Need help, about to take the plunge

[GazzMeister]

Hi all

I've got my $5000 ready to spend on an astro-photography rig. I'm thinking either a skywatcher pro 100/120 or a celestron advanced 9.25/11. What would the merits of each be? I already have a 10" dob so would the larger celestron make the dob redundant? Would the HEQ5 that I can get with the skywatcher be good enough for observational use with the dob on top? Does anyone have any alternate suggestions? Bear in mind that I dont absolutely HAVE to spend all 5K at once. Also I already have a Celestron Neximage (although I had to dual boot my laptop to run the thing. Bloody Vista) and I have a Canon 400D coming soon.

Sorry for the barrage of questions, I just dont want to waste my money. Thanks for any advice in advance.

Gareth

[monoxide]

put your 10" on a G11 :)
still plenty of change left for an argo navis to point the thing with and an ed80 for a guiding/alternative imaging scope

[stringscope]

Hi Gareth,

I am strictly a visual astrohead and I know nothing re astro imaging "stuff", however:

Just in case you are not a member of the Canberra Astro Soc, our next meeting is Thursday 17 Jan, 8 pm at Mt Stromlo. There are usually a number of imaging presentations from members ranging from planetary through to wide field, from barndoor through to Tak and RCOS. I am sure you will find these guys/girls more than happy to share the imaging do's and dont's in the Canberra environment.

Apologies if this is old news.

Cheers,

[Gama]

I would say STOP.
Go to a local meeting and look thru different scopes.
You also didnt mention what area of astrophotography you want to go in.
This will lead your purchase to your desired scope.
The LX200R has the better optics over the other SCT's.
The RCX is in another field again..
If you dont like fork mounted, get the OTA and a GEM to put it on.

A good astrograph like a nice APO or a good quality low f ratio Newt is another.
You have a lot of money at stake, so take a little time and look at whats available, and do a lot of searches.

Theo.

[Hagar]

If you are going to take the plunge then do it well.. Go for an EQ6Pro or a G11 with gemini. The 10" dob will fit nicely on either of these mounts. You will have the ability to computer control both. To step into astrophotograhy with the 10 inch Dob you will need a set of mounting rings and maybe make some small mods to the dob tube to allow it to come to focus with DSLR. You will need a MPCC for image/comma correction. If you have any money left you could purchase an ED80 or similar or even an Achromat as a guide scope. Then lots of time for the steep learning curve, but You will not regret buying the bigger mount as it is probably more important than the scope. With a good mount you can always take great wide field shots with the camera and standard lensesbut the best scope is useless if you can't track the sky.

Cheers
Doug

[g__day]

So is the Canon 400D (which I use) in your $5K budget or not?

Anyway three bits of advice:

I would talk to experienced astro-imagers like Jase and get their advice.

I'd choose between wide field targets (implying a APO refractor) and deep space objects (DSO) (impling aperature and rock solid mount) and select OTA and mount accordingly.

So if you wanted widefield an 100mm APO on a Vixen Sphinx plus Canon 400D might fall into your budget.

Deep space - the mount to hold a decent size SCT will be a killer - it will eat your budget - maybe a EQ6 for a C9.25 (go carbon fibre to minimise temperature variant re-focusing) or a 10" Meade lx200R OTA. But I'd reserve some $ for a computerise, motorised focuser!

Your DOB on a G11 + Gemini might be a real goer, look for second hand gear too! e.g. http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=27313 8" Meade SCT plus wedge for under $2K

Ask for more advice and look for a consensus amongst those that actually image the targets you wish! If it is DSO you wish to image - you need a really good mount and great (rigid) dovetails (Losmandy) for your gear. Autoguiding wil become a consideration too at some point - so factor this in to the eventual carrying capacity of your mount.

[Peter Ward]

It's a bit like real estate.

Mounting-Mounting-Mounting would be the three rules.

CCD/CMOS are linear devices...well, sort of with the latter, so image depth is purely a function of how dark you sky is, and how long you want to expose...but you can cheat a tad here and put a $13k 97% QE camera on a 4" and, as the Stones lyric goes "make a grown man cry"

Resolution? ....sorry, aperture rules....and can make the first rule expensive.

It is all about balance... just accept you can not do it all with one focal length, look at the images that you would like to emulate, then write the cheque :)

Cheers
Peter

[g__day]

Peter

For your very significant astro-imaging experience - how would you spend $5K given a Canon 400D is comming (so exclude it from budget but keep it as the main imaging CCD), if it was a choice between:

1) Wide field shots

2) DSO targets

Ta

Matt

[Peter Ward]

Matt,

A hard call.... I'd suggest a G-11, without Gemini or Vixen GPDX or current equivalent and a good 4" APO to 6" Maksutov that you can afford after that. (sorry $5k may not quite cut it)

GoTo is nice, but sucks when it doesn't work, and is simply not required for imaging....BTW the best portable imaging mount I have used was Losmandy's GM100 (tangent arm Dec). Zero GoTo, but it responded *instantly* to any guiding corrections ..I sold mine....sigh...it's living happily in Queensland now I believe....

By the way, wide field may not be cheap either, Canon L-series glass costs as much, if not a good deal more, than many smaller 'scopes :(

Cheers
Peter

[netwolf]

You will find that this is a bottomless pit so stop and review. Define your goals. Meet people who have similar interests, who are able to show you the ropes. The one thing you will need in this hobby more than anything else is a good group of colleagues. IIS provides this but interaction is limited. You will need to meet check out your local groups and societies.

The most critical thing in imaging boils down to the selection of the Mount.
For Planetary Alt/Az is sufficient but you can also use EQ mounts. For DSO work a EQ mount is preferred. So if you want to do both then consider an EQ mount.

How about a 8" F4-F5 newtonian or Schmidt-Newtonian and SV80 NGNH on a G-11 without Gemini add ArgonNavis. Perhaps a C8 for Planet and longer focal DSO's. Shop around there is also much used equipment floating around.

You could always upgrade/switch the OTA's the mount should last quiet some time.

Regards
Fahim

[g__day]

Peter,

Thank you - BTW wide field I was expecting you to say a 80 - 100mm OTA - I hadn't thought of Canon's white water lens - as you say they are rather dear!

I'm on my fifth mount now - a Vixen Atlux second hand, the one before this was a CG5 (think goto EQ5). The quality and capability between these two mounts are light years apart. But spend double what I did and your into Losmandy Titans, AP 900, or TAK NJP, go up again and you're into AP 1200, Paramount ME or the higher end TAK's.

You chose your tools fit for purpose. If it were just visual or low end wide field - the EQ6 would get you started. If you want to image longer or with heavier gear you'll need alot more in a mount - precise pointing, tracking and guiding - and these really don't come cheap.

Don't skip on the mount - a good second hand mount might be a real god send.

And if imaging becomes your game - as Fahim said - a german equatorial mount (versus a fork on a wedge or a fork without a wedge but with a field de-rotator) is the way to go!

[jase]

Gareth,
What are your astrophotography goals and realistic expectations? You'll need to state them up front and stick to them. Shifting goals in the imaging game requires deep pockets. It’s good to hear the advice of others to get a general consensus, but how well they will align to your goals maybe very different. Also, keep in mind that equipment alone will not produce great images.

[gbeal]

Get the best mount you can, then figure out what camera (DSLR or CCD), and dip your toe into the water with something like an ED80, or short focal length newt (I use an 8" f4).
When I say "The best mount you can" I don't mean go cheap, I reckon you will soak the budget on just the mount, and this isn't a bad thing. The G11 would be a minimum and really it doesn't need to be Gemini.
Good luck, it is a minefield out there. Gama has wise words, get to as many star parties and become a sponge.

[GazzMeister]

Thanks everyone for the responses, as always they have been fast and informative. Basically I'd like the best all-round combo for $5000. The camera is not included in the limit, I've got friends in high places at a number of camera stores and it'll be along soon;). I'm just testing the water and I'd prefer goto if possible. I'm sure there could be a half decent package for 5k or under, and if i end up getting frustrated and giving up the photography side then I'd be happy to have a (slightly) portable goto mount/scope arrangement. I'm not really after the best I can get, if the bug bites then I can get a really good (i.e. expensive) mount with next years bonus. Thanks again for the help, you guys never seem to get frustrated with answering the same beginner questions over and over again:).