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Old 28-03-2021, 08:15 PM
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Constant (David)
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Lens Cleaning

Searching through past threads I could find no reference to steam cleaning lens. Obviously, I'm not referencing "carpet cleaning" style steam cleaning. The reference is to forensic cleaning, cleaning without touching, cleaning with great precision.
Has any Icer used or heard of steam cleaning being used to clean optics? If so what was the result?
My guess is such a cleaning method maybe very effective in cleaning eyes pieces. Though I refrain from cleaning optics I'd love a method of "no touch" cleaning
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Old 28-03-2021, 08:54 PM
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Thermal shock to a lens potentially could cause it to crack. I have not heard of this type of cleaning ever before and it sounds extreme.

Imagine putting steam on an objective lens that was cool or cold from an air conditioned room?

It could damage the lens potentially.

Roland Christen has advised not to subject your scope to sudden changes in temperature.

Thermal shock is the issue.

Cleaning lenses is not that hard with the right approach. Nor is it damaging.

Greg.
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Old 28-03-2021, 11:53 PM
Sitt (Simon)
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Won't be good for the lens coatings either - terrible idea if you ask me
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Old 29-03-2021, 04:06 AM
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Do not use compressed air either for the same reason; temperature shock. It will crack!

Just search “compressed air shattered lens”.
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Old 29-03-2021, 05:34 AM
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Over kill and just ridiculous. one would have to wonder who came up with that idea, what happened to normal dust removal and lens cleaning.

Leon
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Old 29-03-2021, 08:03 AM
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I’d like to know how to clean behind the lens.... it seems I have a stubborn dust spot behind the front element. Flats remove it but I don’t want it there.
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Old 29-03-2021, 08:40 AM
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Mmmm, I'm uncertain if anyone read my post. Forensic cleaning, no touch cleaning was the idea. I've an essential tremor, my hands shake, Im looking for a way my hands can be kept distant from the lens.
Given the some what "heated" response to my question.... "Can you use steam to clean a lens"?

There's a huge difference between temperature and heat Heat describes the transfer of thermal energy between molecules within a system and is measured in Joules. Heat measures how energy moves or flows. ... Temperature describes the average kinetic energy of molecules within a material or system and is measured in Celsius (°C), Kelvin(K), Fahrenheit (°F), or Rankine (R).3 Sept 2018

Compressed air is describing heat (delta) or the thermal shock is very different to what I'm postulating Using a forensic application of steam is temperature. There's a difference between the two.

It is but a question! I guess I'll need to buy a small steamer and experiment on some cheap eyepieces. Methinks I'll try the scientific method before leaping to conclusions.
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Old 29-03-2021, 10:18 AM
Rocket (Ed)
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Another approach to cleaning optics, at the other end of the temperature scale, is CO2 "snow", eg https://www.co2clean.com/telescopes . I think this is mainly used for large mirrors, for example in observatories where the effort to remove and realuminise a mirror is considerable, but it is used for a wide range of sensitive surfaces, including semiconductor wafers.
Opticlean is another way to clean optics, but it can wick under the edges of elements and onto the lens holder, making it hard to completely remove - more informatiuon here https://www.cloudynights.com/article...opticlean-r539
Cheers, Ed
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Old 29-03-2021, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocket View Post
Another approach to cleaning optics, at the other end of the temperature scale, is CO2 "snow", eg https://www.co2clean.com/telescopes . I think this is mainly used for large mirrors, for example in observatories where the effort to remove and realuminise a mirror is considerable, but it is used for a wide range of sensitive surfaces, including semiconductor wafers.
Opticlean is another way to clean optics, but it can wick under the edges of elements and onto the lens holder, making it hard to completely remove - more informatiuon here https://www.cloudynights.com/article...opticlean-r539
Cheers, Ed
Many thanks!

David
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Old 29-03-2021, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamJL View Post
I’d like to know how to clean behind the lens.... it seems I have a stubborn dust spot behind the front element. Flats remove it but I don’t want it there.
I doubt a dust spec behind the lens would be visible in an image. The dust would be much much closer to the sensor like the sensor chamber glass or a filter.

There is a site that has a calculator to determine how far from the sensor the dust donut is.

Greg.
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Old 29-03-2021, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamJL View Post
I’d like to know how to clean behind the lens.... it seems I have a stubborn dust spot behind the front element. Flats remove it but I don’t want it there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constant View Post
Mmmm, I'm uncertain if anyone read my post. Forensic cleaning, no touch cleaning was the idea. I've an essential tremor, my hands shake, Im looking for a way my hands can be kept distant from the lens.
Given the some what "heated" response to my question.... "Can you use steam to clean a lens"?

There's a huge difference between temperature and heat Heat describes the transfer of thermal energy between molecules within a system and is measured in Joules. Heat measures how energy moves or flows. ... Temperature describes the average kinetic energy of molecules within a material or system and is measured in Celsius (°C), Kelvin(K), Fahrenheit (°F), or Rankine (R).3 Sept 2018

Compressed air is describing heat (delta) or the thermal shock is very different to what I'm postulating Using a forensic application of steam is temperature. There's a difference between the two.

It is but a question! I guess I'll need to buy a small steamer and experiment on some cheap eyepieces. Methinks I'll try the scientific method before leaping to conclusions.
I am not sure how steam cleaning goes getting rid of oily residues which would be eyelash oil on the top eyepiece lens.

Bintel cleaning fluid is easy as and I don't think a tremor would affect it.

Greg.
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Old 30-03-2021, 05:39 AM
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Hi Guys

My reply is a little off topic ( this product touches the lens / elements )

I bought a cleaning kit last year from Photonic Cleaning Technologies in the States, they dropped the price by about ( from memory ) 40% in response to the fires last year.

I does take a stiff upper lip to paint on a solution ( onto to a C11 Edge ) but one application removed every thing from the glass that shouldn't be there. no runny liquids on the telescope no drama it just worked.

It obviously isn't a no contact option but I'm a very happy user.

Ed - another on. 8-)
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Old 30-03-2021, 06:45 AM
ab1963 (Andrew)
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For eyepieces Use a lens blower for dust and for water based breathe on the lense and wipe off with a cloth or tissue anything more is overkill , Coatings are not what they used to be very hard now and you would literally have to purposely abuse to damage......
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Old 30-03-2021, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by appiice View Post
Hi Guys

My reply is a little off topic ( this product touches the lens / elements )

I bought a cleaning kit last year from Photonic Cleaning Technologies in the States, they dropped the price by about ( from memory ) 40% in response to the fires last year.

I does take a stiff upper lip to paint on a solution ( onto to a C11 Edge ) but one application removed every thing from the glass that shouldn't be there. no runny liquids on the telescope no drama it just worked.

It obviously isn't a no contact option but I'm a very happy user.

Ed - another on. 8-)
Ed,

Looked at Photonic Cleaning Tech, very interesting! It looks like something I'd able to use. I'm prone to smudging lens, optics generally, won't bore you with the reasons, but it's unavoidable.
After trying the steam cleaner (ordered ETA Monday) if the process and results aren't what I'd been expecting, definately give your recommendation a go.
Need a solution for my shakey shenanigans!
Cheers
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Old 31-03-2021, 05:01 AM
appiice (Ed)
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Hello Constant

PCT emailed me a couple of days ago about them going to NEAF, they had an offer along with the invitation.

[COLOR="Red"]Save even more! When shopping on our webstore enter coupon code "VIRTUAL2021" to receive 25% off your order!

I'm not sure how long the offer lasts but it may be of interest to you.

Ed
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Old 16-04-2021, 12:49 PM
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Ed, many thanks for the heads up! The steam cleaner arrived today I've no distilled water, so a little more waiting.
No pun intended.... Once I've given the steam approach a "crack" I'll report back. If it's a fail, no drama as I'm testing on generic lens, no big deal if even the worst happened.
Dependent on outcome, I may well be ordering from PCT.
Cheers
David
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Old 16-04-2021, 09:50 PM
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Just had a look at the pct product, looks like a good solution, quoted me $100 shipping unfortunately.
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Old 17-04-2021, 09:47 AM
Rocket (Ed)
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David, the distilled water available in the laundry isle of any supermarket for use in irons should be good enough for the task. Ed
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Old 17-04-2021, 04:55 PM
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I have used a steamer for bending veneer. It just moistens and heats. It has no capacity to blow off anything. Just makes the surface hot and wet. Neither helps.

I would have thought the only no touch cleaning was a rocket blower (and then sable brush, like a negative.)

A. Most lense suppliers say resist the urge to do anything else.

B. But if you have a big organic spot I think the only solution, after blowing and sable brushing and possibly dabbing, is pure cotton swab and high quality lense cleaner like Giotto. If many spots, cotton very lightly damped with high grade isopropyl alchohol is used on high end microscope lenses in a dust free location. Nothing else. Start in the middle and go around in a spiral to the edge, or just roll off the spot with a cotton swab and cleaner. Find a friend with a steady hand or an optometry lab or go back to A.
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Old 18-04-2021, 09:33 PM
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Today the distilled water arrived and it was time to give the steamer a crack. In a nutshell, the results were surprisingly effective. The cheap eBay steamer produces a good flow of steam, at a velocity I wasn't expecting.
The temp of the steam falls off dramatically and it's easy for even my shaky hands to keep the object being cleaned, in this case, an old finder scope at a safe distance. Previous attempts to "clean" the objective had left in its wake horrid residue. Using steam the residue was quickly and safely dissolved and was carried away via rapidly condensing steam.
In more competent and knowledgeable hands steam could be effective in cleaning optics. My opinions and observations are of little value, what is clear, the finder scope was much cleaner after gentle steam cleaning than before steam cleaning.
The other questions.... Was harm caused? To the extent that I can ascertain, no!
My thoughts turned to cleaning eyepieces made oily and dirty via outreach sessions or star parties.
If anyone would sufficiently intrigued please PM and I'd be happy to loan the cleaner to anyone prepared to pickup and return the cleaner (I live in Southern Sydney). I'm interested in discovering what more competent hands can do with the cleaner.
David
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