-07-2012, 06:40 PM
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The 24-105mm f/4L IS USM looks ridiculous on that body. I don't quite understand how a picture is supposed to be taken with such a little camera.

Full frame DSLRs all the way for me!

H
Predictable, if nothing else Humayun LOL The fact is that you can do it, I guess. The EOS M is too small for me too, and whereas the OM-D is a little SLR, the EOS is a compact. I agree that full-frame is a must for you, because of what you do professionally. For me, it's no contest - the big camera was a bore to drag around, so I didn't. The OM-D is considered by many already to be very nearly pro-spec, and that does me just fine!
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Old 25-07-2012, 06:48 PM
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Predictable, maybe, but, they do get the job done. For me.

I'm laughing -- do you hold the lens or the camera when taking a picture with the M?!

The new 40mm STM "pancake" lens on that would be pretty nice.

H
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Old 25-07-2012, 06:51 PM
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Hehe.. I think the lens!

Seriously, I guess that the capability is there, even if they don't expect people to seriously use it with the L-Series lenses. With smaller MFT-size lenses it would be very usable I'd imagine.
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Old 25-07-2012, 08:01 PM
Danack (Dan Ackroyd)
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the Canon M doesn't feature a built-in EVF, which to my thinking defines it as a strict consumer-level device.
My thinking is that:

1) Hardly any consumers use the view finder - even on proper SLR cameras e.g. 500d/550d/600d most people seem to just use the LCD on the back for taking pictures. Although it is a key feature for some users for most people it would increase the cost without any benefit.

2) This camera really looks like an S series powershot. I would not be surprised to see a later EOS-M that looks more like a G series powershot. The G series have a viewfinder - the S series don't.

3) I'm a little surprised they didn't include an articulated screen. Because almost all of the exposure settings are done on the touch screen, it must make the camera really hard to use when it's on a tripod. The G series camera also have an articulated screen, so again another point in favour of them releasing another version sooner, rather than later.
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Old 25-07-2012, 08:31 PM
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2) This camera really looks like an S series powershot. I would not be surprised to see a later EOS-M that looks more like a G series powershot. The G series have a viewfinder - the S series don't.
Humayun and I were just messaging each other about this and agree with you. The G would make a good platform to start with - fitted with a proper EVF and not the tiny optical finder they have now, which are two-thirds useless. Great little cameras otherwise though - I had a G11 and loved it.
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Old 27-07-2012, 09:13 AM
Poita (Peter)
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Really? I almost never use the LCD on my camera, except to check the shot I just took. I always use the viewfinder unless taking an overhead shot etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danack View Post
My thinking is that:

1) Hardly any consumers use the view finder - even on proper SLR cameras e.g. 500d/550d/600d most people seem to just use the LCD on the back for taking pictures. Although it is a key feature for some users for most people it would increase the cost without any benefit.

2) This camera really looks like an S series powershot. I would not be surprised to see a later EOS-M that looks more like a G series powershot. The G series have a viewfinder - the S series don't.

3) I'm a little surprised they didn't include an articulated screen. Because almost all of the exposure settings are done on the touch screen, it must make the camera really hard to use when it's on a tripod. The G series camera also have an articulated screen, so again another point in favour of them releasing another version sooner, rather than later.
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