Masuyama EPs, what's happned to them?

[mental4astro]

Hi all,

I was wondering what's happened to Masuyama EPs.

I can't find any retailers of them.

I bought one 35mm Masuyama 'bout 13 years ago, and in looking for new EPs, I haven't been able to track them down, :shrug:.

I also can't find Japan Optik, Clave or Unitron???

Any idea where they've gone?

Mental

[dannat]

very difficult to find in Aust i think - cloudy nights in the US will show more exmaples - even there they are sought after

[Starkler]

I think Masayuma havent produced these in some years, and you dont see them come up for sale 2nd hand very often at all.

[Merlin66]

Masuyama's haven't been produced since the mid 80's. I used to have a full set, wonderfull!! Only available secondhand.
Clave was taken over in the late 90's but I did believe that production continued????
Unitron?? Don't know, seems to have gone from Hero to Zero.....

[GrahamL]

from the web

The Masuyamas have a bit of history behind them. Dr. Masuyama created this line of his own signature eyepieces back in the 86 and 87. His eyepieces didn't exist for long because after awhile, his company was bought over by Takahashi. Today, the Masuyama optical shop is still around (but the founder, Dr. Masuyama has died) but they prefer to be very low profile because they design a lot of OEM eyepieces. Some say that the Tak LEs were by them, as well as the Ultimas, UO orthos, etc....

The 25mm 65 degree eyepiece is rare because for some strange reasons, Masuyama designed another 25mm eyepiece but with 52 degrees FOV at only half the price. Obviously most people went for the 25mm 52 degree as it was much cheaper. So the 25mm 65 degree became really rare.

The Masuyamas eyepieces were revolutionary back then. Infact even today, 20 years later, this range of eyepieces could still easily beat most of the current fancy designs. But the Japanese didn't really appreciate them....they are too busy collecting Pentaxes, Naglers and the Vixens. But the Americans are collecting the Masuyamas. Check astromart and you will see a few post wanting these eyepieces. But they often have problems getting the final piece : - the 25mm 65 degree version.

It is interesting to note that Dr.Masuyama was so proud of these eyepieces that he put his own name on it (and not even his company name). Something like what Nagler does. But Nagler lasted for years....the Masuyamas only a few years, hence its rarity. Even the Masuyama eyepiece box is a piece of art.

I have personally seen the Masuyama 30mm (not as rare though), the contrast, flatness and sharpness is amazing. It's hard to tell that it is a 20 years old eyepiece.
,,,
You can dig a little more and you will find a hint or two by some well known in the industry that the optical company is indeed still around
Doing a lot of OEM work probably has some disclosure issues tied up in the mix as well... So enjoy em if you can get them cause there aint no more.... Anyone know who made the meade series 4000 smooth barrels from the late 80's ?

[dpastern]

These apparently are worshipped by amateur astronomers, but are almost impossible to get, and command high prices on the 2nd hand market. They come up very rarely and getting one is nigh on impossible it seems.

nightstalker - I believe the 4000 meades were clones of some of the masuyamas range...read it somewhere the other night on the web. I can't vouch for the accuracy of the comment though.

Dave

[Merlin66]

I used to have a full set of Masuyama's ( 5mm through 35mm, with the widefield 25mm)... absolutely wonderfull....another regret in life!!!

[mental4astro]

Sorry I'm not up with the lingo: what's OEM?

Mental

[erick]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_equipment_manufacturer

[mental4astro]

Ta, Erick.

Thanks for the all the replies.

I'll do a little more digging around then, with all these tips.

Mental.

[Astromelb]

Dear I In S'ers,

These are one of the world's most sublime gems in eyepiece history :)

Absolutely staggering performance !!

I have (what I understand) is the only set of 5mm, 7.5mm, 10mm, 15mm, 20mm, 25mm, 25mm WA, 30mm, 35mm and 45mm in the southern hemisphere, but would be pleased to hear that others have such a set in the region as well and be quite happy to be corrected here.

It took me 25 years and many many $$$ to achieve this collection :)

Is there a better eyepiece, I recommend not, I have tried these in a range of exceptional telescopes and recommend that these units are the equal Carl Zeiss Jena Abbe's (not the disgraceful Abbe II's, I am referring to the original CZJ units of which I have a full original set) on many of my very best telescopes. They demolish the performance of Nagler's and other TV's, also Pentax XL/ XW which are great Ep's but are made to look ordinary against such hand crafted exquisite eyepieces, which are not anywhere near similar to Takahashi, which merely also come from Japan and are probably Tak's most over rated product ..... ever !!

If you have any of these keep them, or if you have a larger than 45mm, I am most interested :) The most famous example of this exceptional range is the 4 inch dia 100mm unit that is used on the Hooker 100 inch telescope at Mt Wilson :)

Clear skies.

Rgds,
Cris,
Astromelb.

[AG Hybrid]

A 5 year old thread resurrection. Nice. I've never had the opportunity to look through one of these eyepieces. They seem to be well regarded around the world.

[issdaol]

Gee Chris,

That is a sudden change about Tak.

I saw some comments you made a little while ago proclaiming that that the Tak LE's were one of the best EP's available.

What has changed your opinion??

[issdaol]

I actually have a couple of older Masuyama EP's and they are good EP's but IMO actually overrated and definitely not worth the secondhand market prices and hype given today's choices.

Or maybe it is just my eyesight but my Nagler, Delos and Tak LE's are the ones that get all the use.

If I could use a wine analogy for anyone that knows and has opportunity to try several Penfolds Granges. There are quite a few other Shiraz wines out there at 50% or even 25% of the price which are far far superior. It is just that Penfolds Grange has the Market Awareness and is Artificially priced to appeal to many that think high price wine means good wine.

[Star Catcher]

Agree that they may be somewhat over hyped, however they are a fine eyepiece. I have three of these 15mm, 25 and 35. I feel they are at their best in showing colour contrast e.g. Jupiter belts and red spot, colourful stars. Very clean look with minimal flare. Their edge performance is good, but not spectacular. I also tend to gravitate to my Naglers but really enjoy the planet views in the 15mm masuyama and C11.

Ted

[bytor666]

Here is a lot more below on these:

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbarchive/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/748617/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/all/vc/1

[mental4astro]

Great link, Markus!

I'm curious to know how the 25mm Wide Field does in fast Newtonians, :question:

Anyone reading this thread have a 25mm WF that would know? I'd love to try one out. My 35mm is sensational in fast Newtonians. Yes a little long for the exit pupil, but excellent image.

[clive milne]

The old Celestron Ultima range are basically Masuyama clones. They are one product that Celestron actually got right and are worth looking out for second hand. In the one instance where I compared them side by side with a Meade series 4000 of a similar focal length, the Celestron was superior by a large margin. However... that's not saying much.
When you compare the original Masuyamas with a modern high quality eyepiece, you are very much in the territory of diminishing returns.

If you want the Masuyama experience without selling a kidney, just get a Celestron Ultima, pocket the change and put a baby sock over the eyepiece barrel. No one will be able to tell the difference in the dark.

[mental4astro]

The only thing with the Celestron Ultima's is the 25mm wide field isn't in the line :( But I agree with you saying about getting the Masuyama experience with these Ultimas without the $$$. If you are a purist or collector then it's a different matter.

The Ultima's are all 52º AFOV, like the typical Masuyama. The 25mm wide field was exotic back when I got the 35mm, & had a premium on it too. Now, if Celestron made a 25mm Wide Field Ultima, then that changes things...

[Hans Tucker]

Interesting navigating through this hyperlink. What an awesome experience it would be to observe through the 60" and Masuyama 100mm on Mount Wilson...$900 ain't bad for 1/2 night viewing session.

[Don Pensack]

The 5-element 2:1:2 design of Masuyama originated with a design of Carl Zeiss' company called the Astroplanokular.
Masuyama's production, under that label (the original "Swan" logo, by the way) used conventional glass types.
The "Pseudo-Masuyama" eyepieces from the '80s and early '90s contained some high-index glasses, so were smaller.
they were sold under the names:
Meade Series 4000 "Super Plossl" (made by Kowa)
Celestron Ultima
Orion Ultrascopic
Baader Eudiascopic
Antares Elite
Parks Gold Series Super Plossl
Omcon Ultima
Tuthill Plossl
Takahashi LE
All were made in Japan.
The Takahashi LE is still in production, as is a new version sold by Kasai called the "Astroplan".
The design has been copied by the Chinese, so there may be even more versions of these now. The Chinese versions seem to have stretched the apparent fields to 55-60 degrees, with the corresponding loss of correction at the edge.
Since most eyepieces are "farmed out" for production, it is not going to be easy to find the actual manufacturer of any of them.
The rumor is that the factory where the Masuyama eyepieces were made is still making eyepieces under other labels. Maybe. But a lot of small manufacturers have folded since 2000, due to retirement or the death of owners, so who really knows?

[clive milne]

Thanks for the extra info Don... excellent.!

btw) my earlier comment wrt the Meade series 4000 was in relation to their swa range.

Cheers
c