I want one of these!

[gregbradley]

Am I a hopeless gearhead?

Check this little baby out:


http://www.astro-physics.com/products/telescopes/180fastmax/180fastmax.pdf

Maybe if enough people say they will buy one they will consider making more.

Greg.

[glend]

Good to see more Mak-Newts coming to market, as the pioneers of the design they should have produced it earlier, but at $7800 USD it's making my Skywatcher MN190 look like the bargain of all time - you could buy 5 * MN190s delivered locally for that price! Alot of premium for the Astro-Physics branding.
The specs are surprisingly close to the MN190, including an identical obstruction figure, the AP is little heavier (no surprise there), but the MN is a little longer fl at 1000mm so f5.3. It would be good to see a side by side visual and imaging preformance test of these two scopes. I will put my MN190 up against your AP Fastmax180 Greg.

[Peter Ward]

Looks nice....and like all things AP will no doubt be optically & mechanically sublime :thumbsup:
P.S
If you've never driven an S-Class Benz, you won't understand the price tag

[glend]

Well since they are not going to be offered to the masses, to quote the AP link:

This instrument is being offered first to people who signed up on our notification list many years ago. We will not add new names to the list since we do not have plans to produce additional Maksutov -Newtonians.

It seems that Greg will not be able to buy one anyway. Since it is a limited production run I guess they can promote the idea of exclusivity. Leaving the masses to settle for the MN190.
Still why the news release if the production run is spoken for already?

[AlexN]

The people on the list have no obligation to buy. There may be a number of them released to people not on the original list.

I was on the list for a sf130ed for 6 years before my name came up and unfortunately at the time I had just had my second child and wasn't in a position to take the scope.

I will second Peter Ward. You can't compare the skywatcher mn190 in any way to an astro-physics scope. Especially not then saying you're paying for AP branding.

You can buy a Nissan GTR cheaper than a Lamborghini aventador, they are both incredibly fast, they both do practically the same thing but it's the final quality, finishing touches, attention to detail that see the sales of the Lamborghini stay consistently higher.

[Slawomir]

The scope may also be bought together with Mach1 and Eagle pier - that would be a very awesome combo for the lucky few...

[MortonH]

Whoa. I would love one of those!

[glend]

I think your proving my point. It's a telescope, not an 'object d' art'. If your paying for something beyond functionality, when specs are the same, then it has intrinsic value as a collectable or allows you to join an exclusive group through being able to pay more.

[gregbradley]

It would be interesting to put the FastMAx up against an MN190. Of course I don't have a FastMax as I was never on that list.

AP comes down to the fact that everything is perfect though. The optics will be sharper. They will be far less susceptible to thermal currents. The focuser will be perfect and won't need an immediate replacement. There will be no mirror shift. I can't say anything about MN scopes as I have never had one but as I recall from others the focuser is a weak point and perhaps some mirror shift but I could be wrong.

Certainly a scope like this is not for everyone and value for money is an important aspect of any purchase.

These types of scopes could face a revival with the popularity of smallish sensors like the Sony ICX694 and the KAF8300. Small and light. Look at the wonderful images on this site being taken with 4 inch refractors and KAF8300's or Sony ICX sensors.

Also keep in mind that if it performs similarly to a high end 6 inch APO what is the cheapest high quality APO? Tak TOA150B is about US$10,500,
AP155 2nd hand is about the same, TEC160FL is US$12,000+,
APM (not sure they are in the same league) around US$8500.).

A 6 inch APO is a versatile instrument though being able to handle large chips as well as small ones and things like flatteners and reducers that work are readily available.

Greg.

[Peter Ward]

Same? Nup.

I doubt the Skywatcher would have the same mechanical and optical perfection of the AP.

That last few percent...important to some, less so to others...but it always costs the $$$

[AlexN]

It's a bit like saying you could buy an orion optics 8" f/4 newt for a few thousand dollars but why would you because you can buy a GSO for $400. Yeah they are both 8" f/4 newts but that's where the similarities end.

The differences between an ap Mn and and the skywatcher in my opinion would be far more than just some trimming and a brand. Optically and design aspects will be better. It will work out of the box. The sw mn will need work to get it image ready.

[glend]

I have found the following information about these AP Mak-Newts, from Dwight56 on Cloudy Nights (who seems to own ten APs):

around 1994 Roland embarked on making the 180 Mak Newt and 235 Mak Newt both were very well received at the Canadian Astro fest held in August in Ontario Canada and also at Winter Star Party in Florida during those years. Of the 11 sets or 180 Fast Maks made only two were sold the others were left in storage. Now that we are in the present day its time for AP to clean out the closet and finish off these scopes and sell the last 8 Fast Maks. to those who might still be interested in them. The reason AP never went into full production was the simple fact they could never compete in price with the Mak Newts being imported into this country from foreign countries. It does not matter if Rolands scopes were and are techinically superior which I'm sure they are it all comes down to price. I might mention these Mak Newts AP will have the newer coatings that did not exist in the mid ninties.

So it seems that there will only be 8 of these available to those on the list, or others who express interest if the originals don't want them. No doubt they will be collectors items. Still they were made around 1994, so in storage since then, what's that 20+ years.

Wonder what else AP has in the closet?

[AlexN]

Boggles the mind. It would be interesting to see if there is any old ap600e mounts they no longer want.

[gregbradley]

My concern is that AP seem to be cleaning out stocks of materials from earlier times and I wonder if that means they are looking at retirement soon.

The 175 EDF was done because Roland had some 175mm blanks lying around. Now these from the closet. He even sold his own 175 EDF a few weeks ago.

If he retires then expect the prices of AP scopes to go up a lot.

One other thing about quality scopes like these is they really don't depreciate much. Its a matter of having to come up with the $ at the start. When it comes time to resell you should be able to get the bulk of your cost back. That doesn't occur with more plentiful scopes where you take about a 30-40% hit in lower resale value.

I decided early on after taking several hits from getting lesser gear that I knew I would never be long term happy with that it was far better to go for the better gear. Better enjoyment along the way and if you do decide to sell the bulk of your cost is available in resale.

It especially makes sense when the Aussie dollar was high as when the inevitable occurs and it drops down there is a gain there seeing as most of these high end scopes go back to US buyers.

Greg.

[RobF]

An intriguing mix of quality and sweet spot for FL and focal ratio. Long enough to reach most mainstream objects but still nice FOV for the diffuse fuzzies.

Must remember to buy lotto ticket. Or may not need to if only a handful being made.

[KenGee]

You can never have too many scopes.
There is nothing like great gear (though many astro items are over priced), but in the end the best gear is the gear you use.

[gregbradley]

Hi Ken,

Your equipment list says you have a GSO RC16. How is that? Any images?

Greg.

[glend]

While following the discussion on CN about the few AP Fastmacs that have made it to people on the short list (that signed up twenty years ago), I can't help but wonder at the collectable mentality at work. I saw one suggestion that it should remain unopened in its box to appreciate till some telescope nirvana point when he would sell it for a large amount of money, no doubt after Roland has retired or died.
I am reminded of the Big Bang Theory episode where Leonard opened the box that contained a Spock figurine in a transporter thus devaluing it - as with all their collectables they have to be 'in the box un-opened'. Thus their enjoyment is in the acquistion and coveting ownership but not in any form of usage.;)