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View Full Version here: : 350D.. Finally!!!!!! hehe .. a few Q's.


EzyStyles
14-08-2006, 11:07 PM
Hi Guys,

My birthday is next week and i found out that im getting a 350D!! yayy!!! . I've been telling my gf about the canon 350d for astrowork (should have told her about the SBIG's :P ) and she decided to organise with my friends to get one.

I don't think im planning to mod it .. not just yet but was wondering what rings/adapters will i need to mount to camera on my 2" focuser? also what software cables etc etc.. and how to go by with the setting up process.

thanks :) :)

A happy man finally.

h0ughy
15-08-2006, 06:25 AM
well congratulations, no stopping you now!

OneOfOne
15-08-2006, 06:29 AM
So now you will have to start all over again!

Merlin66
15-08-2006, 07:14 AM
A 2" to T ring thread, a T ring to Cannon adaptor and recommend DSLR focus software and the serial cable to control long exposures... Thats a good starting point.

EzyStyles
15-08-2006, 01:43 PM
start all over again from ETA onwards :P cheers Merlin . I forgot to mention what about my 1.25 inch filters? or do i have to get a 1.25" T ring thread?

thanks.

Striker
15-08-2006, 02:33 PM
With a DSLR you use 2" filters..1.25" will be too small...all accessories will need to be 2".

Merlin66
15-08-2006, 05:15 PM
Strikers 100% right, to get the maximum field coverage you need to use 2" filters ( 48mm thread, I think??!!) However if you're like me you probably have a box of 1 1/4" filters for visual work ( they work OK for me with the mod web cam!)
A good question, how CAN they be made to fit? Forget the vignetting for a moment.... is there a 24mm to 48mm adaptor etc?????????

Geoff45
15-08-2006, 06:34 PM
You will need some way of cotrolling the camera. This can be as simple as using a remote release (canon part RS-60E3) and timing exposures manually. You can also run things from a computer using something like ImagesPlus. You'll need a long usb extension cable and if you want to take exposures longer than 30 seconds, you need a cable from here http://www.hapg.org/astrocables.htm Alternatively,(and I haven't tried this but I have ordered the stuff) you could get a Canon TC-80N3 camera controller modified for digital Rebel XT (350D) from here http://www.sciencecenter.net/hutech/canon.htm This allows an entire exposure session tobe programed in, for example, 20 exposures of 4minutes each with a pause of 10 seconds between each frame and then you don't need a laptop in the field (as long as you have a decent sized memory card). You could also by pass the limited camera battery storage by getting a DC adapter from Hutech, which you can use with a 12v battery (Again, I haven't tried it, but I have ordered one). Bintel sells T rings and adapters.
Geoff

UniPol
15-08-2006, 08:54 PM
Hi,

I use a Seagull brand right angle finder which slips on the 350D viewfinder nicely, sure beats lying on the ground (at times) trying to get the focus right. I suppose Canon make one but it would be pretty expensive. Good luck with the camera, I think you will get a lot of use out of it, not only for astrophotography but lots of happy snaps. I owned a 300D before the 350D and it gave perfect service over a two year period. When it was sold the counter showed over 10,000 firings of the shutter, I doubt whether many film cameras would go this distance save for professional ones. One more thing, definitely use the mirror lock up feature particularly at the faster shutter speeds, it certainly makes a difference to the quality of astrophotos.

Cheers, Steve.

davidpretorius
15-08-2006, 08:56 PM
you have answered my question from another thread, congrats ezy!!! you lucky bugga!

Shawn
16-08-2006, 04:42 AM
I made my own serial adapter, I used an opto isolator or optocoupler, whatever you call em in this country. chip , with a red and a geen LED for on off for open and closed, helps with port troubleshooting, all stuffed into a 9pin clamshell..all parts easilly available from dicky smith and there ilk..
pretty easy to assemble too,

Shawn
16-08-2006, 04:46 AM
PS, some of the T,rings that you can get are crap, they have 3 tiny screws that hold the inner ring in place just loose enough to rotate on the outer ring, but the screws themselves are too short to maintain a desent thread on the outer ring when nipped up , the result being Mr 350D takes a tumble, mine nearly did, the neckstrap got caught on the balance rail,,,,,Whew !!!!

Merlin66
16-08-2006, 02:43 PM
maybe Striker can answer this one....
If the 1 1/4" filter were place literally inside the T ring adaptor ie just outside the body of the 350D would there really be significant vignetting of the CCD chip????

Striker
16-08-2006, 03:12 PM
It will definetly be reduced..may not get rid of it all but surely most of it will be gone...worth a try.

Shawn
16-08-2006, 03:14 PM
I for one would say no ,,,to any vignetting at all, unless its a really really short Focal length scope , and nothing else adjusting the optical path of the light, ie EP projection or FF/FRs the chip on the 350 is just too small...but in saying that how would achieve that. just curious..
Ezy Im all ears, got a similar dilema myself..

Merlin66
16-08-2006, 03:38 PM
I'll make up a prototype filter holder at the weekend which will fit inside a T ring adaptor and hold a 1 1/4" filter central.... just to check it out! If it works I'll post details. I'll also check the size of the chip v's input focal ratio ie angle of the entry light beam through the T-ring.

Merlin66
17-08-2006, 06:22 AM
Based on a clear filter diameter of 30mm, positioned 50mm in front of the CCD chip and a chip size of 22.2 x 14.8mm

F6.5 system will give an unvignetted diam of 15mm
F12 system will give a diam of 22mm
and to give a completely unvignetted coverage of the whole chip ( 27mm diagonal) you would need to use f33.

Conclusion: Minimum focal ratio F12, best F33.

What do you find???

EzyStyles
17-08-2006, 05:30 PM
apologise for not replying, but im just trying to get some sense in me what you guys are talking about :P keep going keep going :)

EzyStyles
17-08-2006, 05:33 PM
in regards to geoffs post, i was thinking of the shoestring adapter to control the exposures. If i use the USB cable, i can save all taken images onto the laptop instead of the memory card? do i have to order from hutech with the 12v constant power? or i can get that locally from eg: ted's camera etc? Is it that much of a difference with a modded 350 than an unmodded one? Besides the colour difference from what i have seen around here, anything else?

thanks for the help so far guys.

Striker
17-08-2006, 05:42 PM
Eric, we are talking about the actual size of the 1 1/4 filter and how this will affect your image using a 350D..you have to remember the DSLR chip is a lot bigger then your DSI 2 so when you image through such a small filter not all the light is going to hit your chip specialy around the edges...this is vignetting

This will produce bright center going to dark outer edges...how severe this will be is what we are discussing.

I personaly would ditch the 1 1/4 filters for use with a DSLR and image with 2" accessories such as Canon EOS t-Ring and the orion 2" prime focus adapter which you can thread 2" filters into once you get some...this will slot straight into 2" focuser....just dont use filters if you dont have any 2" atm.

EzyStyles
17-08-2006, 06:03 PM
yep i get it. like looking down into a straw and you can see the side of the barrel. so 2" all the way? no worries Tony. doh!! and i just bought a 1.25 uv/ir filter few days ago.. lol

Geoff45
18-08-2006, 07:14 AM
You could also consider Jerry Lodriguss's ebook on photography with a DSLR bfor $US40 (http://www.astropix.com/GADC/GADC.HTM ) It has a wealth of useful info.

Geoff45
18-08-2006, 07:39 AM
I couldn't find anything on the canon website about an adapter to use with12v, but that doesn't mean that there isn't one. You can get battery packs, but I think they only hold 2 of the normal canon batteries. To save onto the computer you need software(eg ImagesPlus). The usb cable (Dick Smith) is just needed to extend the short cable that comes with the camera. The Hap Griffen cable is needed if you want to take bulb exposures with computer control, otherwise you are limited to a max of 30sec. If you control the camera by hand, you can take any exposure you want. I have heard of people making these themselves. From what I remember (you'll have to check this) the shoestring adapter assumes you already have a Canon TC-80N3 remote control (which won't work with the 350D without the adapter). I thought it was easier just to get the whole assembly from Hutech. I have had some trouble directly downloading to the computer--there are occasional hangups, so I just prefer to keep it simple. Take the pictures with the camera, put the memory card in a card reader (about $30 from any camera store) and download to the computer using drag and drop.

EzyStyles
19-08-2006, 12:25 AM
thanks geoff for your informative post. I was thinking of using DSLR Focus to capture and focus my shots. I guess thats probably like ImagePlus. Is it just an ordinary USB cable? i know i shouldnt ask too many q's yet until i get the darn camera first lol.. sometime today :P

RB
19-08-2006, 07:20 AM
Hey.....is it your Birthday today Eric?
Happy Birthday, if it is.

:birthday:

Geoff45
19-08-2006, 09:03 AM
Actually it's a usb extension cable. One end goes onto the usb cable supplied with the camera and the other goes into the computer. I have one about 3m long which gives you plenty of room between telescope and computer.

[1ponders]
19-08-2006, 09:32 AM
FWIW Eric, I wouldn't worry too much about downloading direct to the computer, assuming of course you have at least a 512 memory card in the camera. It takes considerable time to download from camera to computer and the only real advantage I see is that you have the image on your computer to look at, you can't do much else with it until you complete your imaging run as well as collecting darks and flats.

Also which everway you go a focus assist program is a mind saver (I'd be a mental case without DSLR Focus). You can go crazy trying to focus visually, or take an image-zoom in-refocus-take and image-zoom in- refocus-take an image- zoom in- refocus.....:scared:

Must haves;
Shoestring adapter and cables for autoguiding
Powered USB2 hub in lieu of usb extension (especially if you are guiding with the DSI and wanting to dowload direct from the camera.)
DSLR Focus and camer shutter release cable (usually a serial cable, thought they might come usb now :shrug: ) Or use ImagesPlus.

JohnG
19-08-2006, 11:32 AM
Hi Eric

Like Paul, FWIW, this is what I use with my 350D and it has worked successfully without a hitch for the last 12 months.

DSUSB and DSCBL-01 and 03 from Shoestring Astronomy and a long USB cable from Hap Giffin, nothing else.

Focus and Automation using DSLRFocus and for processing, ImagesPlus 2.75.
ImagesPlus 2.80 is now the current release and it has similar focussing and automation to DSLRFocus. I don't use the Canon Timer as there is no need for it when everything is attached to my Laptop, DSLRFocus does the timing and sequencing for long exposures. I use the native Canon software to look at my shots whilst they are on the Laptop.

I also have several spare batteries but no longer use that system, because I image under a dome, I have the Canon AC Adapter so power useage is no longer a problem.

I download direct to my Laptop as it is more conveniant for me to have individual directories for Lights, Flats, Darks and Bias shots, never had any dramas doing it this way.

Oh, and BTW, if you haven't done it yet, check Menu 3 and change the Communication over to PC otherwise it will not talk to your Laptop or PC.

Cheers

JohnG :thumbsup:

EDIT: Forgot to mention, your downloads will be almost instantaneous if your Laptop is USB 2.0

Striker
19-08-2006, 04:36 PM
I have the identical equipment as JohnG..same cables same software and same AC power supply and use the software in the same way.

If you have a laptop already which I know you do I wouldn't be bothering spending money on large capacity memory cards for the canon...I have 2gig and it never gets used.....Paul's computer must be slow as it should only take around 2 seconds for a raw file of 7mb to be transfered to your computer thats plenty of time as you should allow 15 seconds between exposures just to allow for the chip to cool a little.

I think I will stick with Imagesplus 2.75 if the only difference is focusing on 2.8 that I would use...I kind of like DSLR focus.

EzyStyles
21-08-2006, 03:43 PM
Thanks Paul and thanks Andrew for the b'day greetings :) and i think houghy also from the other post.

I already have the shoestring adapter for autoguiding, today i got myself a 1 gig CF card $37 (soo cheap these days) and powered usb2 hub. So all i need i think right now is the 2" t-thread to mount camera into focuser, DSLR focus, 12v AC cable and shutter release cable? I was thinking of the DSUSB:

http://www.store.shoestringastronomy.com/products_ds.htm

will i be needing any cables from the shoestring store?

apologise for this DSLR newbie asking so many questions. I never use a DSLR camera before. Was playing around over the weekend . gees very complicated equipment indeed (for me anyway :P ).thanks guys for the great help.

EzyStyles
21-08-2006, 03:46 PM
yep laptop is usb 2.0 . thanks john . is your 12v adapter from canon itself? or can i use a 12v dick smith regulated power? since your setup is same as tony's, i might just follow it.

JohnG
21-08-2006, 04:19 PM
Hi Eric

This is what I use, Canon AC to DC adapter kit:

http://www.canon.com.au/products/dcc_accessories/chargers_adaptors/1428.html

It still requires 240V but in the dome I don't have a moisture problem that is likely to interfere with it.

I have not had any problems at all with my setup and I believe Tony has had none as well.

Cheers

JohnG

Geoff45
22-08-2006, 10:02 AM
Can someone explain why a powered usb hub is needed? Maybe this is why my laptop sometimes hangs up when camera controlling. How is it powered? Internal batteries or external ac? (in which case it would be difficult for field use).

Shawn
22-08-2006, 04:43 PM
love this thread, im still setting up and trying to mimick the scenario I will have on completion of the observatory. I set up a p3 with all the software I needed on it and used R,admin to drive that PC via 80211b, data xfer and and control seem to work fine, cables cut to a minimum. anybody else done this ?,, Have I overlooked something , that when it is implemented I will have truble with ..

JohnG
22-08-2006, 08:50 PM
Sorry, can't help you with USB powered hubs, my setup has a desktop P3 controlling the Telescope/Gemini system and planetarium software, GOTO's and sometimes the autoguider although I usually use the ST-4 as a stand alone unit.

My Laptop is used purely for imaging. Eliminates the potential for a groundloop problem.

Cheers

JohnG

EzyStyles
23-08-2006, 10:59 AM
Hi ghsmith. a power usb hub is just extra usb slots. With some laptops like mne, there are only 2 usb. I have a 7 usb power hub for additional devices. Since certain usb devices such as camera, dsi's etc drains quite alot of power, you will need a "power" usb hub (house hold power) is run all those devices at once.

EzyStyles
23-08-2006, 11:04 AM
i have got myself the following parts. Should be coming in the mail soon:

- USB Shutter Control Adapter DSUSB
- Cable for Canon, 2.5mm phono 6 feet DSCBL-01
- 6 foot male-female extension cable DSCBL-03
- USB2 extension cable
- Canon AC-DC adapter kit
- DSLR Focus

I still havent gone into Bintel to get a t-thread adapter. Is that all the parts i need?

thanks.

Geoff45
24-08-2006, 08:01 AM
Eric, Rule #1 of astrophotography is that you will never have all the parts you need!
Geoff

Geoff45
25-08-2006, 07:43 AM
See what I mean. canon have just announced the 400D 10.1 megapix camera http://www.canon.com.au/home/story_1541.html (http://www.canon.com.au/home/story_1541.html)