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Old 26-02-2019, 09:51 PM
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Ukastronomer (Jeremy)
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Question for the Ha imagers and viewers please

I have the setup in the photograph.

Quark daystar Ha, 72mm Ed

1. Would you expect to see granulation and detail on the sun visually, see photo 2, NOT mine.

2. If so what am I doing wrong as all I ever see is a plain sun no detail

Thanks
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Old 26-02-2019, 10:01 PM
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With a DS Lunt, yes. Plenty of surface detail visually, but not like your example photo - that looks like a coloured white light shot to me and not Ha.

The attached photo is fairly realistic visually.
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Old 26-02-2019, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by AstroJunk View Post
With a DS Lunt, yes. Plenty of surface detail visually, but not like your example photo - that looks like a coloured white light shot to me and not Ha.

The attached photo is fairly realistic visually.
Sorry but I was specifically asking about the Daystar setup not what others get thank you

Thanks for the comments though, MUCH appreciated

THE REASON IS THAT Daystar filters do not work like other Ha scopes

Last edited by Ukastronomer; 01-03-2019 at 11:01 PM.
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Old 26-02-2019, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Ukastronomer View Post
Sorry but I was specifically asking about the Daystar setup not what others get thank you

Thanks for the comments though, appreciated
Jeremy,
I think you were politely told what you would get with a ha setup.
The image you showed is a coloured white light shot probably taken with a scope over 100mm Dia with a camera with a bit of grunt in white light. It was processed to look like that. You also need bloody good seeing.
Jonathan is a very experienced solar viewer and imager . And his opinion in my view counts.

My opinion not so much but I do have an example which is mine
http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_02.jpg
It is a white light shot

This is a ha shot made from sticking a few grabs to make a disc http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_03.jpg

What Jonathan showed you is close to what you should see through the camera

If that doesn't suit you then go here

https://solarchatforum.com
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  #5  
Old 26-02-2019, 11:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h0ughy View Post
Jeremy,
I think you were politely told what you would get with a ha setup.
The image you showed is a coloured white light shot probably taken with a scope over 100mm Dia with a camera with a bit of grunt in white light. It was processed to look like that. You also need bloody good seeing.
Jonathan is a very experienced solar viewer and imager . And his opinion in my view counts.

My opinion not so much but I do have an example which is mine
http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_02.jpg
It is a white light shot

This is a ha shot made from sticking a few grabs to make a disc http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_03.jpg

What Jonathan showed you is close to what you should see through the camera

If that doesn't suit you then go here

https://solarchatforum.com
I appreciate what the poster said which is why I thanked them for their time,
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Old 26-02-2019, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h0ughy View Post
Jeremy,
I think you were politely told what you would get with a ha setup.
The image you showed is a coloured white light shot probably taken with a scope over 100mm Dia with a camera with a bit of grunt in white light. It was processed to look like that. You also need bloody good seeing.
Jonathan is a very experienced solar viewer and imager . And his opinion in my view counts.

My opinion not so much but I do have an example which is mine
http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_02.jpg
It is a white light shot

This is a ha shot made from sticking a few grabs to make a disc http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_03.jpg

What Jonathan showed you is close to what you should see through the camera

If that doesn't suit you then go here

https://solarchatforum.com
Thanks for the link



Many thanks, appreciated

Last edited by Ukastronomer; 27-02-2019 at 12:15 AM.
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  #7  
Old 27-02-2019, 04:15 AM
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THIS is all I ever see
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  #8  
Old 27-02-2019, 04:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h0ughy View Post
Jeremy,
I think you were politely told what you would get with a ha setup.
The image you showed is a coloured white light shot probably taken with a scope over 100mm Dia with a camera with a bit of grunt in white light. It was processed to look like that. You also need bloody good seeing.
Jonathan is a very experienced solar viewer and imager . And his opinion in my view counts.

My opinion not so much but I do have an example which is mine
http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_02.jpg
It is a white light shot

This is a ha shot made from sticking a few grabs to make a disc http://www.parkes.atnf.csiro.au/news...d_Hough_03.jpg

What Jonathan showed you is close to what you should see through the camera

If that doesn't suit you then go here

https://solarchatforum.com


When "viewing" the Ha, do you actually SEE this detail or only when imaged
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Old 27-02-2019, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukastronomer View Post
I have the setup in the photograph.

Quark daystar Ha, 72mm Ed

1. Would you expect to see granulation and detail on the sun visually, see photo 2, NOT mine.

2. If so what am I doing wrong as all I ever see is a plain sun no detail

Thanks
For the image you've shown, being able to see the dark lines between the solar granules determines whether you will see:

1. a smooth orange yellow disc with an earth sized black sunspot hole or
2. a red/orange/black detailed granular image showing filaments entering the black sunspot.

Based on the image, the dark lines between the solar granules are in the region of 0.3 -0.5 arcseconds wide (and larger in some areas). You will not see (nor image) this detail with a small telescope. In order to see?/image such would require a large aperture telescope, excellent seeing adaptive optics or better yet something in orbit.

You will be able to see/image some degree of granulation, with a large enough aperture scope with sufficient abberation free resolution but would be limited to solar detail probably no smaller than 1 to 1.5 arc seconds being limited by typical excellent/good seeing, unless you go a dessert somewhere in Chile for, I think: 0.6 to 1 second type seeing (although I'm not sure if that's still achieved for daytime seeing). Anyway, with such seeing someone with probably ~2000-3000mm focal length and sufficient aperture and cameras would have a good show at some excellent results.

Best
JA

Last edited by JA; 27-02-2019 at 11:26 AM.
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  #10  
Old 27-02-2019, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukastronomer View Post
When "viewing" the Ha, do you actually SEE this detail or only when imaged
When it is in focus and the seeing is good you see a lot of wavy detail. Your image is not focused. Also the daystar is a barlowed camera, so seeing will be crucial. Focus on the outer limb first you will have to adjust the gain settings and tweak the bandwidth knob to get some features.
Here is an example https://youtu.be/Gdw98SoUiDg
And earlier in 2012
https://youtu.be/-uOo_bK7LoM
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Old 27-02-2019, 08:38 PM
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many thanks
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Old 28-02-2019, 10:30 AM
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Jeremy,

What model Quark do you have, Chromasphere or Prominence? This makes a big difference.

It is the Chromasphere model that will show more granulation. If you have the Prom. model, like I do, granulation is there, but it takes a patient eye to view it, and patience with waiting for the tuning to do its thing.

A Quark does not have the range of tuning capability of a dedicated Ha scope, even from that of modest PST. This is why there are two Quark models, each designed for a specific aspect of Ha viewing. This is the trade off that Daystar has always been at pains to express.

My Prom. Quark is stupendous with prominences. I can see chromasphere details, but I need to be much more patient. Even with all my patience, I still sometimes need a helping hand from something like a dedicated Ha scope to track down the chromasphere features through my Quark, or as I more often do, use the H alpha network web site to get an Ha image to chase down these features:

http://halpha.nso.edu

What also helps with bringing out chromasphere features is to change eyepieces to vary the magnification and hence the contrast range. This is a BIG help. I even sometimes use a 0.5X 1.25" reducer to really squeeze the image when using a 30mm plossl. It doesn't increase the TFOV, but what it does is concentrate the image which helps the eye in its response to pulling out chromasphere details. Don't just use the one eyepiece or magnification with a Quark. Varying the magnification is a very good trick.

I use my Quark with an ED80. I can just get a whole of disk image with it, but it's not what I would describe as a usable whole of disk image - scope has too long a focal length for the Quark to do this. But this isn't a concern for me as I am primarily chasing proms, and any surface features I pull are an added bonus.

The last two pics below of my sketches shows I can see plages, sunspots, filaments and all manner of other surface features with my Quark. Just don't rush your gear or your eyes.

ALSO, right now there has been little solar activity, which makes spotting granulation on the surface more difficult for our eyes as there is bugger all features to allow our eyes to focus on and make their necessary adjustments. This current solar activity minimum has been a very deep one. Very little activity of any kind has been visible for some time. So not entirely your fault either. If you look at the GONG site linked above, you will see the Sun really is showing bugger all activity. Next to nothing really.

Alex.

PS, the Quark is not a camera. It is an Ha optical filter with electronic tuning of the etalon. There is no CCD or CMOS or other such element inside.
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Last edited by mental4astro; 28-02-2019 at 12:35 PM. Reason: more info
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Old 28-02-2019, 06:32 PM
Wavytone (Nick)
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Love those sketches !
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Old 28-02-2019, 07:33 PM
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Chromosphere, thanks
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Old 01-03-2019, 01:11 AM
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Ok clever person (nice way)

barlow on a Quark, I thought it had a barlow (telecentric) built in dumb question, add another ???
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Old 01-03-2019, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Ukastronomer View Post
Ok clever person (nice way)

barlow on a Quark, I thought it had a barlow (telecentric) built in dumb question, add another ???
Jeremy,
There are no excuses here, be polite and respect those that have politely answered your question.

If you don't like the response don't reply to it. However I am sure that there are those with experience who have answered you.
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Old 01-03-2019, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by h0ughy View Post
Jeremy,
There are no excuses here, be polite and respect those that have politely answered your question.

If you don't like the response don't reply to it. However I am sure that there are those with experience who have answered you.
You need to understand the use of English (nice way)

I clearly stated Ok clever person (NICE WAY)

in other words tongue in cheek, you are clever where as I am not

It was a compliment, in English obvously mis-understood by you

Perhaps the fact that as I have stated here all too often I am AUTISTIC, I have co morbid ADHD and ASPERGERS means I write "literally", but should NOT have to explain myself every time

If you had taken the time to re read what I said "Ok clever person (nice way)" (nice way) you would have seen it was a compliment and not rude

Next time |I will add a few


Oh, and he and I have been talking a lot in PMs, the person is VERY helpful and I thank him here for his much appreciated help.

Last edited by Ukastronomer; 01-03-2019 at 11:00 PM.
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Old 01-03-2019, 11:59 PM
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Jeremy, no need to add a bunch of

Not any more

Your friend,

Alex.
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Old 02-03-2019, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by mental4astro View Post
Jeremy, no need to add a bunch of

Not any more

Your friend,

Alex.


Can I say, thank you to everyone on this forum, I have been on many (and banned from two because of my Autism and lack of communication skills)

This is the nicest forum I have ever been on
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Old 02-03-2019, 12:47 AM
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Jeremy, no need to add a bunch of

Not any more

Your friend,

Alex.


You are a good man Charlie Brown ..............................
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