View Full Version here: : Michael Angelo had an epiphany
09-07-2012, 08:12 PM
I am as some of you may remember working on a narrow band and broad band image of the objects of NGC6188 and NGC 6164. I have now added a lot more data but have arrived at what I think is acceptable until I add more data. Doing this type of image requires a lot of time. So far nearly 5 hours but the processing is tripled.
For those interested I think if I add 2 more images in the RGB each. 4 or so more in the Ha. Around double for the SII and triple for the OII. That later two are still very noisey and will need hours more data.
For the title information, I remember the image of God touching the hand of Adam (http://cdn.openculture.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/sistinevirtual.png) in his creation. I wonder if Michael Angelo had an epiphany or if I am looking at shapes in the image. Look for the touching hands.
Click here (http://paulhaese.net/NGC6188andNGC6164.html)for image.
I like this colour scheme. Although the lower part of the image is very dark. I will try to aim for grey there when I finally have all the data. I think the image is now good enough, but for completeness I want to get the data as above.
Feel free to comment.
09-07-2012, 08:30 PM
Love the image, but it looks more like a pair of claws to me, Paul :lol:
09-07-2012, 08:56 PM
Yes, like two eagles claws coming together.
09-07-2012, 09:18 PM
Nicely done Paul. Good star colour and 6164 has come out really well.
09-07-2012, 09:33 PM
Great image Paul!
So much detail and love the colour.
Looking great Paul with wonderful colours.
Its funny you make the reference to Michelangelo - I've been sucking down data in this area recently (inspired by the stunner Martin put up a couple of months ago), and looking at the Ha data the other night was thinking exactly the same thing :)
Seems others have "seen the light" too..... :)
09-07-2012, 11:11 PM
Shaping up nicely Paul. I like the colours. I think you need a bit of imagination to see the Michelangelo fresco though. I can more easily imagine Mike S's fighting dragons in there - the one on the right definitely has legs. The portrait orientation maybe makes the top bit seem a bit squeezy but I understand that you needed to do it this way to fit in NGC 6164 comfortably.
09-07-2012, 11:16 PM
It looks great to me already so whatever you add would be a bonus.
You never cease to amaze me, awesome stuff.
10-07-2012, 12:53 AM
Almost majical looking
10-07-2012, 06:24 AM
Amazing photo Paul.....and even more amazing imagination!
10-07-2012, 10:26 AM
Very good indeed Paul ! How did the meridian flip go?
10-07-2012, 10:38 AM
The view is just begging to be shifted up a tad :doh:but it is looking good none the less Paul ..the level of residual noise wouldn't really bother me :thumbsup:
10-07-2012, 11:15 AM
That's looking very good Paul, and a great choice of colours too! Like others have said maybe shifting the FOV slight up to include the area around the NGC6193 cluster would balance things nicely, but I understand you wanted to include NGC6164 which has also come up beautifully.
10-07-2012, 12:38 PM
No question, lovely image, but all you imagers who use the stars as some form of Rorschach ink blot need to get some serious rebirthing therapy.
10-07-2012, 12:54 PM
In a word .... AWESOME !!!!
10-07-2012, 01:42 PM
Yes, very nicely done Paul! An unusual framing, but it works!! :thumbsup:
10-07-2012, 01:57 PM
I tend to agree with Mike, the framing is a little unbalanced, as there is much structure hidden from view in your north-south framing...but hey, it's a fantastic area of the night sky that you've captured well.
10-07-2012, 02:24 PM
Thanks all, your comments are much appreciated.
This is partly how I came to think about this. I was doing a search of images and saw a transitional image from this video and though yeah it does look like that.
David, I did not end up doing that for this image. I have been imaging to the meridian and then going onto another object. I currently have three images on the go but this one is at a stage of presentation.
Yes I do see what everyone is on about. I spent nearly 20 minutes trying to find the right center point and in the end this was a compromise.
re the noise, I guess I have been spoiled by Chris's recent shot of 13 hours and of course yours. I think I just need that little bit more data to put it to bed.
You will note I have tried to respect the light here too. :)
It seems to be a consensus on this and I can see everyone's point. I struggled with the framing in my planning too. The small emission nebula is not well shown in the sky6 and my sensor only covers about 1.89" per pixel. Perhaps it needs a mosaic or maybe I need a bigger sensor. Mosaic might be easier. :)
10-07-2012, 04:26 PM
I guess the rule of thirds suggests you should lift the framing up a tad. Since that's not possible - just crop it! That's even easier!! :)
10-07-2012, 06:03 PM
Really nice result from that setup. Very 3D and I like the colour scheme. NB is definitely the way to go with this object.
I think you got as much as you're going to get with that unless you do a mosaic which is tough.
My opinion is the 8300 chip is not the ideal camera for your TSA102. Your STL11 is.
The "problem" with the 8300 chip is it is quite small and so you get a digital zoom factor and this stretches the resolution of the 4 inch APO too much and you are asking it to capture beyond its resolution limits so the result can look slightly strained.
Look at the many FSQ106/STL11 images that are sensational. Large chip sensors with 9 micron pixels take the pressure off the 4 inch APO to perform more like a 140mm + APO. Its like a sweet spot and the image comes alive as a result and you get more territory in the one image.
Just my opinion. Whack your STL onto the TSA and see how it goes.
I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
KAF8300 seems to fit best in medium focal length (1500-2000mm) with larger apertures like 8 inches and above. It doesn't perform well either in the longer focal lengths - 2500mm + without an AO or super seeing.
10-07-2012, 06:09 PM
Congratulations Paul .. this is a fantastic shot ...
All the best,
10-07-2012, 07:36 PM
With respect I disagree with this statement Greg. With the 8300 I am getting a resolution of 1.89" per pixel with the reducer. That is hardly what would call giving a slightly strained look Greg. It is entirely possible my processing on this image is causing that look. If you look through my other images with the TSA there are plenty of them that look natural and many of those are with hours in excess of 7 hours. This image only has 4.8 hours and hence looking not well finished.
Anyway horses for courses. :)
10-07-2012, 07:55 PM
Nice work Paul, I see you have rotated the image slightly since you last presented it. I love the planetary in the image.
10-07-2012, 09:01 PM
Strained look is probably a poor choice of words. Its more the broader field that gives the image a different look. Anyway try your STL 11 out on it someday and see if like it or not.
10-07-2012, 10:21 PM
Yes that makes sense Greg. I have done one mosaic so far and ought to investigate this further at some point.
I don't think the STL will work as I think the focusor will vignette the sensor too much. However I will give it a go, once I get the RC12 sorted.
10-07-2012, 10:23 PM
Thanks Grant, Leo and Pete, appreciate your thoughts.
11-07-2012, 05:56 AM
I really love the colour scheme on this, the upper quadrants look fantastic. It has a beautiful ethereal look to the image.
I'd buy a print of it, no question.
I would agree with you on gaining a bit more data to reduce the noise, it is a cracking image with so many hours invested in it that I reckon it is worth finishing off and getting it pretty much perfect.
It is so good that it really does scream out for a mosaic, but man that is a lot of committment...
11-07-2012, 10:18 PM
Thanks Peter. Hmmmm maybe a mosaic is a necessity in the next year or so. Beauty of my setup is that I can get repeatable results now and image from year to year so long as I don't rotate the camera. Even then I can plate solve and get the camera into the same orientation again.
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