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supernova1965
20-02-2011, 07:08 AM
I was just watching the Universe Gravity episode and they talked about a very interesting theory on moving Earth to a larger orbit as the sun expands very interesting concept:question: This link is about the method mentioned in the episode

http://www.usatoday.com/news/science/astro/2001-02-15-orbit.htm

renormalised
20-02-2011, 09:32 AM
Why would we want to...by the time the Sun starts to expand as a red giant, the Earth will have already been a dead planet for a very long time.

We also seriously underestimate just how advanced we will be if we manage to last that long....5 billion years, think about it. Scientist by and large have rather limited imaginations. Using asteroids to shift the Earth's orbit...how prosaic and unimaginative can you be.

higginsdj
20-02-2011, 09:34 AM
I love these scientists who pop out of the wood work with moronic theories. They are so sure of achieving it with todays technology but their drawbacks are stated in terms of 'could', 'might' etc.

Must be grant application time so they need their 5 minutes of fame to justify their existence (yes I realise that I am being somewhat harsh and cavalier in my judgment)

Cheers

supernova1965
20-02-2011, 09:40 AM
I might be wrong but I am under the impression that the Goldilocks zone is moving outward even now and that earth is close relatively speaking to the inner edge of this zone that would be reason enough we might as well stay home as long as possible as it is a good solid base from which to develop the higher technologies we will need in the future. You know what I mean not keeping all our collective eggs in one basket. So we could have Earth and low earth orbit the Moon and Mars:question:

renormalised
20-02-2011, 09:48 AM
We won't reach a state of crisis, in so far as this is concerned, for another 900 million to 1.1 billion years!!!!. What would be the point in shifting anything. It would be easier just to up and leave the planet, which we would've been able to do far, far earlier than that. All these speculations are, is a poor exercise of the imagination...a rather weak what if. But one where they're wasting their efforts coming up with solutions. They'd be far better off coming up with the solution to a warp drive or wormhole transportation system than worrying about this.

supernova1965
20-02-2011, 09:56 AM
I know it is a long way in the future but unfortunatly I don't see the will to do what is needed and I feel that we appear to be dragging our feet ATM and what is going to snap us out of this we don't need to worry about it now mentality. I fear that mentality will be with us until it is too late to develop the need technology to do what is needed. Bring on Warp drive and Wormhole transportation I say:thumbsup:

renormalised
20-02-2011, 09:59 AM
Speculation about it is moot, really. Not only that, but because humanity at present is like it is doesn't mean it will be that way in the future. Our main problem now is the political systems and the politicians we have. What humanity will be like in a 1000 years, let alone 1 billion years is anyone's guess and it certainly won't be anything like it is now.

higginsdj
20-02-2011, 10:03 AM
Warren, we don't even possess the means to avoid asteroid/comet collisions (ie moving their orbit accurately) let alone worry about trying to move the earth in a billion years time.... In all likelihood it may be quicker, cheaper and more reliable to simply become a space fairing civilisation.... ie moving the earth is not the only option. Who knows, in 1 billion years we may possess the technology to break down all the metals the sun has manufactured back into Hydrogen and let it start it's cycle all over again.....

Cheers

multiweb
20-02-2011, 10:11 AM
I reckon the only way is to transfer one's consciounes into a machine so we are not limited by the constraints of our body needing food, O2, Water, right temperature, etc... Like a massive computer/container running some kind of virtual reality program so we exist in it and live the life... :P Doesn't matter how hard we try to preserve earth it's gonna get it eventually.

renormalised
20-02-2011, 10:31 AM
That's a possibility, although I wouldn't opt for that. Plus, by 5 billion years, I think even that would be so old hat, it'd be quaint. We'll probably have the computer and medical technology to be able to do that within 100-200 years.

mswhin63
20-02-2011, 11:03 AM
I think all forms of sciences will be able to get together to formulate and alter way of living. One thing to come to my mind is physic and chemistry working down to the subatomic level could allow us to create sustainable energy for our future bodies from other substances. Maybe by that time we would also be able to evolve into a completely different entity able to sustain ourselves in a completely different environment.

This most probably involve taking hydrogen atom and splicing it to create another element. Real alchemy that would be.

multiweb
20-02-2011, 11:20 AM
Then I choose to be made out of chocolate cheese cake :P

multiweb
20-02-2011, 11:21 AM
Wow! You reckon? Exciting times then hey? Blue screen of death will take a whole new meaning. ;)

supernova1965
20-02-2011, 11:35 AM
What and get eaten alive sorry about the light heartness in the science thread

renormalised
20-02-2011, 11:55 AM
You only have to look at the pace of technology to see where we might well be in that time....especially with computers.

Look at it this way....someone born in 1900...took 40 years to go from nothing to building the Spitfire fighter and the V2 rocket, another 21 years to put a man into orbit and only 8 years after that to goto the Moon. Your pocket calculator has more computing power than the Apollo XI Lunar Module and your laptop has more computing power than the whole of NASA back in 1969-1974 (length of time for program of manned flight to the Moon). The only thing stopping further manned exploration of the solar system is political will (to spend the money etc etc etc), not the technology (despite what NASA might say about it). We're going to be light years ahead of where we are now in 50 years, let alone another 100-200. All we have to do is get our act together on this planet and we'll manage to go places and do things we can't even dream of at present...in only a very short period of time.

Just so long as Microsoft and Bill Gates has nothing to do with it....:):):P:P

multiweb
20-02-2011, 12:09 PM
Interesting. Historically I agree. I mean it's hard to believe that 100 yrs ago most people where still riding horses but we have other problems now such as over-population, limited resources and cost. I would have thought that'd put a brake on research and reprioritize spending to domestic problems so to speak. But I guess you're better placed than me to have an opinion about this as you revolve closer to the scientific community. I'm just part of the chocolate cheesecake mob ;).

renormalised
20-02-2011, 12:45 PM
Cost is relative....in today's terms Apollo was cheap, but in absolute terms, it cost the US more to do what they did then, than what it would cost us now. When you consider the vast amount of money they waste each year on arms, fighting "terror" etc etc, then you can see what's going on. The cost isn't an issue, it's like you said...it's where they spend the money and how they spend it (or to be more accurate, how much money gets siphoned off into corporate and political coffers for their own benefit). They can't afford not to spend the money on research, even for fixing domestic issues because they'll condemn themselves to failure if they don't. In any case, it won't stop the acquisition of knowledge and if the US or someone like them doesn't do it, then someone else will.

In any case....I like chocolate cheesecake....yum:):)