Questions regarding the SkyWatcher 10" Dobsonian

[bluesilver]

Hi, I am new to this forum and i have been doing a fair bit of reading on here and also the review on this telescope, so apologises for this long question / post.

I currently have been using a very old and i guess i would call it a low powered telescope, I can actually see more through a standard pair of binoculars.
So i am seriously looking at getting something better that i can actually see planets like Saturn, Jupiter.
What was recommended to me and after doing a bit of reading around was the SkyWatcher 10" Dobsonian.
I don't really need it to be portable to carry in a car as i live in the country away from city and street lights.
At this stage i am interested in viewing the planets, but maybe also nebular.

So i just have a few questions that i am hoping someone might be able to help me out with,
This is the one i was looking at:
https://www.ozscopes.com.au/skywatcher-dobsonian-telescope-10inch.html

1. I see that i can get either the solid tube version or the collapsible version, the collapsible being slightly dearer, is there any obvious advantage between the two apart from one being collapsible?
I would of thought that the solid tube version would be the better or the two.
Then to add to my confusion, i see that you can also get it in the goto version, but only the collapsible version.
Is it at all worth looking into getting a goto version when first really starting out like i am?

2. They have recommended a few accessories to go along with the SkyWatcher 10" Dobsonian,
www.ozscopes.com.au/baader-planetarium-hyperion-1-25-5mm-eyepieces.html
https://www.ozscopes.com.au/baader-hyperion-14mm-finetune-ring.html
https://www.ozscopes.com.au/baader-hyperion-28mm-finetune-ring.html

Just interested to know what anyone thinks of this setup as i am still new and trying to learn what accessorise do what.

I don't really understand what the fine tuning rings do yet, even after doing a bit or research on them, only that i think they help magnify what you are looking at.

3. It looks like the telescope comes with two eye pieces, 10mm and 25mm,
Am i correct in saying that the smaller the number, the greater the magnification is, but also the smaller the viewing area becomes?
They have recommended this eye piece to go also with the telescope?
https://www.ozscopes.com.au/baader-planetarium-hyperion-1-25-5mm-eyepieces.html
Am i correct in saying that this one will greatly increase the magnification and let you see planets like Saturn, Jupiter more clearly?
Then somehow these fine tuning rings increase it yet again?

Sorry if these questions sound basic or silly, i am just trying to ask them in a very simple way i guess to help anyone understand what i am hoping to ask.

I did do a comparison with the solid tube, collapsible and goto.
I did find that the collapsible and goto have plossl eyepieces, verses the solid tubes super.
Focal ratio was f5 for the tube and f4.7 for the other two.
Finder scope was 6x30 for the tube and 9x50 for the other two.
Reads to me at least that the solid tube might be the worst out of the three, but again asking for any input.

Any help or information would be most greatly appreciated.
Thanks.

[m11]

Hi Peter,

The collapsible model helps with portability, especially if you have a small vehicle or you travel to dark sites. I generally find I leave my solid tubes at home alot rather than take them to the country. If you are observing mainly from home,then its less of an issue. In regards to focus if you have the collapsible model, people can adjust the struts accordingly to achieve focus.

Not sure about the fine tuning ring. Maybe someelse can help out here.

Yep in regards to the focal length of the eyepiece. You need to divide the focal length fo the eyepiece with the focal length of the scope.
The 10inch you are looking at is 1200mm , so the eyepiece you selected will yield X240 magnification - most nights you will limited by the atmosphere.

I did do a compassion with the solid tube, collapsible and goto. - I found goto useful in find objects, taking short videos/shots and outreach. Obviously the cost is much more but I found them useful for me.

I did find that the collapsible and goto have plossl eyepieces, verses the solid tubes super. -To be honest I would not pick the scopes based on the eyepieces the scopes come with. The standard plossls are ok , but you will probably end up getting your own ones later:)

Hopefully this the info helps.

PM or post and I will try to answer as best i can.

m11

[bluesilver]

Hi Mel,
Thanks for reply, appreciated.
Dose focal ratio come into play much, i am guessing it dose.
As the tube is f5, while the collapsible is f4.7
Also found so far the it is only the collapsible version that comes with a goto mount.

When you talk about limited by atmosphere, and i am sure this is a very basic question, are you referring to the earths heat haze it generates, or something different?
I am from Tasmania if that helps at all?
If i want to view planets, i would need the highest magnification possible?
Or is this were the atmosphere comes into play, with the higher magnification the fuzzier / out of focus the image would be?

Thanks again for the reply,

[m11]

Hi Peter,

I generally use the focal ratio more for myself to work out if the scope may have coma with the faster scopes (lower f number). Some eyepieces do well to correct for the coma or you can use a coma corrector if you are bothered by it. Some people do not like the seagull effect of stars as you view progressively out from the centre of the eyepiece.
The focal ratio plays a bigger part I have found with larger aperture scopes as longer f ratio means a step ladder/ladder to view.

I like goto but its also a philosophical discussion as others prefer a more simple approach as the goto you will need to align the scope. Goto can be used manually as well.

Yep, the atmosphere is the transparency and seeing on a given night - it will be noticeable as you try to push for higher magnification. The image will go soft.
If you want to view planets, i found the seeing/transparency more the limiting factor - as the magnification you can used is dependant on this. Your scope's aperture will also play a part in terms of what constrast and detail you will see.

Hopefully these links might help explain a bit better:

https://www.astronomics.com/eyepiece-highest-useful-magnification_t.aspx

https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/446671-limit-on-magnification-in-terms-of-aperture/

Alot to pick up and I am still learning myself :)

Regards,

m11

[bluesilver]

Thanks again for the reply,
Yes, makes better sense now.
Never heard of coma corrector, but have just done some research into what you said.
That being said, i don't know yet how you worked out from the focal ratio if the scope may have coma, with the one i was looking at being 1200mm.
I guess that might be for a bit later when i learn/research more.

Also found out you need less magnification if you i was to try and view nebular or similar. All to do with letting more light in, 10" would be better than 8" Think i have got that part right.
But also not to try and get too much magnification that the scope can handle,
Think that is all correct.
I am thinking if using a collapsible, it would be best to invest in a light shroud, unless they are not really necessary if there are no bright lights around.

Thanks again for the links and advice, learning heaps pretty quick.
Appreciated.
Peter.

[m11]

All good Peter. Hope it helps.

I have found f6 and above that coma is less of an issue and more easier on eyepieces.

Most deep sky stuff looks better with lower magnification and look better with a wider field of view.

Yep , the larger aperture is to collect more light.

Each scope has their max magnification but I have never used it for my dobs.

I would still get a light shroud as it also acts as a dew shield for the primary mirror.

M11

[bluesilver]

Thanks again, much appreciated.
I have plenty of research to look up and study on now.
Looking more likely to go with a goto version, a little more costly, but will be better in the long term i am thinking and also help with the learning curve hopefully.
Might just have to wait on the accessories just to see what i will want when i get started.

Appreciated.
Peter.

[m11]

Hi Pete,

All good.

Will pm you my details if you want to chat. I am still learning but happy to assist if it helps.

Yah , sounds like a plan :thumbsup:

The only thing i would recommend if the scope.doesnt have it is a telrad or red dot finder. Makes it easier to find stuff.

Also i use stellarium and the South African constellation cards.

M11

[bluesilver]

Hi Mel,
Sounds good as i am sure i will always have plenty of basic questions.
There was no mention of telrad or red dot finder in the scope, just 8x50 Right-Angle Finderscope.
I will also have to find a good Collimator as reading up on them, with low f numbers like f5, it is more critical to get right.
Thanks.
Peter.

[m11]

No problems.

Ahh ok. Something to look at later as they the finderscope and rdf complement each other.

You are right in that you probably want to have a collimation tool at the start.

Sent you a pm buddy.

Regards,

M11

[gaseous]

With the possible exception of the 5mm, ive read that the Baader hyperion eyepieces are a very poor match in a dobsonian scope. Never heard of the tuning rings being used either.
The Baader Zoom, however, is a great eyepiece in a dob.

[m11]

Hey Patrick,

How do you find the 20inch skywatcher dobsonian?
Is it easy to asemble?
How is the mirror quality?

M11

[gaseous]

Hi Mel,
I've only had the 20" out once since i bought it due to weather here in Brisbane. It was a drawn out process putting it together for the first time due to the abominable instruction manual, but it only took about 30 minutes the night I actually used it. It's probably a little easier to move about than the 16" in terms of weight, although putting the secondary cage on top is a challenge for one person. Goto seems to work and track well. Mirror showed some extravagant diffraction spikes on a couple of very bright stars, but the resolving power seems very impressive - omega centauri was easily showing individual core stars at multiple magnifications, and under light polluted skies Eta Carina was easily visible without a filter, whereas the old 16" wouldn't show much at all. A coma corrector certainly tidies up the perimeter of the view if that sort of thing is important to people.

[m11]

Hi Patrick,

Thanks for sharing. :lol:

The dob sounds like a keeper. They sound like good value for what you get.

Sounds like an definete upgrade :thumbsup:

M11

[gaseous]

Definitely can't see myself needing anything bigger for a long time, and got it for a good price - can't wait to get it under a dark sky next week. I think you probably need one for your collection!

[TwistedRider]

Hi Peter,


And hi again Mel, i'll gve you a call once my scope gets here :astron:


I'm just new to all this myself and i've taken the plunge with the Skywatcher 10" Goto Colapsible.

The smaller frame size for transport was a decent consideration for me.
It seemed like a good solid starting point.

Unfortunately it's still on backorder so can't give much more help.

However, hese may be of interest
https://www.bintel.com.au/product/skywatcher-shroud-truss-dobsonian-10-inch/
https://www.bintel.com.au/product/skywatcher-eyepiece-kit/

I can't comment on their performance but was lucky to get a good deal in the EOFY slaes.
I figured i'd see what these yielded before i decided on any additional eyepieces.


One thing you may need, especially in Tas,:cold: is some form of dew control (heaters, fans etc).
There are a few options, and as i'm yet to get things up and running, others may have more detailed info.


I also have been using Stellarium, quite easy to get going. Also have "Cartes du Ciel" but trying to learn with one 1st

[Allan_L]

Hi Peter,
welcome to IceInSpace :welcome:

I've had three Skywatcher Dobs, all collapsible.
Previously I had an 8" Newtonian (solid tube).
Apart from being easier to move around and set up, the collapsible is also easier to store out of the way (I keep mine in a cupboard on a shelf).

On the other hand, a solid tube probably protects the primary mirror from dew a little better. And you wouldn't need to buy a shroud to keep out stray light and dew and dust.(if applicable) .

Some sort of navigation system will be a good thing. I have had one with goto, but it adds a lot to the weight and setup. not to mention you will need a battery or power source. then you have cables to worry about.
First one had no goto so I used altitude and azimuth scales to find faint fuzzies. Currently I use Argo Navis, which is push to, I like Argo, it is Aussie, but it is not cheap.
The tracking provided by the Goto was helpful too. But I still prefer the Argo.

I haven't heard of tuning rings before, and don't know what they would be used for.

I would suggest a red dot finder to be used in conjunction with the finder scope.
Mine all came with a straight through finder scope, I immediately changed these for a right angle finder. The other is a pain in the neck.

A 5mm eyepiece would be a good addition for planetary viewing, but not sure about the one you mentioned. Perhaps an alternate solution might be a 2x barlow. That gives you a 5mm and a 12.5mm from the two eyepieces you get with it.

Good to see you have done so much research, you are heading in the right direction, IMHO.
Keep asking questions. We were all beginners at some stage.

[Allan_L]

Other items:
Collimator - I use a Hotech Self Centering Crosshair laser collimator.
I also have a Cheshire collimating eyepiece, which some people prefer.
Viewing chair (height adjustable) makes it easier to see details when you are seated and steady.
Cold weather gear (I use a freezer suit). Seeing is generally better on colder nights I have found. Not pretty but practical. Some use the Aldi onesies, on sale last week.
Dew prevention, might be relevant. There is plenty written on that elsewhere on IIS.

[m11]

Hey Patrick,

I can definetely see why. :rofl:

I would be interested in your report on how you go under dark skies if you happy to do so.

Lol, i would love to, i think the wife will kill me!
M11

[m11]

Hey Drew,

No problems. Sounds like a plan.

Also, happy to come to your place when you get it to help out.

M11

[Allan_L]

photo added don't know why its sideways, sorry, but you get the idea.

[gaseous]

If you think you'll stick with planets and other brighter/larger objects, then goto probably isn't needed, but if you want to start hunting down fainter DSO's then I reckon goto is the way to go. I'm sure some more "traditionalist" observers would argue to the contrary, but for me, the goto just gives you more time enjoying the views and less time getting frustrated. They may argue that you learn the sky better having to find things yourself, and that has some merit, but nothing dulls the enthusiasm like spending most of the time searching fruitlessly for small/faint objects without success. I found the goto actually enhanced my desire to learn more about the constellations, stars, and all the faint lurking delights out there.

[bluesilver]

Thanks again for all the replies and advice, it is all greatly appreciated very much.
I think i have now pretty much decided to settle on a SkyWatcher 10" Dobsonian with goto.
I guess without sounding silly, with any accessories that i purchase, i want them to be firstly compatible with the Dobsonian,
But i also want them to be of the best or pretty close to the best quality, mainly so that latter on if i do have to upgrade to a better eyepiece or anything, i won't be buying the same piece twice if that makes sense.

So it looks like i will need a collimation tool, i don't mind taking the extra time to setup everything perfect and spot on, so any recommendations for this would be appreciated.

Also the scope finder, a few have recommended a laser or red dot version.

I am not sure yet on eyepieces, the ones listed was only what the store recommended to me.
I am firstly planning out to start with just planet viewing and them move from there, at least this stage anyway until i learn more.

Always appreciate any advice
Thanks.
Peter.

[m11]

Hi Peter,

Only thing i will add, when it comes to eyepieces its almost an entire subjective section and everyone will have preferences based on slightly different criteria.

With eyepieces I want good scatter control, no blackouts and consistent quality. The cost is less of an issue and field of view is dependant on what a view.

I would go with the plossl first and see how you go. I have found orthoscopics really good for planetary and not too expensive. :thanx:

[gaseous]

If you're getting a goto scope, I personally wouldn't bother upgrading the finderscope. I've found I use it to get the alignment stars accurately centred, but then generally don't use it again for the rest of the night unless I have to realign the scope, which doesn't happen all that often.

[m11]

Hi Peter,

Upgrading the finderscope will probably not be a priority right now as Patrick as mentioned . You can use the finderscope that comes with the scope.

I do find the red dot finder/telrad easier to align things with for me. I generally use both to find something quickly. Globular clusters I find easier in the finder scope to find. Alignment stars easier with the rdf.

I guess its more to priorities and what makes life easier for you. :thumbsup:

[bluesilver]

Hi,
I can see both sides of the opinions there and both make sense,
I also plan to use the goto manually as well to help me in the learning process as silly as it sounds.
I can see that a red dot finder will help pinpoint the desired object and help align it up a tad easier, at least that is how i read it.

The standard eye pieces are Plossl 10 and 25mm
Are there cheap a good brands of 2x barlow eye pieces?, i did search around a bit and they seam to vary quiet a bit, i figured there might be a brand of barlow that is more preferred to than others and is a good match for the 10" Dobsonian.
Just for example, SkyWatcher or Celestron Omni
www.ozscopes.com.au/catalogsearch/result/?q=2x+barlow

I did see a few mention that they haven't heard of the fine tuning rings, which to me sounds like something i should be staying away from if they are not widely known.

Here is what they sent to be in regards to them,

With default eyepiece, you will be getting 48x and 120x magnification.

With the 5mm eyepiece, you will be getting 240x magnification.
If you use the 14mm fine tuning ring, it will become 4mm focal length and you will get 300x magnification.
If you use the 28mm fine tuning ring, it will become 3.2mm focal length and you will get 375x magnification.
If you use both fine tuning ring together, it will become 2.6mm focal length and you will get 461x magnification.

You are essentially getting 4 different kind of eyepiece if you purchase both the fine tuning ring.

[gaseous]

I have a suspiscion the fine tuning rings are used more for astrophotography. I've never heard of anyone using either the Baader Hyperions or the fine tuning rings with a dob. With the skywatchers, the 16", and possibly the 14", can have the clutches loosened to use manually, but I know with my 8" that slewing manually is very difficult.

[TwistedRider]

The 10" instructions clearly state is can by moved manually
No comments on how easily...That remains to be seen.

[m11]

I have found the orion dobs have clutches that you can loosen and are easy to move up and down.

The sky-watcher do not have these clutches and I find it harder to move manually - a lot of friction. Need to use the motors to move it manually.

m11

[gaseous]

Yes, the skywatchers up to 12" have the clutches internally, so they're not particularly smooth to move by hand. The 14 and 16 have the clutch releases externally, and are very easy to move once released. You can still probably slew a 10" by hand, but it'll become more difficult at high mags.

[bluesilver]

Hi,
Thanks again for the replies, very much appreciated.
It would be nice if i could find a 10 Dobsonian with goto but as a solid tube rather than collapsible in Australia, still searching on that one.
I see that Orion make them, but yet to find an Australian dealer.

I have now have heaps of information to research up on and thanks heaps for all the help and support to get me this far,
It is very much appreciated for sure.
Thanks.
Peter.

[raymo]

Why on earth would you want the solid tube? I can't think of a single benefit
apart from I think a bit cheaper.
raymo

[morls]

FWIW I had an 8" collapsible dob, and it was easier to lug around than a solid tube, took up less room in storage and the struts were useful when nudging/pulling the scope to track objects in the eyepiece. No problems with holding collimation either...

The mirror in this scope was probably about average, but I had a set of Catseye collimation tools that I'm certain enabled me to get the most out of it. This is pretty expensive kit, but it allows you to set up the secondary and primary mirrors with a high degree of precision. I also had a Nagler 13mm eyepiece, and the views with this (also expensive!) were just stunning.

These accessories might have cost a lot to get together, but I was really happy with the views. The overall improvement in my scope's performance due to improvements in collimation (compared to before the catseye gear) was somewhere around 15-20%. Using the nagler blew my socks off, and it really took things into another league compared to using my previous eyepieces (GSO and the like). I won't put a percentage on it, because it became a much more immersive and engaging experience...

I tend towards the philosophy of "buy once, buy well" as much as possible, but it does make things expensive initially. However, you get what you pay for, and the pleasure of using well engineered gear is something I really appreciate.

[doppler]

Hi Raymo, one thing you can do is to put tube rings on a solid tube Dob and make it into a multi-function Eq Dob. I use mine on the Eq mount for imaging and on the Dob base for viewing.

[RobNevyn]

I recently bought the Skywatcher 10" Collapsible but without the Goto (due to budget), I am loving it so far.
If you are concerned about not having a full tube just buy the light shroud that suits the 10" collapsible (about $56) for the same result. Collimation is no problem and it is super convenient being able to collapse it down for moving and storage.
Good luck and enjoy whatever way you go.

[bluesilver]

Thanks again for all the replies and suggestions.
Going with a SkyWatcher 10" collapsible with goto.
Just in the process now of sorting through accessories like eye pieces and the like.