Portable generator opinions

[strongmanmike]

Might have to move soon and build another observatory

Will need to get myself a portable generator to run scope, CCD cameras, laptop and lights this time though, any recommendations?

Was thinking a pure Sine wave version would be advisable?

I thought this one sounds perfect for the job?..anyone know much about this model/brand?

http://outbaxcamping.com.au/inverter-generator/gentrax-4-4kva-puresine-inverter-generator-silent.html

or this one:

http://www.mytopia.com.au/p/3.4kva-2.5kw-portable-inverter-generator/FUJIMICRO-2500UC?utm_source=Get+Price&utm_medium=CPC&utm_campaign=Get+Price+Tracking&CA_6C15C=1921417653

Cheers for any feedback

Mike

[Octane]

They're both reasonably-priced. I thought those things were at least 3 times as much. Good to know!

Watching this thread with interest.

H

[White Rabbit]

Yeah me too, those are very reasonably priced.

[strongmanmike]

Yes me too H...was wondering if it may be a scam site so I rang them and they appear to be a legitimate camping store with a shop front, the units are Chinese made and imported hence the price ala GSO Netws and RC's I guess...? China comes to the rescue again :lol:

Mike

[Octane]

Oh, well. They're not too huge of an outlay. If it breaks, just get another. :P

H

[strongmanmike]

Although lighter output specs, I like the fact that the Fujimicro has a normal cigarette lighter and a USB socket plus an LCD showing running time...I'd like to know I won't get rudely interrupted in the middle of an exposure before a full night is up. I get the impression that if I am largely just running the scope, cameras and laptop both units should last a full night on one tank load of fuel..?

Mike

[Barrykgerdes]

We have a 2.2KVA Chinese generator that we have run at Wiruna for two years now. It is the second one we bought the first only lasted 6 months before the engine gave out. The one we have now is electric start and has a remote control. However don't forget to turn the remote control switch off if you are storing it else the battery will go flat.

Most of the generators now are about that price, even Bunnings have got them.

Look for one that is no more than 58db and CHANGE THE OIL every 24 hours running. We change ours before every session at Wiruna.

This is the way to keep them serviceable for years. Another minor trouble I had was with the speed regulator. The engine would not drop to a good idle speed because of the wear in the control shaft gave it too much backlash.

Don't let it run out of petrol while connected to equipment. The dying cough and splutter can send spikes to your gear. It runs for 6hours on a tank of petrol.

Barry

[strongmanmike]

Cool Barry, can you fill them while they are running?

Mike

[Barrykgerdes]

It is not advisable but only because of the risk in spilling petrol. Technically there is no problem.

Barry

[lazjen]

A complete tangent on approach, but how feasible would it be to whack in one or more batteries for your power needs and then solar charge them instead of running a generator?

[glend]

Add up the wattage of all the devices you will be running and get a generator that can output double that continuous - the reason being you will want it to run in economy model to extend fuel supply. So if you have 500 watts of load get a 1kw continuous generator with load sensing economy model. Consider the noise impact on your neighbors, ikn many areas you cannot run them after 11pm.

[Exfso]

I bought a jackhammer from Mytopia a month ago, it was supposed to be a German design, it worked ok, but leaked grease like a seive. Made in PRC, the manual was unreadable and all in all it was one shoddy piece of equipment. It has since been returned to them at their own cost. I am not saying that all the gear from them is shoddy, just my experience. I have yet to receive a reply as to what they are doing, they have had it for 10 days now.:question:

[mozzie]

i had a chinese 2kva generator kipor brand..never again it was only used at work to power a grinder or recipo saw as electricity was not available all the time doing strata work..may only use it once or twice a month and well looked after but for the love af me it would always break down,some other part would break on the inside of it!!!!!! over the last 6-9 months spent some $600 odd dollars on repairs.the final straw it needed a new fuel pump :rolleyes:in it goes again 2 weeks later in goes the fuel pump oh they can't start it looked like some electrical prob know..
i ended up spending a bit more then i wanted and bought a new yamaha 2.4kva...
honda and yamaha brands seem to be the best after reading all the reviews!!!!!
mike i don't know if honda and yamaha do a generator with the features your after but you should be careful with the lesser know brands they can bit you in the bum trying to keep them going.as well as cost a small fortune to keep going...

[Barrykgerdes]

This is the way to go but the initial capital cost will be quite a bit higher than a bare generator and it is the way I would go for what Mike wants to do.

Unless everything you want to run is 12 volt compatible you will need a 1Kv inverter and at least a 200 amp battery as well as the solar panel and a standby generator in case there is no sun.

This is the system we run at Wiruna. The storage is 1100 amp hours and supplies a 1.5Kva inverter. This is not enough to run everything all night for three days at a star party. That is where the generator is used as a backup. Generator noise does worry some people even though the generator noise is reduced by about 10db in a sound deadening enclosure. So we normally run the generator up til 10 or 11 O'clock then change over to the battery for the rest of the night.

Barry

[AstroJunk]

I forked out the big bucks for a Yamaha 1KVa unit a few years ago to power the observatory and shed whilst the house was built. I have to admit, it was faultless!

It sits around most of the time now, but every now and then when I need a power tool at the far end of the block, I'll crank it up and it starts with no bother.

You get what you pay for...

[Peter Ward]

I did Ditto with a similar Honda generator. Over a decade of trouble free operation.

Thinking of which, many years ago when I also rode a Honda motorcycle, and needed to buy a helmet, I picked up a generic "hat" ( it was not expensive) and was admonished by the sales guy who had been riding bikes way longer than myself. He explained how, albeit , a decidedly more expensive Shoei was going to protect my head better. In short: how much is you head worth? I bought the Shoei.

Perhaps you might also ask: how much is frying my CCD, Focuser, Mount, etc. going to cost.....:question:

[gregbradley]

I run generators at my dark site. I originally used a Honda 20iu. Small, light very reliable. After about 2 years it started to burn oil. Bummer.

It still works though and its a spare. Run time was about 8 hours I think and I would naughtily refuel while it ran to prevent shutdowns - not a safe practice though. Never any issue with cleanliness of the power and astro gear. Used it for several years.

I replaced it with a Chinese 3.3KVA unit. It was poorly made. It sounded good at first. The pull cord would routinely break and it went back several times. I opened it up once and the reason the pull cord broke was the metal fitting it went through was super rough on the inside - all jagged and sharp.

It had a wire mesh on the exhaust. After about 40 hours this jammed up with exhaust and prevented smooth running of the generator. If off the unit backfired a bit.

I also noticed interference sometimes on the TV when it revved when the fridge kicked in.

I have since gotten a Yamaha 3.8KVA with electric start and pull cord back up start. Faultless. Run time is more like 20 hours easy to maintain and does its job.

I think regular changing of the oil as mentioned in an earlier post is veyr important. Especially after the problem with the first one starting to burn oil. I was a bit slow in changing the oil (dirty job).

Like anything Chinese the standards are rising but you are taking a chance. It will sound great but probably not deliver. Then again it may be better than what I think. 6 hours isn't long enough to run an astro setup. You need more like 8-10.

I am very used to the cheery hum of a Japanese generator going in the background at my dark site observatory. Like an old friend. Their motors have a cheery tone to them and the Chinese one sounded more like life was hard work!

Greg.

[acropolite]

+1 for Honda or Yamaha, regarding oil changes, 90 days or 30 hours is a good target to aim for, there's a good reason why they change oils in aircraft engines so frequently, acid buildup and dilution causes most damage, frequent oil changes prevent these problems.

[doppler]

I have heard that a pure sine wave is recomended for powering sensitive electronic devices, computers televisions etc because the power output can fluctuate on basic generators.

[Barrykgerdes]

Hi Mke I think you have got the opinions
1. A generator is a good idea
2. Maintenance is important
3. Don't get the cheap Chinese ones. The good brands like Honda and Yamaha are worth the extra money.

Barry

[gary]

Hi Mike,

I use a Honda EU20i.

59dB, pure sine wave. 240V and 12V outlets.

When you travel around, they would be one of the most popular generators you keep seeing.

[AstralTraveller]

Not that people with generators are popular :P. Personally I'd find it hard to reconcile the ambience of astronomy with the noise of a generator (however quiet).

[strongmanmike]

Thanks everyone, as expected, some useful opinions there, cheers :thumbsup:



Yep, got that Bazza...but like with RC's though the difference in price is about double or more :doh:

Mike

[DavidTrap]

More importantly, bugger about having to move again just after getting your Obs built...

As for generators, very happy with my Honda. They hold their value very well when sold second hand on eBay.

DT

[clive milne]

Mike,
Solar is a much better option.
The up front cost is higher but the long term cost is lower than a generator.

Consider this; Mining companies (like Rio) use lighting stations around their remote excavation sites. They used to be basically a big diesel generator with a lighting tower attached. They are now switching to lighting trailers comprising 1kva of solar panels feeding an internal gell cell bank of 10 x 200amp hour batteries. It works out cheaper and is essentially maintenance free.

They use a chinese copy of a an inverter designed by Tomahawk (USA) like this one: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-9000W-PEAK-24V-PURE-SINEWAVE-POWER-INVERTER-40A-CHARGER-/271209993955?pt=AU_Boat_Parts_Acces sories&hash=item3f256016e3&_uhb=1

If you need more output they have one twice the size which will cost you $800 landed.

when they say charger they mean that you can hook up to a 240v source as a back up to charge your batteries .... it will not charge them from solar panels though.

To do that, you really are best off using an MPPT charger. Arguably the best available is the Morningstar:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Morningstar-TriStar-45A-Multiple-Voltage-MPPT-Charge-Controller-/291104352837?pt=AU_Solar&hash=item43c72bea45&_uhb=1

Incidentally... I personally know the guy who puts together the solar rigs for Rio Tinto and other mining companies.... occasionally he has surplus gel cells for sale. He can't use them because their physical size is incompatible with the trailers they send up to the mining sites, other than that they are brand new and fully functioning. Last set I got from him were priced at $250 each. They retail new in excess of $650 per battery.

My experience with solar versus generator is that my only regret is persevering with the infernal combustion engine one day longer than I had to. Solar works so well it just slips from your consciousness in to the domain of things that you simply don't need to think about any more.

It's also silent and considerably less environmentally damaging.

You wont regret it.

[clive milne]

One other thing to consider....

And this is from personal experience; if you try to run a 250A welder off a 4kva sine wave generator (even with the welder turned right down) the generator will have a conniption and stall.
If you try it several times, lowering the demand on the generator by turning the welder down further still in an attempt to find a level where it might actually work, you will likely burn out the electronics in the generator.

A solar inverter like this, however:http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-18000W-PEAK-24V-PURE-SINEWAVE-POWER-INVERTER-70A-CHARGER-DIGITAL-DISPAY-/271386352390?pt=AU_Boat_Parts_Acces sories&hash=item3f2fe31b06&_uhb=1

Will run a circular saw, fridge and air conditioner all at the same time and be at less than 50% of its real continuous load capacity. (17% of its peak)

You of course have to have the battery (or solar) capacity to keep up with it if you intend to do that for any length of time, but that isn't as difficult as you might think.

The essence of the message here is that solar inverters are commonly designed to handle instantaneous power loads 3x their continuous ratings. (even the units manufactured in china) and don't be surprised if a generator karks it when a load 1/3rd its rated capacity is suddenly dumped on it. Generators by Honda, Yamaha, etc, fair only marginally better.

[Brettstar6754]

I bought this one from AGR @ Seven hills after recommendations from other IISers.http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-Fuji-Micro-7-5kVA-Diesel-Inverter-Generator-Silent-Portable-Camping-Fishing-/130935160469?pt=AU_Hardware&hash=item1e7c57fe95&_uhb=1

It seems to be quite good (50 hours use). It has been punished in 45 degree heat for hours on end. It makes no fuss when I weld heavy metal @ 200amp.
For what its worth, the build quality of these imports seems very good.

The smaller ones would be quite versatile.
See you at the SPSP,

[loc46south]

Mike I started imaging off the back of a landrover using a 2.2KW Chinese generator, it gave great service and is still going today but when I eventually built an Observatory it was barely adequate - I purchased a 6.5 KW Chinese Generator and it broke down on the first night, motor run a bearing. Retailer replaced it the next day and it's successor has run for 3 years without any problems. The only thing is that the Chinese seem to be a little over optimistic with their ratings - my 6.5 KWH would reliably deliver more like 4.5KWH. The biggest cost of running it was petrol, so much so that a cost comparrison showed that Solar units would be much cheaper (The cost of Solar has dropped considerably over the last 18 mths to 2 years) - the proviso being that you can get your hands on some cheap batteries. The recent advances in computers also mean that the power needed to run the observatory is now not as great as it used to be. http://www.pbase.com/loc46south/image/154996463

If you need further info PM me and I will help where I can

Cheers

[leon]

Stick with Honda Guys, had ours for 4 years now, never fails to start and runs perfectly all the times, it has done hundreds of hours on our travels.

They may be a bit more expensive, but worth every cent.

Leon

[icytailmark]

would be far cheaper to buy a couple of batteries instead

[jenchris]

Honda make a neat little V twin 10bhp for about 180 dollars - V belt it to a couple of Alternators and a charger (with batteries) and you've got sufficient power to run a large observatory and a caravan. Use low voltage for EVERYthing and you won't need an inverter.
I intend to do that to my home eventually.

[mozzie]

bought a new yamaha generator and it arrived today :thumbsup::thumbsup:.
so far very impressed!!!!
let's hope it doesn't break down like the old kipor piece of crap...

[AstroJunk]

The only thing I found, was to remember to switch of ECO mode when using big power tools to stop them bogging down at start-up. Hondas have that feature too which is brilliant when using lower power kit; the machine just automatically throttles back so is quieter and uses less fuel.

[mozzie]

yes the old kipor had it..in the end it was only going flat out...
the new yamaha does all my power tools both cement mixers and the bricksaw starts and runs for about 15 seconds then the genny overloads!!!!!!
bugger those bricksaws suck some power to strartup!!!!