Let the Seller Beware

[Hans Tucker]

I made a big mistake trusting an IIS member. I allowed the member to take an item (adapter) for trial on the proviso that if it met their need payment would be made otherwise the item would be returned if deemed not suitable. Well the joke is on me...no payment and no item. You get a false sense of trust on IIS that all members are honest. My mistake.

[gaseous]

If you've exhausted all avenues trying to contact them, maybe it's time to name & shame?

[Imme]

Agreed.

Terrible form

[raymo]

The sooner the better, before he/she cons someone else.
raymo

[Nikolas]

Name and shame we need to be warned

[Wavytone]

Name and shame, on the basis for that if they complete the deal in reasonable time you’ll request this thread be deleted.

That much is fair and the next step - if any - is entirely up to them.

I’d also suggest the IIS Classifieds have a “Sinners” blacklist where those who don’t do the deal are listed for all to see. This should include those guilty of:

- questionable offers from persons with postcounts under 10;
- downright insulting lowball offers,
- those who respond to an ad but stuff the seller, ie do not follow through,
- sellers who do not respond in a timely manner,
- sellers who mis-represent what they are offeting, eg the items are defective or have been stripped/substituted/dismantled and not in the condition described.

The only question remaining is that in order to have some semblance of fairness, once on the blacklist, how can someone get themselves off the blacklist ?

[JA]

Sorry to hear about your woes Hans. You are a nice guy to deal with for purchases and don't deserve that. Hopefully the person will see the error of their ways and do the right thing.

Best
JA

[garymck]

Name them, or at least threaten them with naming. I've only ever had 1 issue on IIS. That was when purchasing a scope that was patently not as advertised from a person in Sydney. The threat of naming was the only reason they gave a refund....

Gary

[N1]

I think there at least 4 other questions on top of that, and they relate to each of the first four "blacklist qualifiers". I can see endless debate about when these criteria are actually met, especially the first two. The 5th, "goods not as advertised" would seem the only one that can be called with reasonable accuracy.


I do support the idea of a system where both sellers and buyers are informed of a given user's track record and community credentials, but care must be taken not to shame unwarrantedly.

[FlashDrive]

Agreed also ...

[Merlin66]

It's a sad affair....
We are a small tightly knit community who share the same love of astronomy,
a family.....
Honesty and mutual respect are part of the fabric.
I hope the individual involved sees this thread and rectifies the situation.

[xelasnave]

May I suggest a reminder to them as sometimes folk forget ...maybe the cheque is in the mail even...if no response I believe it is your duty to let others know if we have a con man. I am not entitely in favour of putting together a group to break legs ...oh heck why not con men need to be taught not to be bad.
Alex

[Wussell]

I would go for naming and shaming, especially if all avenues of resolution have been exhausted. Some of the equipment on here sells for a tidy sum, and the last thing anyone wants is to part with their hard earned only to find it is not what was advertised, or to just be duped.

[m11]

I am sad to hear that has happen to you Hans.

I have found everyone to be trustworthy and easy to deal with.

I think N1 has a good suggestion about users's track record or standing to assist whether you deal with someone if you dont know them.

[Kunama]

Sorry but not surprised to hear that Hans.
Hopefully it is a case of mistake. Unfortunately the system seems to allow some to break the terms of service with no consequences.
I have been lucky so far, having bought and sold lots of stuff on the forum, only one member has blatantly lied about the items he was offering to sell me.
Unfortunately that member seems to be allowed to stay on the forum no matter how many times he misrepresented item condition.....

Hope you get this sorted...

[LewisM]

I think that may be because said person pays for advertising. No matter, the good with the bad. The necessary evil if you will.

I too have only had one deadbeat (despite the never ending mountain of low-ball offers, usually by new accounts, low-post counts etc). Everyone else has been wonderful, both buying and selling. Sometimes we change our minds, or circumstance intervenes, but so long as we let the other party know - or attempt to - then all should be good. To ignore or blatantly lie is yet another can of worms, especially after receiving or sending items.

[sheeny]

Guys.


There will be no blacklist.


IceTrades are offered for the benefit of members, but IIS has NO part in the transaction.


I also refer you to the Terms of Service:


http://www.iceinspace.com.au/tos.html


Specifically:


This applies equally to buyers and sellers.


and this next little bit aims directly at things like blacklists:


and finally





Above all, remember that IceTrades is no different to any other market place.


Caveat emptor always applies.


Al.

[davidmcbain]

I am surprised that this sort of thing is happening in the Astro community

[torana68]

I have only heard of two issues, one was taken to court, suppose there have been others . Generally people who have been here for years are a good bet.

[CosmicEcho]

How can low post counts reflect anything?

It's a real shame when people do the wrong thing. Sorry to hear it mate.

[LewisM]

Unfortunately, low posts are sometimes fake or scam accounts. Hit and run, literally.

[xelasnave]

If I deal with someone I need to know where they live where their extended family lives and how ma y pets they have.
But then I dont get out much.
A percentage of transactions involve a con so just never put yourself in a position where someone can fail to deliver..even with companies you take a risk.
But the best thing to do is write off the experience amd neber think of it again because the real loss will grow to consume more loss of sleep preoccupation with hurt and anger.
Look on the bright side you will never let a big unit out of your hands in the future...or a small one.
So in the future you save thousands..so you are lucky.
Alex

[OICURMT]

+1


I've never sold anything on IIS, but I've purchases my share of a few items.
Not one bad transaction so far, but I do limit my dealings with people who are basically part of the IIS furniture.


I do know of one transaction that went seriously sideways, tried to help out the person in the right (as I knew the individual who was in the wrong) to no avail.

OIC!

[raymo]

I have bought and sold many items here, and never had an issue, but IIS
members are people, just like everybody else, and there will be the occasional bad apple, although I imagine there would be far fewer than on Gumtree
or ebay etc:
raymo

[multiweb]

Well that sucks... Luckily I've never had any issues buying or selling on IIS either. Touch wood.

[GrahamL]

Hope it works out Hans sometimes life messes us all up at times
I've sent and recieved pricey items to/from known members before payment,and once even sent $120 to the wrong person :rolleyes:for payment which they returned .


again hope they come good .


eyepiece arrived btw.

[csb]

Well, about 2 weeks ago I bought the complete dvd box set of The West Wing advertised in the IIS classifieds and was sent a pirate copy. When I played some episodes the picture was blurry and menu system was different on each disc.The box n discs looked legit but had bad English grammar.

You all know this seller by his user name - Jeff.

However, a quick pm and he admitted it possibly was a copy and promptly paid back total cost including postage. Good on ya, Jeff :thumbsup:

I post this as a thank you to Jeff for being upstanding.

Sorry this is not meant to hijack the thread. And apologies to Jeff for any embarrassment.

[Symon]

Hi guys I have a very low post (0) but have bought two items from this awesome site its just i am learning and have nothing to contribute yet
Regards
Simon

[csb]

Welcome Simon.

Everyone starts from 0 :thumbsup:

And the riff-raff usually get sorted.

[brian nordstrom]

:thumbsup: Simon , it's nothing personal as such but as Lewis said we get spammers , rouges , and all sorts from under the rocks here at times ( as all web sites do ) that are only out to rip good people off .

You sound like a good bloke and keep up the work here and your post count will slowly climb and people will trust and respect you the more for it , human nature mate . ;) .

On that I have brought and sold probably 100's of items here and never had one go bad , a few moans but nothing serious and had plenty of trusted sellers send the goods before the money is transfered , as I have sent gear before the money shows , that's trust that only comes from long term membership and I hope you become one :thumbsup: Simon .

Brian .

[TwistedRider]

Much the same here Simon.:welcome:
Although only a few gear related questions, i've found it good to engage in a little banter with the denizens of these 'ere forums. Sort of breaks the ice a bit.



Feel free to comment on photos and things, does help to let people know you're here, and not a troll in waiting :tasdevil:

[Symon]

Thanks guys, I never took it personally it was more along the lines of, if you guys all do this then maybe it would stop the shyer more reserved type people, turns out I was lying anyway as i have bought three things in the past lol.
Regards
Simon

[Symon]

Just adding, I also appreciate the trust shown to me as most of these deals were preformed before I even had an avatar or signature, its also amazing the snippets of information and advice you receive on these transactions.
Regards
Simon

[ab1963]

That's no good Hans but unfortunately where humans are concerned it doesn't shock me and as i did with one of two bad transactions i would not name and shame directly but offered up the info by PM ,The other fella was a protected species and enough said about that ,Have bought and sold quite a lot of gear myself and have always treat others how i would like to be treated and the amount of people that i would send to without payment you can count on one hand and i am certain they know who they are ,as the saying goes "In God we trust others pay cash".

[deanm]

Have bought lots of kit - never once any issues.
Most IISers are genuine & honest.
Dean

[PCH]

I seem to recall a youngster here in Perth borrowed an EQ6 mount from memory in a goodwill gesture by someone in Tassie.

The young fella was a student so I guess Mr Tassie thought he was doing the lad a favour loaning him the equipment.

As I remember, that was the last time Tassie saw his mount and no amount of attempts at communication got anywhere.

This was a few years ago now, but I happened to see a google review left by said rogue a couple of weeks ago at a shop I buy my car tyres and batteries from.

It's a small world hey.

Just saying :)

[Visionoz]

It was not a youngster but a young man who was a student and he was offering a paid service to "tune" the Tassie guy's EQ6 but for reasons known only to the young man himself he didn't finish nor return the item back to the Tassie guy IIRC.

Have recently noted the young man is back into the "service" game again via another person's business...

HTH

Cheers
Bill

[BC]

I bought a Baader MPCC back in 2013 from a very prominent current contributor (not from Victoria) and it was in very poor condition compared with the advert. I just sucked it up because it was small bickies but I'll never buy from him again. I wonder how many other small purchases go unmentioned in a similar vein.
Bruce

[Nikolas]

On a related note
I bought some double 12 volt adapters from a person here and he did send them, however my advice is always provide tracking as the ones he sent were lost in the mail and there was no tracking provided. I believe him as he had sent a heap of other items he sold to others and no one else had an issue, so to prevent losses in the mail which can't be tracked always provide a tracking number!

[casstony]

I'm in the habit of sending the tracking number in case I lose the receipt. For small items I always use a satchel too as I figure it's harder to lose.

[rrussell1962]

I have got into the habit of sending an SMS from the post office with a photo of the tracking number and receipt.

[Zuts]

That's exactly what I do as well.

[casstony]

Show off :)
Some of us can barely cope with a basic SMS, let alone sending a photo by SMS in a high pressure situation like the post office.

[rrussell1962]

Your Post Office is obviously busier and more high pressured than mine on the outer west side of Brisbane. When I go in with a parcel the owner looks puzzled and scratches his head as if he has never seen one before. Then out comes the book of postage rates for parcel sizes with the pocket calculator.

[Octane]

When I got rid of all my photography gear late last year, I did the exact same thing. I also sent everything insured. It's one more step to safeguard yourself.

H

[fsphotography]

BC,(Bruce).
Yes others have had a similar experience to yours. Mine was also with a very,very, prominent member of this community. Not in Victoria. At the time i was relatively new to IIS with just a few posts,and just 19 up to now. I was the buyer/trader. The deal,conditions and time line were dictated by this prominent member meticulously line by line. I dutifully followed his instructions,sent the money and the traded part....then waited. Communication from him was very poor, with no sign of my item in the post as promised. After wasting my time trying to get clarification on when my item would arrive,the alarm bells started to ring. I contacted him requesting the transaction be cancelled and my money and traded part be returned. I no longer trusted in this deal,so far i was bearing all of the risk. What i got from this very prominent supposedly very affable member was a refusal to end the deal. When the item finally arrived it was not as described, i insisted politely on a refund, then the abuse and name calling started and continued over the next couple of communications. I have dealt with a number of IIS sellers,and most times paid by bank transfer before receiving the item even though i don't know them. Only one other
sent a miss-described item but made good when notified. On the whole the IIS community functions very well, i would have no hesitation in buying from them again, but always keeping in mind that its not only the much maligned low poster's or the con men that may bite you.
Sometimes the con men are hiding in a very ''prominent'' position and
can be hard to spot, be careful by all means but lets not be paranoid.



Frank.

[rrussell1962]

Just to be clear, most of my recent sales have been to people I trust and have been on a "pay me in due course basis". But I do think sending a photo of the Aust Post receipt to people you do not know is a good way of protecting yourself. But in my case it was more of a courtesy.

[RB]

As mentioned by my fellow mod, Al Sheehan, please refer to IIS TOS.

Thread is now locked and some posts deleted due to some members getting into personal matters.
If needed, please communicate to relevant parties via PM.

RB