Aperture fever--talk me out of it

[programmer]

I see the odd good deal on 2nd hand 16" LB's, and of course the mind starts to wander... Do I need some sense kicked into me? :sadeyes:

CONS of me getting a 16"LB:

- Bloody big and therefore I'll never get it out and use it
- I've only had my 10" a short time. I need more experience
- A LB needs more frequent collimation and I haven't mastered that yet! Also, even faster scope than my f/5 means good collimation more critical
- Less than 9% of people in the aperture poll reported they have 16" or more. There must be a reason besides cost (although I realise not all scopes in the poll are reflectors).
- I've read posts from people who claim they use their small scope more than their big ones
- Even more difficult to transport in the car than my 10" GSO (or is it?)
- Really need a permanent setup for a beast like this
- More expensive on EP's than smaller, slower scope
- Again, I'm a beginner and don't 'need' something that big


PROS:

- Great views!
- More aperture helpful in light-polluted suburbs
- Because I can

I might add I'd be getting an Argo Navis with it. My alternative to the LB would be to get the AN and stick it on my 10" and be happy with that!

Yes I've read the previous 16" LB threads :)
Thanks

[Kokatha man]

You've heard by now of "averted vision" programmer? Well, it has (slightly) other purposes than seeing faint objects!

What you do when the desire to materialise/realize objects just out of grasp is to then start imagining owning something really, really absurdly beyond your capacity to own: you can then dream off into seeing all that Jovian details revealed in magazine photos from 200" scopes etc.......

Sometime later when you realise you're at work and supposed to be actually appearing as if you're doing something, or at home and knowing that you actually have something to do, you then start realizing that the 16" scope isn't that desirable for the moment, and you've got a perfectly good 10" that you haven'y really even begun to fully utilize and.....

Later on you start the cycle up again, knowing that really you're actually too scared of utter poverty and complete spendaholic stupidity - these are the only things that are holding you back. So you start imaging that 60" reflector but (in my case) settle for the 36" apo binoculars......

It's ok brother, we just need to talk about these things a bit more.....

[dannat]

stick with the 10", & put the argo on it :thumbsup:

[Rob_K]

Clinical tests have proven that in 90% of cases where people succumb to "aperture fever", "astrophotography" and other diseases, they diverge from the path of true astronomy and become "gear freaks". They become more concerned with what the person next door has, with the 0.001% differences between top end eyepieces, with the latest firmware/software updates, and they gradually lose touch with the sheer wonder of the night sky.

Don't go down this path Programmer. It is the road to madness. ;)

Cheers -

[programmer]

Thanks for all your support. It's true I'm a gear freak (not just astronomy) but I think the Argo Navis should satisfy that need for some time. Some of the saved money could further my EP collection, or that grab n go scope perhaps..

[Brian W]

Ok talk you out of it. First off a bigger telescope may not give you better views from a light polluted site, many people say they just get better views of the light pollution. Secondly and perhaps most importantly if you succumb to aperture fever you will never haver one that is big enough. What you may wish to do is to think about what interests you the most and then get the telescope that will allow you to truly enjoy that part of the hobby to a greater degree. I have a 4.5" short tube Orion reflector and had 'the fever' I was given the use of an 8" SCT and after the thrill of a new experience wore off I realized that the 8" was not giving me the views that I really enjoy. Yes the detail was increased but at the cost of a really wide FOV which would show me the beauty of the nebulae and open clusters. I have ordered a 8" LightBridge which will give me the increased details and keep the wide FOV. The other cure to 'the fever' is realizing you will never be content until you are content.

Hope this helps
Brian

[h0ughy]

naa get the 16 you wont regret it!!!

[programmer]

Thanks Brian. Nice to get advice from afar! I guess what interests me most is deep space, although I know from my back yard I will be limited to the brighter DSOs. How dark are your skies? I have no doubt if I lived in a dark location I would not be quite so quick to dispense with my 10"!

[programmer]

I was wondering if you'd chime in.. grrrr thanks a lot! :doh:

[Screwdriverone]

Programmer, listen to the man (and have a look at all the gear I have stacked on to my little 5" scope in 2 months) and BACK AWAY SLOWLY FROM THE TELESCOPE WEBSITE WITH YOUR WALLET IN PLAIN VIEW!!!!

Seriously, forget the Ioptron cube, the Promak150 etc etc and enjoy the 10" Dob when you can. If you reeeeeeeaaaaalllly cant live without a new bit of gear, then it sounds like Argo Navis is a great treat for the senses..............hmmmm.........p ush to..........may have to mount that on my Newt......and then perhaps........I can buy a power tank.......and maybe a new Eyepiece........................... ...........

DARRYL - HELP - I AM SLIPPING! - ITS ALL HAPPENING AGAIN!!!!!!! :eyepop:

I need an INTERVENTION - NOW!!!!!!!!!

[programmer]

Well I've bought 2 new eyepieces recently, only had the chance to use ONE of them, ONE time and not for long. But I will get the ArgoNavis, almost certainly, because.. it's a COMPUTER! And computers are the only thing that push astronomy to second place for me (did I say that out aloud?). So I'm destined to have one. It's written in the .. er .. the stars. I will learn star-hopping, Telrad, constellations.. I promise! Really... :whistle:

[omnivorr]

..to paraphrase the Reverend Flip Wilson

Ashes to ashes
Dust to dust
if da drinkin don't getya
da 'stronomy must!

[Kokatha man]

[quote=Screwdriverone;312282]Programmer, listen to the man (and have a look at all the gear I have stacked on to my little 5" scope in 2 months) and BACK AWAY SLOWLY FROM THE TELESCOPE WEBSITE WITH YOUR WALLET IN PLAIN VIEW!!!!

Screwie - I'm sending your missus a pm to have her confiscate your wallet: I've already intervened to try and stop that omni character from selling his elderly parents to raise more cash for his habit - and all because I just happened, innocently and with complete honesty, to casually mention the merits of electric focussing. Suddenly you characters seemed to have drummed up a stampede on every known (and some unknown) gadgets that have ever been invented for astronomy.

Just back off - every darn astro shop I ring for something, tells me they're outa stock of whatever I can think of - most of it being sold/sent to two specific addresses!!!

[omnivorr]

..the apperture and mounts the 'meat&veg', main course. ..trouble for some of us is we keep 'snackin' ' between meals ;) ...and it might be a long time between meals, at this rate :P

[Screwdriverone]

[quote=Kokatha man;312344]

So Darryl, are you saying that the shops are selling out of the items that I have bought? ....hmmmm.... all part of my cunning economical plan to start up my own second hand black market business...... mwuhuhuahahahahaha!

1st, talk up how good everything you buy is.
2nd, buy all stock of said item from suppliers.
3rd, wait for all the suckers to rush in to buy them and find that they are all gone.....
4th bide your time and then sell to the highest bidder!

The World will soon be MINE!!!!, MINE I tells YA!

(Puts little finger up to the corner of the mouth)

I will soon have my ONE MILLION DOLLARS!

Chris

[norm]

No - get the 16". Once AF sets in, thats it, you can't get your mind off it by buying other goodies, delaying the inevitable... The fever just gets worse, coming back stronger and harder to shake.

You'll be thinking about it every moment, making justifications to yourself, any form of logically reasoning by others, telling you otherwise won't help. Best to get it over and done with early on.:P:lol:

Someone will buy your 10" so there is no harm done.

'I use to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure...'

Good Luck.
Norm

[programmer]

Damn.. you're not supposed to talk me INTO it :doh:

Now that I think about it there will be extra expense in getting the AN for my GSO, then down the track if I do get the LB, having to get rid of the few hundred bucks of mounting hardware and buying the LB mounting hardware. I guess selling the scope + AN would be the go, and getting a new one for the LB.. more expense :sadeyes:

[gbeal]

I say get it as well.
I have had a wonderful 10" f5 for ages, still have it. Great views etc. But late last year I built up a 16" truss newt dob, a la Kreige, et al, and love it.
Once you "think" about getting something bigger you won't be happy until you do.
Plus if you don't like it, you can always go back, yeah right.
Gary

[Brian W]

really really dark with my 4.5 on a really good night the keyhole is just brilliant and the dark lanes that run from lagoon and triffid up to the eagle are like highways. Nearest small city 10 kilometers away to the east and nothing in the other 270 degrees but a couple of light bulbs.
Brian

[CoombellKid]

Actually furthering your EP collection isn't a bad idea. For one you will know
your premium EP will work in a variety of focal lengths. And another it's 50%
of the optical train, I noticed a vast improvement in my views and enjoyment
when I put a tennis racket to the cheap EP's that came with my scope and
went and spent money on premium EP's. I still have my 8" which I brought
about 5-6 years ago. Went through aperture fever a couple of times. Now
I have most of the EP's I want. I'm now looking to build a bigger scope and
thats another satisfaction trip on it own. I think there is something to be
said about learning to see all you can with the aperture you have, there are
a lot of things you can see in a 10" and I'm sure you haven't seen a quarter
of them yet.

regards,CS


regards,CS

[CoombellKid]

Also being a traditionalist, dont be so keen on computer control. You can
learn a lot and see more (albeit a slower process) star hoping during your
learning process.

So relax and get a bad neck looking through that finder scope for a few
years : )

regards,CS

[programmer]

I'm quite sure I haven't seen 1 thousandth of them yet! very very early days for me. Hopefully I can do and see a lot more with daylight savings over. Tonight was a lot of fun.

Edit: and yes I agree about the EP's. I know premium EP's will last a long time and do the job across scopes.

[programmer]

Good advice, but I'll probably get the AN because a) the gadget freak in me and b) star hopping with so few darn stars is driving me up the wall. And the AN is only push-to so there's still some elbow grease involved :)

[GrahamL]

:party:Get both ..argo for the 10"..and while our dollar is pretty friendly
grab a 16" gso mirror to build your own scope around over the coming months ..you get a lot of benefit this way as your enjoying the 10"
more and any spare cash that might pop up from time to time gets ploughed into the 16" so dosn't get diverted to other non important stuff like bills and such :)

[OCULUS]

Argo Navis I would recommend first. You can always justify this as it can be transfered to a new scope and therefore not redundant. This means when you really have to change to bigger scope, your AN is still as good as gold!
If I am correct, the larger the mirror, the smaller the FOV is which may put you off. I would say after 10inches 18 would be the next recommended upgrade. The cost of an 18 is so high relatively that the decision is made for you with regard to that upgrade. This is all a bit back to front but it sort of makes sense.......

[programmer]

Great comments, thanks. The Argo should be a goer, soon hopefully.

And yay, my main temptation has been sold (LB with AN in the IIS classifieds). A response to my PM's from the seller would've been nice though ;)

[sejanus]

I've got a 16" LB, I wouldn't buy it for the purpose of putting it in the car. That was the idea I had as well but it's too much of a pain unless you have a station wagon/ute etc.

I'd keep the 10" as a mobile scope for car trips.

With the 16 though, optically it's bloody awesome. I could use it with the 13mm ethos for hours I love it.......I'd only sell my 16 to get a sdm scope.

[Paddy]

Oh this is such a question with which I grapple. I keep discovering more with my 12" as I keep observing and I think "this is it - I don't need a bigger one"! Then I think about what detail I could see with a bigger scope. I reckon before I decide, I need to spend a bit of time comparing a 16" to mine in the skies that I would use it in i.e. dark. I also think about the issue of weight with a LB and look with interest at the scopes that IIS members have made that are a lot lighter and more portable. I reckon if I do upgrade, I'll buy the optics and get a mate who's handy with timber to help me build a light weight dob. Until that time I can ponder and still enjoy my nice scope - get a lot of delight from it and then some more a few years downdown the track from an upgrade.

So my take? Take some time, learn more through observing, enjoy your scope, look through someone else's 16" and consider building a more portable one.

[programmer]

Constructing my own is not something that I'd considered (I did many years ago), but it's a thought.

But looking through someone else's, that's a great idea. If only there was somebody nearby with a 16" LB :whistle: