SkyX version ? + PHD Guiding

[TheCrazedLog]

Hey all:

I have a NEQ6 running EQMod for preference and have been fighting Stellarium and StellariumScope for the better part of a year. I'm starting to tire of it and am eyeing off SkyX. Question is, which version?

Given that I want guiding, I'm thinking the SAE version is the way to go. Can someone confirm this and, if possible, show me where to find a good, no nonsense comparative feature list? I don't seem to be able to find one, which is a pity. I don't know if I want Pro or SAE. I would like to stay with EQMod if possible (see note below). I'm interested in doing mosaic wide fields (and have done so in the past) so that may factor into it. DLSR mounted on top of the scope.

Further to that, if I use my Meade DSI (2 I think?) as a guiding camera, will I need to buy their guiding software or can I still use PHD Guidedog?

I already have alignmaster and regard it very highly, so I guess I'm not interested in tPoint.

Does anyone have any suggestions on setups? Price of course is minimal :P

Currently the problems I've been having with Eqmod are:
- Several seperate programs running. The more programs, the more chance of things going wrong.
- Not to mention losing track of which program you need to alt-tab into.
- Stellarium. It is good. There's no question of that... but its very good at one thing and one thing only: Showing you whats up there. You then need to get various addins and bolt them together and.... yeah. I'm looking for an integrated package.
- EQMod. I love it, but I hate it. Several times last night it would lock up, disconnect from the mount or drive the damn thing backwards. Then I found that the emergency stop button had been mapped to the slew west button. That slowed me down for a while.
I prefer to avoid vendor lock in, so if SkyX only works with SkyX stuff, then I'll have to think hard. I prefer to keep my options open.

Penny for your thoughts?

[Moon]

What's your main camera? If it's a CCD, then one very clean option is to use the planetarium program inside Maxim DL and forget about TheSky/ Stellarium. The plate solve feature is awesome. LINK (http://deepspaceplace.com/maximdltips.php)
If you're using a DSLR, then it's not a good option.
James

[TheCrazedLog]

Hey:

DLSR with a crappy CCD as a backup.

I should point out though that I'm not specalizing here, this is meant to be a jack of all trades setup. CCD, DLSR and visual.

ta

[Visionoz]

Seems a bit strange that you're having issues with Stellarium + StellariumScope - I use it both on my SiTech-driven Losmandy G11 as well as my "portable" EQ6 Pro mounts and find that Gotos & Syncs are just a button press away!

Don't think that Stellarium just shows you what's up there only - I just have to do a Ctrl 1 and it just slews to the target that I had picked in Stellarium

YMMV

Cheers

[TheCrazedLog]

Bill:

Oh yes I agree. I wasn't very precise: What I meant was more than Stellarium cannot give you a list of targets for the night and let you filter by them. I can't say to Stellarium "I want some DSOs tonight, what have you got for me?".

I will continue to use stellarium, but interested to see why SkyX can do for me.

[mithrandir]

Have you tried "Tonights Sky"? It doesn't pretend to do anything beyond giving you a list of targets, in chronological order.

http://njstargazer.org/PROG/PROG.asp

[frolinmod]

I have a question for you. What do you need TheSkyX to work with and in what way do you need it to work with them? (Or them work with TheSkyX, it's a two way street?) I'm sure you already know it works with ASCOM and thence EQMOD. When I'm not using it with my Paramount, I use it with a homemade USB to mount cable (really just a $20 FTDI cable) to control my (Orion Atlas) EQ-6. Actually I should just use the Atlas EQ-G mount selection already in TheSkyX natively and go through the hand controller, but I really wanted to try out EQMOD.

[Tandum]

You might be able to get a copy of Sky6 off someone. I use it with the tak and eq6 and it works well with eqmod and I prefer it to skyx. I've used skyx at a friends place who has a pmx mount and it seems to be a product in development. They seem to be trying to suck all imaging functions into skyx so there are camera add ons, dome add ons etc etc to run everything out of skyx. Of course the add ons increase the price and I believe they want you to pay yearly for the privilage. I am also more comfortable with the sky6 display but I'm sure everyone is more comfortable with what they are used to.

[frolinmod]

Note that the add-ons have no subscription fees. They're all integrated into TheSkyX (i.e., are already in there and all that is needed is a license key to enable them). Also you only need to pay TheSkyX's subscription fee if you want access to TheSkyX updates. Otherwise just don't pay it. Your software will continue to function just fine. Nothing bad will happen. And if you later change your mind and want access to TheSkyX updates, just pay your back subscription fees. Note that the subscription doesn't even start until and unless you register the software (which happens automatically at purchase time if you buy direct online from Software Bisque).

Also, SB's licensing policy in practice is extremely user friendly. They have a license key, but have no draconian enforcement with hardware checks, dongles, expiration dates or anything of the sort. It's up to you and your ethics to abide by the license - or not. You're only supposed to install on two computers, but you could actually install on an unlimited number of computers if you really needed to. Where I come from that is a breath of fresh air.

I like TheSkyX a lot. I think it's way better than TheSky6. I use TheSkyX to operate a Paramount ME, I use it often and I use most of it's features in the process. I also keep up-to-date with every single new "daily build" as they become available. TheSkyX has way better ASCOM support than TheSky6 ever did. There are also a bunch of X2 plug-ins available that just plain don't exist for TheSky6. TheSkyX is under active development. It gets better and better all the time. TheSky6 is not only dead, but it's been dead for a few years now.

[allan gould]

you could try Astroplanner. It has direct links to EQMOD and a built in planetarium as well as sorting out all visible objects etc mfrom its very, very extensive data bases.
I also use a Planetarium prograM CALLED eARTH cENTERED UNIVERSE WHICH IS VERY CHEAP BUT EXTENSIVE. iTS PLAIN VANILLA BUT VERY CLEAN EASY TO USE. iF YOU WANT FREE THEN DONT GO PAST cdc AS IT ALSO INYTEGRATES VERY WELL WITH eqmod.

PS Sorry about the CAPS, didnt mean to shout but just have thick fingers.

[TheCrazedLog]

Hi all:

Thanks for all the replies. Eqmod works with skyx apparently. Any suggestions on versions? SAE vs Pro?
Thanks for the other links I'll check them out.

[frolinmod]

I've never used the serious version. I use the professional version here. Anything I write or have written about it applies to the professional version.

[Terry B]

I use TSXP and it is ok. I do find that it crashes all the time though. In using it with ASCOM controlling my NJP Tak mount. With CCDSoft as the capture software it crashes every time I do Multiple exposures with guiding running. This is very frustrating. Not sure how to advise for your situation.

[frolinmod]

Terry, what versions and build numbers of TSX and CCDSoft are you running? With the exception of the experimental all sky plate solve which I can crash on demand, I've never seen a TSX crash in all the time I've been using it. Have you reported those crashes to SB and explained how to reproduce them?

[Terry B]

The build number is 7.14.10.4943
Ccdsoft is 5.00.210
I haven't reported it to SB but did ask on the temma driver website. they were not helpful
It comes up with an error
"failed to unmarshall dispatch pointer Temma handbox v 6.0.18
Ascom 6.0.6056.1963"
It occurs if the guider is working fast. An example would be if I'm using the AO unit at 5hz and then try and take a time series. The first image will work then the error comes up. Both programmes will hang until I click the error button. Then TSXP will crash and CCDSoft will continue on. If I goude at 2 sec exposures it mostly doesn't crash but will occasionally.
I have tried tonight connecting to the mount with the built in temma driver rather than the ASCOM temma driver. This seemed to solve the problem but the driver is much poorer. It doesn't have a nice park routine making T point data not useable from night to night.
I will post it to SB and see if they are interested in fixing it. They don't seem to keen of assisting ASCOM problems though.

[frolinmod]

Terry, WOW!

I've been running TheSkyX for years now and never seen a version that old. Is that the real version number or a typo?

As Jonathan wrote over on the SB forums, your TheSkyX is a few years old. Please install the newest full install, the update, then the daily build as per Jonathan's instructions. You do need to apply the TheSkyX daily build and not just the full install and update because even the last update was something like last September and there's been a lot of activity since then.

You can also install the latest CCDSoft daily build. I think the CCDSoft daily build has a manual install, where you open the archive and copy a .EXE file over the top of the older one. So you should first rename your old one. Not as much has changed there. Few bug fixes is about all I think.

All things considered, you're probably also running an old version of the X2 to ASCOM converter as well. Please download and install the latest one from ascom -standards.org. Or maybe you're still trying to use TELEAPI? If so, please switch over to using the X2 to ASCOM converter instead. I remember the unmarshal problem having been fixed. I think by Evan Warkentine or Bob Denny.

I suspect after you update your TheSkyX, CCDSoft and X2 to ASCOM converter versions, that the problem will be fixed. In any case, please do those things and report back (to the SB forum). I'm just a user like yourself. I don't work for SB.

Actually they are very keen on resolving problems. They can't however fix ASCOM problems. If the problem turns out to be in ASCOM (the driver in question or in the converter) and not TheSkyX, or if it's not clear where the problem is, then it also needs to be posted over on the yahoogroups.com ASCOM-Talk forum so that the ASCOM guys can see it. Sometimes when ASCOM is involved its still not at all clear exactly where the problem is. In that case many people (including the reporting user) may have to work together to resolve the problem. Of course, if it turns out to be a TheSkyX problem and they can reproduce it, then it can get fixed directly said fix appearing in the next daily build. Note that although the build occurs daily, it doesn't get released until needed and stable.

[Terry B]

Inteesting. I run TSXP on my home computer and the one in the observatory. The observatory one isnt commected to the net so I don't check its version. If you run the update checker it states that it is up to date.
They both have the most recent full install just not the daily build. (10.1.11)
My ASCOM is not very old and I'm using the X2 converter. I will update them all and see if it makes any difference.

[frolinmod]

Okay, so maybe that was a typo in your post after all. You reported running version 7.14.10.4943?

The daily build is not something that the update checker checks for. The last update was 10.1.11. But that was a long time ago. A lot of fixes and enhancements have accumulated since then. It's about time the Bisques create another update with all the accumulated daily build stuff in it. But until they do, the only way to get them is to install the latest daily build.

[frolinmod]

Indeed it does. Note that it also works with the mount natively directly through the handset without needing to go through ASCOM or EQMOD. They call it the Orion Atlas or Sirius EQ-G though rather than the Skywatcher. Here is a short cut and past from that section of their supported mounts webpage located here:
http://www.bisque.com/help/theskyx%20pro%20info/welcome.htm#telescope_control.htm


Orion® Telescopes & Binoculars


Atlas™ EQ-G Equatorial Mounts

This mount uses the same control system (and the same serial communication protocol) as the NexStar GPS and other later model Celestron International "go to" telescopes.

Sirius™ EQ-G Equatorial Mounts
This mount uses the same control system (and the same serial communication protocol) as the NexStar GPS and other later model Celestron International "go to" telescopes.

[Terry B]

When I looked at the version on the puter it had the number above as well as the 10.1.11 number above it. I assumed the 7.14 etc number was the daily build number. This may have been wrong. I have only had TSXP for a year as my version expires in a few days so it can't have been that old.

[frolinmod]

TheSkyX expires? Perhaps your update access subscription expires, but not your software. TheSkyX never expires.

Yup, it can be that old. TheSkyX is not TheSky6. They've been adding stuff left and right. Mostly little stuff though.

[Terry B]

This is true. I just meant the updates. I got an email from them a few days ago stating the updates will cease if I don't resubscribe. This is why I knew it was a year ago that I bought it. I will wait and see before paying any more money.

[frolinmod]

Sounds good.

I'm on pins and needles here. Is the problem still there after getting current on versions and/or builds of everything involved? Like I wrote, I could almost swear that one was in the X2 to ASCOM converter and that Bob Denny fixed it at some point. But if not, then if you can tell the guys how to reproduce it on the current software, this'll be another opportunity to nail it.

[Terry B]

I've updated everything and had an attempt as making it crash tonight. I succeeded in crashing it first time. However I seem to have found something that seems so far to stop the crashes. I have changed the Crosshairs update interval to 1 sec rather than 1/2sec that it was set at. This seems to have stopped the crashing so far. I will have to do more time series to check if this is the case.

[frolinmod]

Well, that's a bummer that it's still there!

The next thing to do is to take it over to ASCOM-Talk, specifically to Bob Denny and give him an opportunity to look at it and mull it over, particularly with your new info concerning the affect of changing the update interval.

What we want Bob to do is go on over to the thread on SB's forum and either say, "I think this is ASCOM" or "I think this is TSX." Bob's thoughts carry a lot of weight over there. He commands a lot of respect. In any case, it'll get them talking to each other about it, which is what we want.

I realize you probably went through this whole thing a year ago, but it needs to be done again.