O The Horror, the Horror!

[Decimus]

Well, guys, it's been a bugger of a week for some of us. It started with Aidan's mishap with his new telescope and last night, it was my turn, but unfortunately, I was unable to avoid catastrophe...

Awful cloud outside last night, so I set up the APM 152mm Apo(for the very first time) facing east over the balcony, looking out across the Derwent River at the city lights on the eastern shore, many kilometres away. tried out all of the Pentax EPs and the 42mm Vixen LVW and was pleased with all the views. Then my wife took a quick photo of me (see pic) before I detached the scope from the mount to pack away. The dew cap (well over a foot long) was a bit stiff but I pushed it back into its fully retracted position (with the dust cap on) before detaching the scope. That was fine. Once the telescope was on the carpet, I thought I would look once more at the objective to see all was in order and blow of any dust.

So what did I do? Stupidly, I grabbed the dust cap and removed it with one hand - of course, it flipped onto the carpet and during its downward trajectory, I heard a sickening clunk. It sounded as if it had connected with the objective which, of course, was now close to the end of the tube as I had fully retracted the dew shield. I looked at the objective with my LED torch and there, off centre, was a tiny 2.5 - 3mm fine mark resembling a tiny straight line. I felt vomitoriously ill and angry with myself for being such a stupid, clumsy oaf. It was one of those moments in life you just don't forget.

I don't know what to do now. I checked it again today and there it was in daylight, though still hard to see. I have no idea how this will affect observing and photography, but I am, to put it mildly, crest-fallen. I suppose I could send it back to Germany, (get new optics in the same tube) but I might wait and see what happens when I observe first. Alas, no stellar photons have passed through this scope and it is all very depressing.

My wife, the little angel, looked at me and said, 'We can buy a new one'. I looked at her dumbfounded, and said (somewhat weakly but also lovingly), 'No, I wouldn't do that!'

So what I have learnt from this experience? A new golden rule:
NEVER REMOVE A DUST CAP FROM THE TELESCOPE UNTIL THE DEW SHIELD IS AT FULL EXTENSION!

On my way to archery this morning, I cursed and swore at myself- torrents of abuse - and then remembered those lines by Chevy Chase (Clark Griswold) from 'the immortal movie, 'Christmas Vacation' when he rants and raves about his mean boss who had refused all employees a Christmas bonus: '"Of all the low-down, ...." I said the same: 'Of all the moronic. half-witted. clumsy, oafish,...."and much worse, which shall not be repeated here.

The custom-made telescope case is being sent to me on Monday, but at the moment, I can't really get excited about anything.... :(:(

Why does this stuff happen?? Somewhere out there in the universe, there is a killjoy...:confused2:

Richard

[barx1963]

Richard
While I feel your pain, it is very unlikely that such a small mark will have serious effect on the images. Wait until you actually use it before getting too depressed!!:sadeyes:
Major question that comes to mind is what is the dust cap made of? Obviously a metal one is going to have a greater effect than a plastic one.

BTW, I note you are an archer (lot's of 'em on IIS) I did archery for many years, what do you shoot?

Malcolm

[gts055]

Hii Richard, these unpredictable things happen and yes its frustrating but, its only a tiny mark, perhaps on the coating. Try not to look at the objective :) its way more satisfying looking through it. I doubt anyone could look through your telescope and say, Richard, I think you have a tiny obstruction causing a barely perceptible degree of light scattering. And, think of all those newtonians, cassegrains, richey chretiens, and maksutovs etc with secondary mirror obstructions (some are huge) and the thousands of proud owners who don't notice any image degradation. They still manage to give quite nice images :) Enjoy your magnificent telescope. Mark

[el_draco]

I concur. You have probably just marked the coating. Apart from an infinitesimal amount of scattering, that should be it.

[multiweb]

+1 I wouldn't worry about it. I thought you split the lens reading at first :eyepop: Little scratch won't hurt. Don't worry about it. It's a big aperture. Enjoy the scope.

It's like when you get a brand new car with shiny metallic paint. The first spec of dust on it irritates you then one day your 5 year old kid learning how to ride his new bicycle for xmas makes a 1m long gash on the side doors with his brake handle ... and you have another beer. :lol: Life goes on.

[RickS]

A sickening feeling but you won't be able to detect any difference in performance, Richard.

[brian nordstrom]

:sadeyes: sad tale , but I concur with what the guys are saying here , its probably only a mark in the coatings or a paint sleek from the cap.

I know you wont stop looking for this every time you use the scope but time heals as we all know , just get out and use this magnificant instrument .

Brian.

[Slawomir]

Just echoing others, do not worry about it Richard as this small scratch won't affect your scope's performance. Just think of dust and dirt that gradually accumulates on each telescope's lens and it does not need cleaning until the lens gets quite dirty (or how big a central obstruction is in some telescopes?).

Maybe this incident is a gift from the universe? I'm sure you will look after your new baby even more carefully from now on and that's why it will serve you very well for many many years to come :)

[Decimus]

Thanks guys to all of you for your kind, supportive remarks- just what I need right now as I am well and truly in the dumps and mad at myself. Yes, Suavi, I will take extra extra care next time! A lesson well and truly learned.

It's comments like these that re-assure us we are among friends of like persuasion. Not to be too maukish and sentimental, I am feeling a bit teary in response...Fancy admitting to that on a public forum.

Anyway, I wish we could all meet up at a giant observing convention in some farmer's paddock in the middle of Australia (actually, central Aus is brilliant) with every manner of telescope known to man, some light or not-so-light beverages, and just enjoy the cosmic spectacle in good company. I would gladly buy a ticket to such an event! A starmus-type event, too. If our American friends can do this, so can we, surely...

My thanks to you all. Some wind is coming back into the sails!:)

Cheers,
Richard

[marc4darkskies]

Aw Richard! I feel your pain mate!! Glad you're starting to feel a bit better now. Like everyone else I'm sure there will be no noticeable aberrations visible as a result of the mishap and the views you get will be spectacular.

That reminds me. Not as frightening as your incident, but one night years ago I was packing up my TOA-150 for the night (before I had an Obs) and, forgetting I had the dust cap off, I used the flat of my hand to push the dew shield back in. The feeling of cool glass on the palm of my greasy hand led to a torrent of loud self abuse. I can tell you, the greasy, but crystal clear palm print covering the objective was a thing to behold!

Marcus

[Decimus]

Thanks, Marcus. Your comment did make me chuckle as it's the sort of thing I think I will be increasingly prone to, now that I am getting on in years - such a vivid description of the hand meeting the objective! (How did you remove the hand-print?)

I will be taking extra care now with the APM. The power supply is due this week, so no more manipulation of the Dec and RA clutches, at least.

Cheers,
Richard

[Decimus]

I have not yet bought a bow, Malcolm. Am thinking of a Win&Win recurve bow, but will wait a bit longer. I have only been doing archery for 8 weeks or so. Yes, the dust cap on the APM is solid metal and quite heavy, but I was sure stupid in the unthinking way I removed it....

Cheers,
Richard

[barx1963]

Richard
Obviously a metal cap has more potential to do damage, but from sound of it it should be mainly cosmetic.

Anyway back to more important things, glad to hear you are a recurve man. I started shooting back in the late 70s (I was a very annoying junior archer back then!) when it was all recurve, at least in the target side of things, and then those damnable wheelie compound bows started coming in in the early 80s. I haven't shot seriously for nearly 20 years after my shoulder packed it in, but I miss it a lot. Nothing like the feeling of a nice clean release and knowing without even looking that you have nailed the ten ring.

Malcolm

[billdan]

I feel your pain Richard, I pray that everything is going to be OK for you.

I have certainly done similar things, like most recently with my brand new OAG, somehow I scratched the prism fiddling about. I doubt I could even buy a replacement, just have to avoid guiding on a star in that zone.

I am keeping my fingers crossed for you.

Bill

[gregbradley]

I can imagine how you feel.

There is a good chance it will clean off. The anti reflection coatings are usually a bluish or greenish colour and they do seem slightly fluid.

Some unscented white tissues and some Bintel cleaning fluid and some ery light rubbing would tell if it will lift or if its a scratch.

The front element is most likely crown glass and is pretty tough.

As others have said I doubt it will show up visually.

Greg.

[strongmanmike]

I agree with Greg, unlikely to be any damage to the glass, just the coatings the affect on visual or imaging performance will be zero :thumbsup:...beautiful scope BTW

Know how you would have felt though :scared:...many years ago my brand new 12" SCT slid off it's wedge and crashed, eyepiece end, to the ground (grass luckily!) hitting a tripod leg on the way....the shock made me shake and feel physically ill for hours. In the end the only damage was to the finderscope bracket and a small dent in the tripod leg. A quick recollimation and I forgot about the incident in a few days :)

Oh and Almost did what Marcus described, a few times, with my Starfire 6"...just managing to avoid the palm print at the very last second each time :lol:

Mike

[Slawomir]

A barbed wire around rectractable dew shield could help to remember to keep hands off the lens... :lol:

[Decimus]

Thanks, Bill, Greg, Michael and Suavi - your comments are re-assuring. I think I'll just leave things as they are and see what happens when I actually get a chance to look at some stars...this cloudy Tassie weather is frustrating, blocking any views of Jupiter, Saturn and Mars all of which are in view at the same time, not to mention the deep sky beauties that you guys image with such astounding skill and success.

Cheers, and Clear Skies,
Richard

[Decimus]

Like you, Malcolm, I have a total aversion to compound bows - they do make life a bit too easy for the archer, so it's little wonder they are disallowed in Olympic archery competition. And they even look, well, like antiquated sewing machines:rofl: I too, love to hear the satisfying 'thwack'when that arrow hits a 10! Sweet stuff. The ultimate challenge, however, is the long bow (no sights, counterbalancing gear, etc). Pure Robin Hood stuff and all about skill.

A bit off the telescope topic, but good to hear from a fellow archer!

Cheers,
Richard

[janoskiss]

As others have said, it's very unlikely to be anything but only cosmetic damage. It will of course impact on the resale value of the instrument but it won't hurt its performance any.

[Decimus]

Thanks, Steve. Mind you, I don't intend selling it - at least not any time soon, if ever :)

Cheers,
Richard

[Manav]

Hi Richard - If it makes you feel any better you arent the only one :)

My horror tale (http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=112877)

Btw - Love the centurion outfit

[Shiraz]

then try to forget about it:thumbsup:. The cosmetic damage is probably not of any practical significance - it takes a fair bit to do real optical damage to a telescope. https://astroanecdotes.com/2015/03/26/the-mcdonald-gun-shooting-incident/

[Decimus]

Thanks, Yugant - your mishap was a lot worse than mine; I was appalled when I read it! And there was that other story of the screw on the Losmandy dovetail plate stopping the OTA from crashing to the ground...Wow...All sickening stuff.

Glad you like the armour - it's actually a very expensive piece of replica Roman armour (the only one in Australia, as far as I know). It is an almost identical replica (but in electroplated gold and silver on 18-gauge steel) of the breastplate on the statue of Augustus (Rome's first emperor) of Prima Porta now housed in the Vatican Museum. Take a look at the photos and compare the breastplates. I sometimes wore this for my students at college where I taught Roman Politics and History (Ancient Civilisations) until a few months ago, when I retired :( (see the Vatican original too).

Cheers,
Richard

[Decimus]

Great story, Ray! There's hope after all!:)

Cheers,
Richard

[janoskiss]

Quite a story. And goes to show how naively honest scientists can be. I probably would have gone along with the "mirror was destroyed" or at least badly damaged story and insisted that the assailant should pay for repairs.

Roman soldier dude, don't worry about it. It's a little cosmetic vanity scratch that will not have any effect on the scope's performance. Think of it like a little scratch on the bonnet of a brand new Ferrari. The Ferrari will go, accelerate and go around corners as fast as before the bonnet got a scratch on it. It's purely cosmetic.

[skysurfer]

I would worry the same way when this occurs to my scope. The scar remains visible when you look at the objective. But it is indeed a very small scar and unnoticeable when observing visually or photographically, so it is only cosmetic.

Is the dust cap a metal (usually aluminum) disk ? Then you should indeed be careful.

[Decimus]

Hi Skysurfer,
Yes, the dust cap is metal and feels heavy possibly aluminium. Why don't they make them out of plastic - strong. light, etc? Am still waiting for a clear sky! Thanks for the re-assurance.
Cheers,
Richard

[janoskiss]

You could just get / find / make one out of plastic. They don't make it out of plastic because that would look and feel cheap. But I don't think you'll be making the same mistake again; you'll always remove and set it down carefully from here on.

[Slawomir]

Plastic cap would allow infrared light into the scope - might not be an ideal scenario for astrophotography when taking dark frames with a camera that has no shutter :question: