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Old 05-06-2020, 01:11 PM
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still fighting the Dragons.

well I really tried but it just wont pop.
nice colours eh
there is about 13 hours of data here ..not that you would know.
I did the 3x drizzle and had multiple crashes and this has taken me a week.
I gave each stack its colour according to the Hubble palllete but let it go its way and pressed every button in photo shop that said auto...but I really did not learn anything to be honest. it is what it is...80mm refractor, heq5 unguided mount, exposures one and two minutes,crazy gain way beyond reasonablewhich is probably my biggest issue but until I get guiding sorted high gain will be used unforgivingly, DSS 3X drizzle, Startools, Photo Shop to the max.
the original stack was cropped probably by half to minimise the lovely oval stars there because I still have to sort out spacing.
but I have been busy and could not let clear sky pass just because my gear is not ready..or me
I have reduced saturation but I expect it will be way over as usual.
any advice greatly appreciated but I think I know what things I need do before anyone wastes their time pointing out what I need to do.
alex
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Old 05-06-2020, 02:01 PM
Ralf (Ralf)
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I admire your persistence Alex, the longest exposure I have taken to date is about 2 hrs 15 mins and then maybe half an hour of processing time, but then I still have a long way to go with processing.
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Old 05-06-2020, 03:08 PM
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I admire your persistence Alex, the longest exposure I have taken to date is about 2 hrs 15 mins and then maybe half an hour of processing time, but then I still have a long way to go with processing.
Hi Ralf long time no see ..about 24 hours

I just remembered I did do a successful stack on the desk top but when I processed them they looked terrible so I don't know what happened there...I finished another process just after you left on the lap top but again it looked terrible...then another on the lap top that I finished at about 12 last night but still real crook...this latest is not flash but miles ahead of all prior attempts...you see the difficulties I have to manage ..heck I don't even have running water there yet...I do have a big tank at the house to bring down ..I will get there..I moved a few rocks to the piers so I can add some pads.
Thanks again ..my daughter loves the ladder stairs chair and just about choked when I said I will put it by the dam with a life guard sign on in..I didn't think it was that funny but cracked her right up.

Thanks again.

And for those of you wondering about my chat...Ralf sold me his roll off roof observatory and he together with a really nice fella named Dennis spent the last three days re erecting it...and a magnificent job...

Honestly looking at my HA I don't know why I bother with RBG etc..it is so good and goes downhill as I add other channels..hopefully the day will come that I have it all worked out.

Alex
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Old 07-06-2020, 10:20 AM
jahnpahwa (JP)
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Looks a fun image, Alex. I'd be keen to see shots of all the stages of your processing! I like the green.
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Old 07-06-2020, 10:57 AM
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Looks a fun image, Alex. I'd be keen to see shots of all the stages of your processing! I like the green.
I have to do it all again as I have found out that I am doing it all wrong.

I do many crazy things none of which seem to be correct.

I only found out this morning what SHO means...and that is all you need for a Hubble like image..I have been using all filters when it seems you only need S, H and O.. and I combine by using layers rather than a combine type process...so learnt heaps last night and this morning.

There is probably too much green ...and there is so much wrong with it but at least I am starting to understand what is wrong and how to fix it...

I think I make it just too complicated from what I have seen.
In addition to normal stacks I stack everything together for what I call a mega luminance.
Dont follow any of this as advice because it is wrong..it's just what I have done so far while I am trying to learn in general and not being too serious while I get everything in order..I am old and near cripple so I just get more time resting so I doddle.

I end up with usually 7 to 9 groups of stuff from StarTools.. often say two versions of HA a normal luminance and a mega luminance..these go to photo shop RAW for initial adjustment, then opened in main window, I then duplicate all to have 14 or usually more images....I colorize the first seven and adjust each, then layer the green to blue, then the luminance which I colour whatever I feel like on the day but I like a yellow or maybe it's green, the Ha and after all that comes down to one image then using the duplicates colorized use them via the rubber tool to add colour in spots where I would like more, and just spend the day adding this and that and slowly close files until I get a few that I like and merge them...but that is not the way it should be done...then rather than using masks just use the doge and burn tools to lighten and darken spots, reduce the saturation, brighten and darken, then send it to gimp for a fiddle reduction and a general play.
But now that I have been looking at videos on what you should do I hope to improve.
I am determined my next target to do everything right, guiding and proper gain, dark, flats and dark flats and proper processing...maybe..I have so much to do..I am only here for a rest..doing crementwork around the new observatory and taking a breather.
Thanks for your interest.
Alex
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Old 07-06-2020, 12:13 PM
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mynameiscd (Andy)
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Hi Alex,
I really like your rendition of the fighting dragons. It really pops out.
You have put so much effort into this images and this one has got heaps of good data there its just manipulating that data. There's so many ways to combine all those filters you must be spinning! The data is all there and actually I like the green. Although there is very little green in RGB images, in narrow band you can use the green channel to enhance the shadows and highlights to get that 3D thing like you have.
Ive been playing around with LRGB Ha,S,O data lately and its so complicated....well for me anyway and to make things worse im learning Pixinsight at the same time.
13 hours is an epic effort and going through that data, doing multi stacking and combining is so time consuming.
Nice image anyway.
Cheers
Andy
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Old 07-06-2020, 04:15 PM
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Thank you for the encouragement Andy however I say the data was not that good..although it seems to have delivered something..but all subs were short exposures and at ridiculous high gain..like there was some HA at 500 gain and most of the Ha was 400 or 450...and no dark or flats...I think I was lucky.. many of the first processes in StarTools gave a very disappointing result ..I think any praise goes to photo shop finally..thanks for your interest ..I notice you are doing really well so keep that up and keep those images coming in...
Alex
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Old 07-06-2020, 05:09 PM
spiezzy
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Hey Alex don't under estimate your self i think it pops and the colour is great different but great i quite like this version well done was this taken in your new observatory ??
cheers Pete
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Old 07-06-2020, 06:16 PM
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mynameiscd (Andy)
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Hi Alex,
Hope you don't mind but I had a go processing your 200kb file in Pixinsight. I split it up in to it's 7 channels and put it back together with a bit of tweaking.
There's a lot of good data there but I'm no expert but extracted a Luminance channel out of the RBG. Also assigned the red Channel to Ha etc and mixed it back in.
I reckon you should keep going because it's in the data but not exactly sure how to get it out.
I just followed a LRGB Ha,S,O tutorial and extracted the grey mono channels and assigned them to each different channel. It sort of worked but I only had 200 kb to play with. Anyway thanks and good luck.
Cheers
Andy
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Old 07-06-2020, 07:48 PM
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barx1963 (Malcolm)
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Alex
Just tried to PM you, your inbox appears to be full!!

Malcolm
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Old 07-06-2020, 07:51 PM
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Hey Alex don't under estimate your self i think it pops and the colour is great different but great i quite like this version well done was this taken in your new observatory ??
cheers Pete
Thank you for your kind words Pete..not in the new observatory I have a few things to do there before it is operational including buying a new mount, scope, camera and desk top...Putting in the pier will take a long time as it will take a lot of rock. The thing is off the ground so rather than dig a hole I will drive eight star pickets into the ground with them out up to the floor and add lots of rock and cement..I estimate there will be well over a ton..just gathering the rocks takes a while for an old cripple like me..But little by little it will happen. I have been gathering data on this for at least a month.
Thanks again.
Alex

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Old 07-06-2020, 07:54 PM
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Alex
Just tried to PM you, your inbox appears to be full!!

Malcolm
It was but I emptied a few. Sorry for the inconvenience I will do more a little later.
Alex
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Old 07-06-2020, 08:03 PM
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Hi Alex,
Hope you don't mind but I had a go processing your 200kb file in Pixinsight. I split it up in to it's 7 channels and put it back together with a bit of tweaking.
There's a lot of good data there but I'm no expert but extracted a Luminance channel out of the RBG. Also assigned the red Channel to Ha etc and mixed it back in.
I reckon you should keep going because it's in the data but not exactly sure how to get it out.
I just followed a LRGB Ha,S,O tutorial and extracted the grey mono channels and assigned them to each different channel. It sort of worked but I only had 200 kb to play with. Anyway thanks and good luck.
Cheers
Andy
Thanks for trying Andy.
I reached for the desk top maybe six times today thinking to redo it but I have burnt out a bit..I really did not do anything else all week..even going to the week earlier..in fact if you look when I posted my first image ..but full on the last week..plus crashing over and over..I just couldn't get excited today plus I was trying to gather rocks and do cementing...And I need sleep and food..maybe again next week and I will apply a proper approach...
If you want I could email you some stacks but only if you are interested for your sake if you see what I mean..if you want something to experiment with..
I am totally surprised you did as well as you did..I tried similar with something for Carlton and the image from here was just too small.

Thanks again.
Alex
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Old 08-06-2020, 05:34 PM
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Sorry I was a little tired yesterday but I had a good six hours sleep and awoke refreshed and after a packet of noodles attacked this thing again.

First realisation..my cheap version of Photoshop does not appear to allow RBG mapping, I plan to get a rented version..my daughter has one that I will check out..I could not get layers working in Gimp but after watching some videos I am convinced it is a great substitute for Photoshop...maybe I need a newer version...however I tried combining in Startools and got that worked out..working a mask in this syage I have yet to work out a good method...lucky the blueish stuff camr thru with no mask..which one of the videos suggested... I did a touch up in Photoshop and in my real old gimp but I managed this from starting in Startools with oxygen..blue..HA ..green and as I had no S11 I used my red...anyways I need to post it here as that is the only way I can judge the final result...again I dialled down saturation but I have a feeling not enough...forgive my obsessive behaviour.
alex
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Old 09-06-2020, 04:39 PM
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Hi Alex,

Have a look at one of the YouTube videos on using the Compose module and be sure to use the 1.6.x versions as it makes narrowband processing super easy.
Load your SII as using the Red/S-II button, Ha using the Green/Ha button, and O-III as Blue/O-III button. Set exposure times as recorded for each channel.
Process the detail as normal (ST will automatically create a synthetic luminance frame for you from the three stacks with "Luminance, Color" set to "L + Synthetic L from RGB, RGB"). You will be processing the detail in mono, until you hit the Color module.
Once you hit the Color module, use the SHO (HST) preset for a start, and then marvel at the many different color renditions you can achieve with a single click using the Matrix parameter. There is bound to be one to your liking!
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Old 09-06-2020, 07:55 PM
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Hi Alex,

Have a look at one of the YouTube videos on using the Compose module and be sure to use the 1.6.x versions as it makes narrowband processing super easy.
Load your SII as using the Red/S-II button, Ha using the Green/Ha button, and O-III as Blue/O-III button. Set exposure times as recorded for each channel.
Process the detail as normal (ST will automatically create a synthetic luminance frame for you from the three stacks with "Luminance, Color" set to "L + Synthetic L from RGB, RGB"). You will be processing the detail in mono, until you hit the Color module.
Once you hit the Color module, use the SHO (HST) preset for a start, and then marvel at the many different color renditions you can achieve with a single click using the Matrix parameter. There is bound to be one to your liking!
Thank you..I am absolutely impressed that you would help me.

I took a look on my phone but will look on my desk top when the batteries recharge.

Thank you..a thousand times thank you.

I have always felt StarTools was a great outfit , the way you dealt with my enquiries I doubt anyone else would be that kind...folk need to appreciate just what StarTools represents in terms of help and concern..I always felt that I was important and not just another client.

For my part I will try and show just how good a product StarTools is for all astrophotograpers..I feel the only limitation with the program is the user cause the more I work with it the more that opens up......and that it can do all that more expensive programs claim.

It is great.

Thanks I really appreciate you taking the time to help little old me..that is really something.
Alex
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Old 10-06-2020, 11:05 AM
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Thank you..I am absolutely impressed that you would help me.
No problem Alex! When it's a passion, none of it feels like work or a bother.

Do feel free to send over a dataset if you'd like a quick workflow, or, at the very least a second pair of eyes on your dataset.

Clear skies!
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Old 10-06-2020, 01:42 PM
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No problem Alex! When it's a passion, none of it feels like work or a bother.

Do feel free to send over a dataset if you'd like a quick workflow, or, at the very least a second pair of eyes on your dataset.

Clear skies!
You are very kind and I really appreciate your offer...I still have not done anything, I am not well and was only able to move an hour ago..but it is raining here so no power.I am not well enough to pull start the genny ..the key start is not working...

But I must say I have been absolutely impressed with the StarTools crew from the start..I had some problem and emailed for help and a lovely lady was just so helpful. And you don't always get that..I am a fan and will do my best to show what can be done..and hopefully that will encourage others to go StarTools because if a mug like me can get good results it must be a good choice for others more competent.

Tomorrow is out as the lovely new solar panel I purchased yesterday has a problem and I need to take it back to Lismore tomorrow..fortunately my neighbour dropped by and was able to test it ..he knew of a particular problem these had and unfortunately mine had it.
Friday I won't get anything done as I have arranged with him to get the electrics in this van working..probably just the twelve volt stuff and just forget the 240 volt stuff..he is a member here actually but into radio astronomy.

Thanks again..StarTools rules.

Alex
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