Electricity supply conditioning.

[michaellxv]

Fact or crap???

Saw a story during the week on ACA about a device which would smooth out the typical dirty electricity supply we get thereby making appliances work more efficiently using less electricity.

Can't find the story now or any reference to the device.
This device was not a UPS. Basically looked like a small box installed inline with your supply in the meter box.

1. Anyone heard of such a device?
2. Does it work?
3. If I get solar panels installed does this have the same effect? Do solar panels supply clean power. Does the whole setup smooth out the grid supply?

[Barrykgerdes]

It was on This day tonight yesterday or the day before. it is claimed to work but there is no scientific proof to back it up.

barry

[GTB_an_Owl]

ACA had a follow up last nite

the machine "cleans" up the power ok - but in doing so, increases the wattage
which is what the power companies charge you for

so it looks like installing one of these will actually increase your power bill

geoff

[michaellxv]

Thanks guys. I will just keep looking at my solar power options.

[mswhin63]

Can't get something for nothing, the only thing that could be done is chopping up the power to run lower power but then the appliance runs at lower torque.

When I saw it seemed a bit too far fetched but the media seem to love placing something without checking the facts.

I also remember a device that created inductance into older meter that could confuse it and reduce the power reading but if that was true it would be illegal.

[mill]

The device will only work if it is installed before the meter.
Cleaning up after the meter is of no use because the meter already recorded the power consumption.
Installing anything before the meter is illegal :(

[DavidTrap]

Sounds like Peter Brock's Fuel Polariser or a HyClone!!

DT

[kinetic]

A guy described this news item to me at work.
It could be a line conditioner and power factor correction device.
The only possible way I could see something like this lowering your
power bill is if:
1. you have a lot of inductive load...like a pool pump running many hours
a day.
2. Corrective capacitance banks (which I would think add load to
start with) could switch in and out according to how inductive the
load was...ie an intelligent monitoring of your load.

So it's probably PF correcting equipment.

Steve

[gary]

Hi Michael,

I am a Professional Electrical Engineer, so maybe I can help.

In the case of what we call "Power Factor Correction", this has nothing to
do with the electrical supply being "dirty".

Instead, power factor, which is the ratio of what is termed "real power" and
what is termed "apparent power", arrives from the fundamental laws of physics.

Suffice to say at university, to fully understand it at a grass roots level,
they instruct students in the mathematics of partial differential equations
and present them with Maxwell's equations and build up from there. We certainly
won't start from there in this brief response! :lol:

Instead, imagine if you will, AC power being a sinusoidal waveform that
can be split into two components, a voltage waveform and a current waveform.

Most people will be familiar with the equation in DC power systems that the
Power = Voltage x Current, or P=VI. Because of the sinusoidal nature of
AC, the equation is slightly different, but just keep the DC equation for
power in your head for one moment.

Ideally, to maximize the instantaneous power, the voltage and current
components in an AC supply would be in perfect synchronization so that the
voltage waveform peaks and troughs corresponded to the current waveform
peaks and troughs. In other words, they would be said to be 'in phase'.

However, due to the effects of capacitance and inductance, the current
waveform can lead or lag the voltage waveform. The waveforms are not
'in phase' and the two waveforms aren't delivering the same sort of
power 'punch' as if they were in phase. By how much they don't overlap
is the Power Factor. It can vary between 0 and 1 and ideally it has a value of 1.

For those who enjoy equations, if we go back to the original equation for DC
power and now present the equivalent equation for average AC power, we would write -
Pav = Vrms * Irms * PF
where Vrms is a measure of the average voltage, Irms is a measure of the average
current and PF is the power factor. By way of further background, the power factor,
PF, is equivalent to the cosine of the angle by which the voltage and current waveforms
differ in phase. Thus a power actor of 0.9 implies that the current waveforms lags
the voltage waveform by arccos(0.9) = 25.8 degrees.

In practical terms, an inductive load comes about from many common types of
motors, such as an air conditioner or washing machine.

What Power Factor Correction devices attempt to do is if the load is inductive,
they supply extra capacitance.

In may jurisdictions around the world, the power company dictates to the consumer
what the lowest power factor they are allowed to have is. However, this is in
almost every case only mandated to large industrial power consumers. For example,
if you and I were to open an aluminium smelting plant, the power company will
dictate to us the minimum power factor our load will present and we will then have
to take steps by buying and installing additional equipment or devices to ensure those
requirements are met.

For household consumers, the power companies don't generally come knocking
on the door for us to install power factor correction devices.

What is more, in Australia, the way that the meter measures the amount of power
you use at home means that if you were to install a power factor correction
device, it won't save you any money but the power company would love it,
as it would save them money. :)



If you want to save money, then you would need to talk with professional
consultants and weigh up the cost of installing solar panels amortized over
so many years compared to just using the mains. But like power factor correction,
solar panels don't "clean" anything with regards the electricity, though they
may help keep the air cleaner. :)

In fact, the solar power system which produces DC is often converted to
AC by an inverter, which is a type of electronic switch. If you were to look
at the waveforms from a typical inverter on an oscilloscope and compare them
with the waveforms from the mains, then generally the mains supply is
a purer sinusoid.

Anyway, hope this insight helps a little. :thumbsup:

[ballaratdragons]

Thanks Gary.
Good explanation.

I saw both stories on Current Affair.
The first one, about the device saving you money, sounded a bit scammy to me. But not being an Electrical Engineer, I coudn't tell.

Then they followed up in the next episode with an Electrical Engineer showing how it could actually end up costing you more in power bills because in the process of 'cleaning up' the power, more watts were used.

We, the masses, pay for the watts we use, so this device, although showing a cleaner electricity, sucked more watts.

The reporter then went back to the salesman and got him to re-test his 'box'.
Yes, the power did clean up. Then he asked him to show the watts usage, and it was higher and the salesman looked very confused and embarrased on TV.

Even he had no idea that the device could end up raising your power bill. He has said that he will not sell any devices until he checks this out with experts.

At $600+ per box it could be a very convincing scam.

[michaellxv]

Thanks for the detailed explaination Gary. I am starting to get a picture of what the power factor means.

I have one of those cheap consumer grade (and yes I know inaccurate) Energy Cost Meters and been trying it on different devices. But it still gives me a relative indicator between different appliances.

Current laptop has PF=60 (I assume this is %)
Old laptop has PF=80
Just put it on the clothes dryer PF=100 but its sucking up 8Amps :P

[jamiep]

That's basically what it is ... these guys started making these for pool pumps to save $$$, and now have a model that you can use for older style air cons and fridges (basically large electric motors that can benefit from this) ...

their website here ...

http://www.futurewaveenergy.com.au/

Jamie

(ps - i'm in no way associated with them or affiliated with them)

[gary]

Hi Jamie,

Thanks for the post.

Just to follow up from my previous post in order to make it absolutely clear,
the measurements that the power box meters in Australian domestic settings
make does not take into account power factor. In other words, you get billed
the same irrespective of the power factor your household presents to the grid.
So you will not save any money for yourself, only for the power company,
if you install power factor correction devices.

One day, in theory, power meters in domestic settings may change to a type
that does take power factor into account. Then consumers might be rewarded
for improving their power factors by getting lower power bills.

To really save money, the commonly recommended measures, such as
energy efficient lighting and asking whether you really need that second
fridge continually running in the garage, are some of the better ways to go. :thumbsup:

[PCH]

Having watched the ACA program, I was just sooo surprised that the bloke had taken his product as far as effectively having it derided on national TV, without having the answers to some very fundamental questions.

And basically, it didn't actually do what he said it would do.

He must be a glutton for punishment, and a bit of a burk if you ask me. If he wanted to ensure that none will ever get sold, then he's gone about it exactly the right way imo. :thumbsup: