HEQ5/EQ6 Upgrades

[Astroman]

Hi all,

I was wondering what peoples thoughts are on the upgrades to the HEQ5 or EQ6 mounts. Currently I am slowly improving my telescope and making it lighter ie, change tube to carbon fibre, swap 3 vane spider to 4, getting a new secondary mirror, new crayford focuser. The aim for doing all this is photography and since my budget is somewhat limited (wife wont let me get a loan) I have to do it over a long period of time :(

The mount I eventually want to get is either one of the above mounts with some sort of modification so goto's can be performed or even use through a computer.

I just need some sort of idea which to keep away from and which are quite easy to install/use.

Thanks. :astron:

[mch62]

Hi Astroman,I have a standard EQ6 mount .
They will easily handle a 10"f6 or a 12" f4.5 Newtonian.
They have a 25kg load handling but you have to watch the length of the OTA. 1500mm will be OK .
I have mentioned the following else where but will repeat it here.

They are for the $1500 pretty good but do have a few little things that need dealing with depending on the Quality control of the unit you buy.
Namely PE and back lash .
The quality can vary although it appears to be less of a problem with new units these days.
I have herd that the new SkyScan EQ6 the one with Go-To has addressed some of these problems but at an Aussie cost of $3000-$3300 depending on who is trying to rip ----I mean selling it.
If your on a budget get the EQ6 standard and upgrade later on.
You can get a Sky Scan upgrade or one of the various after market upgrades.
The after market ones are cheaper and can offer things the Sky Scan doesn't.

One of the better after market ones is from a company called http://www.astromeccanica.it/da1_ENG.htm
http://www.astromeccanica.it/motor.htm

This upgrade with an EQ6 will cost less than a Sky Scan.

The beauty of this unit Go-To is in the motors and gearing.
What it does is to eliminate any back lash and PE of an intermediate gearbox by doing away with it .
The subject of much of the problem with an EQ6 is the intermediate gearbox on the motors..

These upgraded motors also have more torque than the originals and will allow for faster slew speeds.

The Go-to will work stand alone or can be integrated to most star charting programs and even the free ware one called Carte De Ciel.
There easy really easy to fit even for a novice and you will have the original controller and motors to refit incase of the worst case scenario.

Mark

[Astroman]

Thanks Mark,

That was basically the setup I was looking at the DA-1 with motor kit for around AU$990 and the EQ6 for about AU$1500 Looks like a good deal to me for good goto.

No for the hard part....saving.

[mch62]

Astroman , if and when you get it let me know how it goes.

I haven't done mine yet but intend to when my observatory and fork mount is finished. Need to finish them first.
I only use my EQ6 as a grab and go mount now.

I contemplated this kit a while ago before i decided to make a large mount, and contacted several people who had done theres and where all were very pleased with the difference and rated it as good as some of the more expensive mounts around.

There is a guy up here in central QLd that has done his and I was most impressed the time I saw it working , but have lost contact with him since. The thing i was concentrating on was the back lash , and there was well none or very little in the worm alone.
He was only using the motor and pully set up and had a different home made controller , but the Am controller looks pretty impressive and full of all the features you need.

Mark

[mick pinner]

just recieved an e-mail from Paolo Lazzarotti from Astromeccanica on the EQ6 upgrade, DA1 Drive + AM-EQ6D motor kit, it is priced at 550 euro + 80 euro postage, all up in aussie dollars it is $1,056.38 and delivery is between 10 - 15 working days.
Mick.

[mch62]

That + 1500$ for the Eq6 winds up cheaper than a Sky Scan here in OZ , although I am not sure what Andrews charges for the Sky Scan.
The main thing is you will wide up with a better more powerfull over all system.
It's a shame you can't get that price under a $1000 Aus to by pass the import paper work for items over a $1000.:whistle:

Did you go through the manual and what are your thoughts on the controller. You can down load it from the web site.

Mark

[Astroman]

DA1 Dual Axis Drive is now including
AM motor kit + GOTO PC based Software
starting from 475 EURO!!!
This price is valid for stocked parts

This is the current price now.

[mch62]

I think that 475 euro is for the vixen System if you look down the bottom of the web page you will nitice the Losmandy and EQ6 HEQ5 prices are higher , due to different configurations I would presume.

[slice of heaven]

Andrews price yesterdaywas $1399 for eq6 and $1199 for SS

Slice

[iceman]

That's a bit cheaper than his prices online, looks like they've come down a bit.

[mch62]

Is that $1199 for the upgrade to a Sky scan if you have an EQ6 ?

What is the price for a complete EQ6 Sky Scan from the factory.

At these prices it a tuff call on the aftermarket kit and a Sky Scan kit.
Nice to see some more realistic pricing on the mounts to what has been advertised elsewhere.

The basic difference I can see are , the Astromeccanica kit has 20% stronger motors and a better motor drive set up and the controller will interface with popular charting programs to give full Go-To via a computer screen.( eg click on an object hit go to and away it goes)
The controller buy itself is not Go-To but a better version of a standard drive controll.
So you will need a laptop or computer to have Go-To and a charting program available as freeware if need be.

The Sky scan is a stand alone Go-To with star alighnment via the hand controll.
They both have the ability to auto guide via an auxilary port and have back lash controll.
The AM kit will guide via a ToUcam not sure of the SS.
The SS has PE not sure on the Am kit.

looking at the two the Sky scan is most probably better for a novice or beginner where the Am kit would suit the intermediate to more advanced user with more bells and whistles.
That's how i see it any way.

Don't get me wrong , from a search on the web it appears the Sky Scan EQ6 is a great unit addressing the problems of the standard mount and more than capable of long exposure CCD from some of the pics being posted.

Ther are other kits made to suit the EQ6 and they have all misteriously come down in price so it appears there is quite a market for a good contoller for the EQ6.

Mark

[slice of heaven]

Yes,the upgrade.
But like you said the extra benefits of the AM put that in front.

[Astroman]

Was the PE issue done on the DA-1, I didn't see any menion that they had added this.

I don't know of anyone in Adelaide with a SS EQ6, would be nice to look at it and listen and get a feel for it.

[mch62]

I think telescopes-astronomy.com.au sell them down your way, He might know of some one with one.
Now you mention it i dont see mention of PE correction in the DA1 only the DA2 .
Have sent an e-mail to see.

[mch62]

Here is a reply to my Question about PE controll for the DA1 from Astromeccanica.

Quote:

The DA1 has no PE control because we noticed there's no chinese mounting capable to perform a regular error after many worm gear laps. The PE with these mountings is regular within 2-3 laps only.
So we developed a very good autoguiding system through both the webcam and ST4 protocol in order to completely eliminate any periodic error and DEC drifts at the same time.

end quote:

Interesting so I wonder how the PE works on the Sky Scan or if the worms have been improved from the Standard:confuse3:
Another e-mail me thinks.

[slice of heaven]

Kirks cameras has listed on their website the Eq6+SS for $2365 and the upgrade for $979.( Feb 2005 )

I rang to confirm these prices and ask for a price on just the EQ6.
The person required was off sick so I'll update or confirm these prices when I know.

$2365 is close to $1000 less than another retailers list price!!!!!!
WHO'S kidding WHO!!!!!

The next question is ; How low a price CAN these be obtained for ?

Slice

[slice of heaven]

Confirmed with Kirk's today those are the current prices. The eq6 mount alone is $1649 though.
Anybody know when the new version of SS is due?

Slice

[mch62]

lee Andrews told me he can't do it for $2365 so Kirks Cameras has it for the Sky Scan all though Lees prices for the EQ6 alone is $1399. Go figure.

[Strgazr27]

Andrew,

Here's my take on upgrading the EQ-6. In all about 20 hours worth of work. The mount cost $799 US dollars. The LXD55/75 Motors and 497 HC can be found for around $225 US Dollars. What I have now is a Stellar mount with FULL GoTo, PEC,GPS,Updateable via DL's,Motor calibration and Autoguiding via Webcam, LPI, ST-4 or DSI as well as every other feature of the AutoStar from Meade.

The mount, as far as I am concerned cannot be touched in it's price bracket. I have ordered the upgraded bearings through my auto parts dealer here. I could spend $3000 + US dollars on a LOMO G-11 but why? I have a mount that is within 98% of it performance wise at a 1/3 the cost.

[Strgazr27]

A shot of the motors ready to go in.....

[Strgazr27]

The motors installed and almost completed....Just need to finish spraying the encoders Ultra Flat Black.

[slice of heaven]

It' a crazy world of retail isn't it.
The mount from Lee at $1399 and the upgrade from Kirks at $979 would give you a spare setup (in case the SS died) for $2378.

Hmmm

[Astroman]

Now thats a little more like it...$2378 is a bit more reasonable than the $3000 that Astronomy online have them for.

I had thought of the Autostar and the LXD motors but realisticaly I wouldn't know where to start. I am one of these people that have thousands of ideas but unfortunately I usually stuff things up when I try and do something. For example I tried making my Dob mount a GOTO mount from scratch, spend years on it litterally 1997 I started the project and still haven't finished, I have since given up on that idea for the EQ6.

My fear is I would spend money on the EQ6 and the Autostar and stuff it up somehow when I install it, there wasting my money.

Also the encoder wheels on the lxd are easily bent arn't they? I heard of quite a few lxd-55's having bent encoder wheels as the main cause for the goto not being very accurate.

[Strgazr27]

Andrew,

It took me 20 hours total over about 5 days to do the conversion. Really nothing super hard about it. If I can do it anyone can.

The encoders are somewhat fragile but if handled with care they come through fine. A trick with them is to spray them Krylon Ultra Flat Black. Seems to smooth out the slewing and tighten up the GoTo's. The number one issue with the Autostar setup is doing a motor calibration and a drive training routine. This solves 98% of most GoTo issues.

[mch62]

I think that you have done a great job of the conversion but was wondering how are the motor from the smaller lxd mounts Torque wise.
The lxd 55 75 mount is only the size of an EQ5 load capacity and from reports is only just up to holding the 10"SN.
I think if your going to upgrade the larger EQ6 mount motors you would want to have more powerful motors and better holding torque which the Astromeccanica kit has.
The motors are fair bit larger with a 20% increase in torque and fill the motor cavity with the motors only -no electronics in the cavity.
As such the reduction ratio has been reduced to allow even faster slew speeds while maintaining more torque.
The AM kit in the DA-1 doesn't have a PE correction as I have been told (see previous post) as if your using an auto guider in the form of a cheap web cam the PE controll is not needed .

Don't get me wrong i think the time you have spent and $ saved are great but what is the mounts abilities now load wise.
Do you have a torque figure for the LXD motors?

Mark

[Strgazr27]

Mark,

I don't have torque figures for the LX motors but I can tell you this, if you've seen the stock motors that come with the mount (Actually you can if you look at my focuser. The motor, gearbox and gear are ALL the original EQ-6 hardware. Now compare them to the AS motors shown below. No comparison.

The 55/75 weakness was/is not the motors ability to slew the scope but the mounts ability to carry the weight. The payload is based mainly for stability issues.

I also used the original Meade drive gear which, being smaller, helps to increase the torque over the stock EQ6 motors.

I would have to say the mount still carries it's original payload capacity although I can honestly say the figure Synta quotes isan absolute visual rating and in no way could be used for imaging. JMO.

This is the Autostar motor and gaerbox mounted to the modified original EQ6 motor plate. Ig nore the comments about the drive gear as I wound up going with the stock Meade drive gears as I said above.

[Strgazr27]

One more.....