Super Cooled Mono 350D Project

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

G'day everyone

I am planing on mono modding my 350D and then attempt to cool it, so far I have decided to do a complete camera rehouse and have drawn up a bit of a plan, more details to come.

Cheers
Jo

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

Ok, so the idea is to strip of all the things I don't need on the camera and fit it into an aluminium case, I am not sure if I will be able to keep the screen, if I can I would like to mount it on the out side of the case as it would great to have for framing the images.

Im hoping to put a 32 gig card in the camera and use an intervalometer to control the shutter, so I shouldn't need to use a computer out were ever Im imaging.

After I have captured what I want I will plug the camera into the computer and download the images, Im pretty sure I can then delete the images off the card using the computer as well.

Settings like the ISO will have to be set while connected to the computer but I reckon I will probably just find a good level and leave it there.


After reading what Alister has done with removing the CFA I've decided to give that a go as well, I'll make sure I take plenty of before and after photos to see what difference it will make.


Reading Rowlands thread on cooling his 5D has given me plenty of ideas, I'll keep watching it.

Does anyone know were to get a piece of copper plate around 2mm thick? I was thinking of getting a bit of 3/4 copper pipe and cutting it along one side and then flattening it out.

Cheers
Jo

[rcheshire (Rowland)]

Jo. Ebay and several metal merchants and craft suppliers sell copper sheet of various dimensions. I used 1.2mm copper sheet to make a cold finger for a 1000D. Fits snugly between the back of the sensor and bottom of the sensor PCB, with a strip of packing tape for insulation from the PCB.

All of your metal junctions must perfectly flat and cleaned with very fine carborundum sheet to remove oxide. This will ensure the lowest thermal resistance possible. System performance is influenced by the sum of all thermal resistance, including the contact surfaces - sensor, copper, TEC heatsink. Use thermal paste.

All surfaces could be lapped, but I avoid doing this to the back of the sensor.

EDIT: Bending copper sheet can be done in a vice, sith surfaces protected by aluminium angle. Use a paddle to bend the sheet evenly with a tight bend. The vice I use, conveniently, has a 3mm recess on the top inside of the jaws. I use this with a couple of pieces of 8mm Aluminium bar and a small hammer to produce sharp bends up to 90 degrees, without compromising the flatness of the sheet.

[alistairsam]

Hi Jo,

have you done some testing/research on how you can get the camera working barebone? if so i'd be very interested to know how its done which i presume is the purpose of this thread.
I'm not sure if you need the LCD or any of the switches. just USB control should suffice other than temperature control which I'm not sure how you'd do in software.
The CDS site might help
just came across this page which shows mod of the 350D
http://www.centralds.net/cam/?p=1945
they talk about fitting an air tight chamber to the camera, cold finger to the sensor assemlby and so on. extremely informative.
I think they sell this as a kit.
http://www.centralds.net/cam/?cat=17

FWIW, JTW astronomy sell a kit for the 350D that you can fit yourself.
its about 199 euro and I think is a very good price.
http://www.jtwastronomy.com/products/icecube.php

Cheers
Alistair

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

Originally Posted by rcheshire

Jo. Ebay and several metal merchants and craft suppliers sell copper sheet of various dimensions. I used 1.2mm copper sheet to make a cold finger for a 1000D. Fits snugly between the back of the sensor and bottom of the sensor PCB, with a strip of packing tape for insulation from the PCB.

All of your metal junctions must perfectly flat and cleaned with very fine carborundum sheet to remove oxide. This will ensure the lowest thermal resistance possible. System performance is influenced by the sum of all thermal resistance, including the contact surfaces - sensor, copper, TEC heatsink. Use thermal paste.

All surfaces could be lapped, but I avoid doing this to the back of the sensor.

EDIT: Bending copper sheet can be done in a vice, sith surfaces protected by aluminium angle. Use a paddle to bend the sheet evenly with a tight bend. The vice I use, conveniently, has a 3mm recess on the top inside of the jaws. I use this with a couple of pieces of 8mm Aluminium bar and a small hammer to produce sharp bends up to 90 degrees, without compromising the flatness of the sheet.

Thanks for this info Rowland, I did not realise it had to be perfectly flat, I'll have a look in some model shops next time Im in town.

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

Originally Posted by alistairsam

Hi Jo,

have you done some testing/research on how you can get the camera working barebone? if so i'd be very interested to know how its done which i presume is the purpose of this thread.
I'm not sure if you need the LCD or any of the switches. just USB control should suffice other than temperature control which I'm not sure how you'd do in software.
The CDS site might help
just came across this page which shows mod of the 350D
http://www.centralds.net/cam/?p=1945
they talk about fitting an air tight chamber to the camera, cold finger to the sensor assemlby and so on. extremely informative.
I think they sell this as a kit.
http://www.centralds.net/cam/?cat=17

FWIW, JTW astronomy sell a kit for the 350D that you can fit yourself.
its about 199 euro and I think is a very good price.
http://www.jtwastronomy.com/products/icecube.php

Cheers
Alistair

G'day Alistair

No I don't really know how the camera will work bare bone but in one of the links you posted on Rowlands thread the guy in there had a picture of all the things that could be removed with damaging the camera.

Thanks for the links I'll have a read

Jo

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

Sorry just remembered is wasn't that link it was this one here

http://thaiastro.nectec.or.th/hypermod/

Cheers
Jo

PS The JTW astronomy stuff is nice, I wonder how they make these.

http://www.jtwastronomy.com/products/ultimate.php

[rcheshire (Rowland)]

1000D cold finger. Lots of bending to fit without destructive mods to camera.

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

Gee thats well done whats the red stuff?

[rcheshire (Rowland)]

Double sided tape backing. Holds the heatsink mounting plate in place.

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

I have had a look on ebay and am interested in either a 60w TEC or a 91w TEC, both are 15v 6A, what do you recommend?

I also found some heat sinks that look alright, the first one is rated 100w cooling and the second is 150w.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/390604995...84.m1438.l2649

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/310642578...84.m1438.l2649

What do you reckon?

Cheers
Jo

[rcheshire (Rowland)]

Jo. Do the heat sink dimensions suit your design? Do you need to limit the size. If so you will need the aluminium box to dissipate some of the heat. In-fact, if you use a smaller heatsink, you can fix fins to the case to increase effective cooling.

A 200W active heatsink (fan), with a 15V 8A TEC, achieved a 34C differential with the cold finger posted previously. Transpose with your specs.

The temperature differential between ambient air temperature and heatsink exhaust temperature should be 10C or less. The specs above produced a differential of 7C at full power.

The JTW mod has a large fin array to accommodate the dual TEC. Its about surface area. So, if you can add fins to your cooler box you can use a smaller, lighter heatsink.

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

I don't really have any size limits but the smaller the better I suppose, I've been thinking, what if I make a copper hot finger for the tec and to make it go along the end and extend about 50mm along the front and back of the case, that way I could add heat sinks there as well.

If I got two of these and put one on the end and cut the other one in half and put it on the front and back do you reckon that'll work? with a fan or course.

[gregbradley]

If you cool too hard you'll get frosting or dew issues unless you seal the sensor chamber and fill with inert gas like argon.

So keep that in mind.

Greg.

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

Originally Posted by gregbradley

If you cool too hard you'll get frosting or dew issues unless you seal the sensor chamber and fill with inert gas like argon.

So keep that in mind.

Greg.

Thanks Greg, Im planing on having the whole case sealed, filling with argon is a good idea, we got a huge bottle in the shed for the mig welder.


Im going to town today and I'll probably drop in to Jaycar and grab some bits.

Cheers
Jo

PS it's mail day today so Im hoping the camera will arrive

[rcheshire (Rowland)]

If you can fill with Argon its preferable to a complex heating arrangement that would probably require a second TEC. Way to go! Things were getting too complex. Now all the TEC needs to do is cool the sensor. Your heat sink looks more than adequate, but it will need a fan.

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

Hey Alistar, I've been reading on SGL about how much trouble there've been having getting the cover glass off the sensor, well I got my 350D sensor out the other day and I used a small flat screwdriver to scrape the glue from around the edge of the glass and then used it to apply some pressure to the edge of the glass until the glue under neath turned white, after I had done it all the way around the glass just poped off in one piece. It made me think it might be all that needs to be done with the 1100D and such?

Anyway if you wanted to let the guys on SGL know they might be interested to give it a go.


I'm on holidays at the moment but I'll let you know the results of the debayer when I get home.
Cheers
Jo

[alistairsam]

thanks for the tip Jo
I'll pass it on.
I have been waiting for a spare 600d sensor and its finally arrived.
I'll try your method first for the glass, if not I'll be using a heat desoldering gun to heat the periphery of the glass as that seems to have the most success.
so far they've debayered a 350d, 450d, 600d, 1000d.
the 1100d seems to be the most stubborn.
but I think a safe compromise is the450d as its 14bit and is easy to debayer.
I will post progress

Alistair

[2stroke (Jay)]

If you were doing a 1100d i would pass on a cmos to play with. If you find my 1100D thread you will see the enclouser i found on ebay, its of pure ally not cast and is light weight and air/water tight. As for tec's you pay for what you get, so get one for jaycar at min were the temp deferential is good and not bs like the cheapo's on ebay were its a gamble. Also stick with 20-35watts and insulate your finger to save the trouble of pumping a ton of heat out since your doing a complete re-housing your got the space.

[nebulosity. (Jo)]

G'day everyone.


Over the last few weeks I’ve been collecting the things I need for this project and so far have got:

2x Canon 350d’s

55W TEC

90W low profile CPU Cooler 100x110x40mm

12 8A power supply

Timer remote

Thermal past

100x70x35mm passive heat sink

170x12x55mm Aluminium case

and probably some other stuff I forgot.

The only thing I haven't been able to find yet is some copper plate.


Now I got the first 350d and managed to get it apart, got the sensor out and took off the low pass filter(?) and AA filter(?), and then popped the cover glass off and had a bare sensor.

I first rubed the micro lenses off with a mach stick.

But to get the CFA off I tried scraping with a sharpened bit of wood but couldn’t move anything so tried a bit of hard plastic and still no go, so I got a bit of aluminium and filed a nice edge on it and carefully scraped it off with that.

Once the camera was assembled again I turned it on and it was dead, I fiddled with it a fare bit but it stayed dead so I thought blow it, and I got another one on ebay.

It arrived a few days ago and after getting enough courage I pulled it apart, took out the sensor and put in the debayered sensor.

On assembly it fired up strait away and performed as normal, needless to say I was pretty chuffed at this and couldn’t wait to try it out on the stars.

I found that I couldn’t focus at infinity with a camera lens so I hooked it up to my old refractor and got a few sub and was amazed at how much more sensitive it was, I estimate around 3 to 4 times more sensitive that the GX1 that I normally use.

Im not really good at describing things so I'll just post heaps of pictures instead.

Cheers
Jo

Pic 1. pulling apart camera.

Pic 2. sensor out and cover glass off.

Pic 3. removing micro lenses with mach stick.

Pic 4. removing CFA with tool.

Pic 5. CFA removed.


First light, 110mm f5 acro, no filters, 10x 30sec ISO 1600 subs.

Pic 6. M 8.

Pic 7. M 16.

Pic 8. M 17.

Please note: these last pictures are terrible quality, I just took them to show the sensitivity of the camera.

If you want any more info about something please ask.

Cheers
Jo