Best Travel Telescope??

[glend]

I love my big dobs but they are a pain (in the back) when it comes to travelling, and they take up massive amounts of room in my vehicle. I am looking for a good travel scope that I can take on the road, maybe on longer touring trips to remote parts of Australia, as opposed to astro camps where the big dob would go. What are the choices?

I quick Goggle finds the Celestron 70 Travel Scope as one example. Ideally I'd like a scope that does not require collimation every time I get it out of the vehicle (like a collapsible dob would), has a limiting magnitude of at least 11 or more:eyepop: , and doesn't take up much room. What are people using? Have you travelled Australia with a scope, and have views on this? Let me know.

:thanx:

[Astromaniac]

G'Day,

I use a Celestron NexStar 6" SE. It's a little beauty, compact, light easily aligned and very good optically. Recently I took it with me on a caravan trip to Queensland. On the way we stopped at Siding Spring. A friend works/lives there. It took me 5 minutes to set up and align in a pitch dark night and what a view of the sky! :eyepop:

Cheers,

John :astron:

[brian nordstrom]

:thumbsup: Yes John , you would not get much better than the 6SE , I have a friend with one and it packs down small , is light and as you say up and running in miniutes with a nice 6 inches of light grasp .
Brian.

[traveller]

An Orion ST 80 on a camera tripod.
Light, cheap and cheerful.
Only draw back is it won't reach down to mag 11.
Bo

[Allan_L]

What sort of money do you want to invest Glen?
I agree with John, the Celestron SE series SCT seems to fit your requirements.
I have travelled with a SE4.
A bit small for my liking.
The SE 6 is probably a better size for you. (Lm Magnitude 13.4)
And at $1399 not too painful on the pocket.

[glend]

Thanks for those suggestions. In answer to Allan_l's budget question, I'd like to stay under $1000 if possible. I guess one sensible option is to simply use my old Celestron 130 EQ newt: f5, 650mm Fl, limiting magnitude of 13.1, Resolution (Rayleigh) 1.07 arc seconds ;(Dawes) 0.89 arc seconds, CG-3 Eq Mount with a one axis RA motor drive (which I don't really like very much), on steel leg tripod.
It's a light scope, and I have my good EPs I can take along. I can find a padded case for a tube of that length at Bunnings. A Goto mount would be great and I could probably get one for my budget.

I have seen Allan-Ls SE4 and agree it would maybe be a little small.

The Nextstar 130 SLT appears to be exactly my 130 newt on a Alt/Az goto mount (which I like); and it's way under my budget at the moment through Ozscopes ($799), very cheap for a Goto system but I already have this manual 130 sitting here. :rolleyes:

http://www.ozscopes.com.au/reflector-telescope-celestron-nexstar-130-slt.html?gclid=CNLnwIma97oCFYkqpAod sEgAAg

They also have the SE4 on sale for $899 at the moment:
http://www.ozscopes.com.au/celestron-nexstar-4-se-computerized-telescope.html

Finally, maybe this is my answer, its a GOTO Alt/Az mount that I could stick on my tripod in place of the CG-3, and it has dovetail attachment and the newt might just be within it's weight limit of 4kg (maybe):

http://www.astroshop.com.au/products/details.asp?id=MAS-032A2

and it doesn't cost too much.

** Update: I spoke to Steve at the Astroshop and he has customers running more than 4KG on those iOptron mounts. I have weighed my Celestron 130 tube and it's less than 4kg on it's own so the iOptron maybe the lowest cost option.**

But first a little more reading about the iOptron to do I think.

[glend]

'Back to the drawing board' as they say. Further research on the iOptron Goto mount reveal some disappointing quality issues and lack of precision in both manufacturing and operation - at least so far as use with a scope is concerned. Looking at other options.

[skysurfer]

You watch from downtown Sydney ??
Under a reasonably dark sky (Bortle 5 or darker which covers 99+% of AU) an 80mm easily shows +11.5 or even +12 when you magnify enough (80x). Of course you should use averted vision. Direct vision does not show +11.

I have a Televue Genesis (100mm) on a Vixen SP with DIY lightweight tripod and travel around the world with it. All together 11kg.
When this is too much an 80mm ED or APO on tabletop or photo tripod should suffice.

[MattT]

Personally I like the 100ED Refractor with an EQ3 manual mount. No batteries and the frac doesn't need any collimation. Out in the dark it is amazing what a 100mm scope will show. Add the ES 68º series of eyepieces and a 2x barlow and….heaven is above. The 40mm ES gives close on 3º of sky.

Just my suggestion. The EQ 3 is small as is the frac…sort of but not big at all.

Matt

[netwolf]

At present there is a Nexstar SE sale on in the USA, some vendors will ship here if asked. A Nexstar 6SE is on sale for 699 and I was quoted 150 to ship via fedex. So landed 849. A 8SE is 999 but unsure what shipping would be.

I am tempted to get one as a portable grab and go setup.

[nebulosity.]

Hey Glen, get yourself a pair of 25x100mm binoculars, you will be mind blown :jawdrop:

Leaves my 6 inch newt in the dust...

[glend]

Thanks Jo, I have a pair of Orion 15x70 binos already and I agree that binos are a great, and quick, solution for grab and go type observations. I was after a quick setup goto scope which is what led me to looking at the iOptron Cube. And while initially skeptical of the quality, I have continued to research them, which included watching a Utube video of a payload test.

I decided to go ahead and order the iOptron Smartstar GPS Cube (Goto mount) from The Astroshop for my travel scope, a 4kg 130mm newt. The Utube Payload test ran the mount with 5kgs on it and it worked fine. Here is the test video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_in7SqLaGTg

The Cube arrived today and when I set it up and turned it on, nothing! It was suppose to find the GPS sats but it just sat there. After trying a few things, I checked out the iOptron Support webpages and it said the GPS PCB connector has been known to come loose in transport; so I thought I would check that out and popped the plastic GPS antenna cap off the top of the unit. There, where I expected to see a small GPS PCB, was... nothing!! The antenna housing was empty, the mounting posts were there, as were the two retaining screws, but nothing else. I was livid and rang The Astroshop in Brisbane where I bought it, no answer. I left them a voicemail message, I emailed them... finally I got an email back telling me to ring Extravision tomorrow ??? Who's Extravision in all this?

How can a supplier ship out a Goto mount with onboard GPS which doesn't have the GPS equipment inside the unit? Ok it's probably not the Astroshops fault as they are just a retail front and never open the box - they farm out the order to their distributor who holds the stock and ships it. Where is the Quality Control in the factory?

This experience has brought home all my fears about buying a low cost iOptron mount (even for a light travel scope).. So now I have to run the guantlet of twenty questions with some contract support guy to somehow prove this thing was faulty from the factory. Grrr... so frustrating.:mad2:

[barx1963]

From a legal point of view, the retailer (Astroshop) cannot shove their obligations onto the wholesaler (Extravision). If you bought it from Astroshop, it is Astroshops problem and I would be telling them so in no uncertain terms.
Malcolm

[Stardrifter_WA]

You're right Malcolm, the retailer shouldn't be trying to abrogate their responsibility, they should be dealing with it, as that is part of providing customer service.

It isn't whether you have a problem, as they will always occur from time to time, which is why we have statute warranties in the first place, however, it is how that problem is dealt with that is important, and in this case, I think retailer has lost an opportunity to provide real customer service, since it is their responsibility anyway.

[glend]

I thought I would put up some photos of this iOptron Smartstar G Unit that shows the extent of the stuff up. You can clearly see that there was nothing in the Antenna cap, nor was there ever anyway for wires to get through the housing to the antenna (unless there is a hole under the unused double sided tape square).

[PlanetMan]

Sadly I find this circumstance with respect to both the product and the retailers attitude unsurprising.

Unfortunately, it always comes back to the old point that you get what you pay for in the end. From my perspective it is better to spend more and be safe than taking a punt on a cheaper alternative as in this competitive world something has always gotta give to explain why premium US brand "A" charges 4k for a telescope and mainland China brand "B" charges 1k for something supposedly the same.

I know many folks have had great experiences with their cheaper products but when you are unlucky enough to pull the short straw these are the unhappy stories which always arise.

I personally rather wait, save my pennies and pay a lot more for a Televue telescope (for example) from a bricks and mortar store like Bintel than taking a punt with a 'internet" store which in many instances only physically exists on someones PC located in their garage.

Glen - I sincerely wish you have a good outcome from this in terms of finding a suitable remedy.

[glend]

Planetman I understand your viewpoint completely. However, as a retiree I have a limited amount of money to spend on astronomy and need to maximise the capability I gain for the least amount of $ invested. This forces me to seek low cost solutions, and while it may at times be a false economy, generally I get good results. Sure I'd love to have a 16" Meade LX600 but that can't happen unless I win the lottery; while GSO for example (Taiwan based, and not to be confused with mainland China) makes very good equipment for the cost, so the value proposition is excellent in my opinion. Some of their equipment quality is ahead of the more expensive competition - like in the Azimth and Alt bearings for example. Looking at it from a $ per inch of aperture, it's hard to walk past them simply for the sake of pretentious branding. Sure Televue makes great stuff, but does the cost reflect the incremental increase in quality or is it more related to branding strategy.

Internet shopfronts are a problem I agree, but some like Agena Astro seem to be doing great things for astronomy. Most trusted, and well regarded, Australian suppliers also have bricks and mortar presence and staff to talk to about problems, but this is also reflected in their pricing, which comes back to the problem of maximising return on the $ invested. Some like Andrews Comms, manage to undercut their competitors by buying in large quantity, and never opening the boxes but just onshipping to the end customer -but there is no middleman distributor as far as I can tell. It's when you get an internet shopfront, with a hidden multi-step supply chain, that it gets really complicated when there is a problem. In the case of the Astroshop (a front for Binary Systems Pty Ltd) , it appears that they sell via the web with no bricks and mortar presence, then send the order off to a distributor ( a separate business entity) who picks the order from their warehouse and ships it out. If Support is required they then refer the customer off to a third-party who supplies support under a contract arrangement. Add to that mix a product with a questionable origin and quality issues and it's high risk - hence my problem.

[Stardrifter_WA]

Hi Planetman,

I disagree, to a point, if a product states that it can do something, then by law it must do what it says it can do, regardless of the cost. And, just because a store is only on the Internet, it still has, by law, an obligation, just as a bricks and mortar store has. It is disgraceful that the retailer just passes the buck onto the wholesaler, and it is a warning to us all.

Although I mostly buy a higher quality product anyway, not everyone can afford to buy the best, however, I do agree with you that it is better to wait and get the better option, but not everyone can do that. Also, at what point do you stop and jump in. I know that if I had unlimited funds I would have much better gear than I have, and I have some pretty good gear, not all of it the very best, but not the worst either.

Furthermore, some of the quality coming out of China now is superb, particularly given the price, so to indicate that anything Chinese is junk, simply isn't necessarily true. Take my WO FLT 110, it is a fantastic telescope for the price, but no, it ain't no Takahashi either, but then, I couldn't afford the Tak, at the time, and didn't want to wait until I could, as I would be waiting a long time to be able to justify the considerable cost difference. And, it doesn't matter if you buy the more expensive brand anyway, you can still have problems with it; less likely I admit, but it still happens.

Also, dealing with bricks and mortar stores doesn't necessarily make that much of a difference, it seems, in some cases. One particular Aussie astro store, who shall remain nameless, managed to alienate me by disrespecting me and even considers spending over $10,000 as not enough to be considered an important customer, which I found quite disrespectful. Really, that is what was said to me. :mad2: Maybe not in those exact words, but the meaning was quite clear, in my mind at least. And it isn't like I have been a difficult customer either, as I very rarely asked for much, but was treated as not worthy of their time. :sadeyes: Go figure :question: Unfortunately, it wasn't the first time either, but will probably be the last. If you are not one of their mates, you don't count. Not a good way to do business. :sadeyes:

A lot of Australian businesses that are doing really well in good times forget that you have to treat every customer as a very important customer, no matter how much they spend. EVERY customer is the lifeblood of any business. It is ok being dismissive in good times, but when things get tough, and they will, particularly now that the dollar is dropping (and will drop much further), you will need every customer you can get, every single one.

Customer service in Australia is becoming appalling, and they wonder why business is so tough in Australia. I normally support local business as long as I am treated with respect and that they give excellent service, even when paying a higher price. But they are rare companies now, and as a result, there is no longer any reason I should buy locally. Now it all comes down to price and if I can get it cheaper overseas, then so be it. Mind you, I still do deal with local businesses, but only as long as I am treated with respect and I get outstanding service, as that is what it takes now.

Bottom line, if companies in Australia were to give much better service, they would be able to retain some of the business heading off shore, I know in my case they would.

Cheers Pete

[Stardrifter_WA]

Hi Glen,

Stuff coming out of Taiwan isn't necessarily made in Taiwan, as a lot of astro gear comes out of China anyway. It all comes down to what quality you want to pay for, as you can get the same item made a bit cheap, but quality suffers as a result. Anyone can make anything cheaper, just comes down to what you want to pay.

I just recently bought an AT65EDQ for $459, which is made in China, I think? For a grab and go, it is a fantastic little scope for the price, with excellent build quality. Optics aren't perfect, but more than good enough for the price and its purpose.

Astrophysics, Televue and Takahashi are all great products, but you pay for it. And, I have no problem with that, if I have the cash. :D

As for Internet stores, here and overseas, you cannot blame a company for its poor service because it is based on the Internet. I deal with a lot of Internet based companies and, for the most part, have had excellent service. I have also had warranty issues and these were all dealt with exception efficiency and to my complete satisfaction. For instance, I had ordered a viewfinder and bracket from the US that turned out to have a stripped screw on the bracket. They sent me a complete replacement bracket and I didn't even have to send the other other back. Furthermore, they sent the replacement expedited freight and I had it in three days. Great service in my book. This isn't the only instance this has happened either. Whether you pay a higher price or not, things can go wrong. It is how they are fixed is what is important.

We are becoming a global community and distance is no longer a barrier with trade. It doesn't matter if I deal with a company in Sydney or the US. Sometimes it takes longer to get stuff from Sydney than the US.

Drop shipping is nothing new either. I used to work for a wholesaler who did that in the 1980's. But, it is still the sellers obligation to resolve any problems though.

Cheers Pete

[PlanetMan]

Hi Glen & Peter

I seem to have hit a few nerves with both of you so I am sorry as my comments weren't meant to be a criticism of anything or rude to anyone.

There is a lot of debate going on right now about the pro's and cons of internet businesses versus traditional bricks and mortar stores - far bigger than our microscopic market of astronomy gear is concerned.

You are both absolutely correct that it is easy to pontificate that we should only buy top quality when most people are on a limited budget. This circumstance however applies to all walks of life and consumer products and it is a decision everyone has to make for themselves.

If I can add one point which everyone should be mindful of when buying anything with a legal mentality of warranties etc and that is the word "ENFORCEMENT". Yes - we have all sorts of lovely legal principles and doctrines but enforcing your rights is a different matter altogether and this, more than anything else, is why I would recommend a physical store when having to deal with the practical realities of remedy.

Once again Glen I sincerely hope & wish you have a good outcome from what is clearly a very unfair and plainly wrong situation - but this doesn't obviate my experience that I have never had such circumstances befallen me because I have always saved - no matter how long it took - and only bought the more robust products.

This is probably why I only read about such complaints but never have any basis to make such posts myself.

I wish you both well and clear skys and fingers crossed on seeing ISON:hi::hi:

[Stardrifter_WA]

Hi Planetman,

Absolutely no offence taken, none at all. And no, you didn't hit a nerve, it is just a passionate area of interest.

As for bricks and mortar stores, they are a dying breed, whether we like it or not.

Retail is going through considerable changes and that form of business is far less justifiable now. The overheads are what puts the high price on goods in Australia and is not sustainable, in the long term. Obviously, some things will remain in solid stores, as they are not conducive to online environments. However, anything that doesn't require any customisation, for whatever reason, doesn't have to be sold from a solid premises any more.

In fact, the Internet has opened up a whole new world. I love "useful gadgets" and I went hunting for said gadgets on the Internet on the weekend and some of the stuff I saw was amazing and I have never seen them in a physical store, even ordered a couple things, and at prices that are hard to believe. I love Google images, and being able to see these things. Visual searching is so much fun :D

Furthermore, even manufacturing will change in the future where you will just order what you want and it will just be made. Currently, stuff is manufactured and then marketed. Additive manufacture (or 3D Printing, as it was called) will change the way we do business in the future, as everything will be personalised and, indeed, ordered over the Internet. Read up on Additive Manufacturing, it is really quite fascinating.

Cheers Pete

[AstroJunk]

Interesting twist to the debate. I'd just chime in that when I had an issue with a coffee machine, Hardly Normal put me on to the manufacturers support line, in much the way Steve has given you a direct line to Extravision, the Aussie importer and tech support guys.

Isn't that better customer service than sending the unit back and waiting?

[Stardrifter_WA]

And who is the loudest voice in Australia about online goods from overseas not attracting GST under $1,000.

Gerry Harvey! And he doesn't even provide decent customer service either. :sadeyes:

If this is what is going to happen, why have Harvey Norman stores, cut out the middle man and get it direct from the manufacturer, and save money! That is what is coming.

[AstroJunk]

:rofl:Ok, bad analogy:rofl:

I agree though, retailing days are numbered. I've nearly finished my xmas shopping, and I have yet to buy anything from Australia, and have not been anywhere near a local shop.

Back to travel scopes...

[Stardrifter_WA]

Yep, did most of my Xmas shopping online too, no traffic, no parking rage, no crowded shops and, more importantly, no stress! Oh, and no wasted time or fuel driving around to find that perfect gift. The only thing I actually went to shop to buy was a telescope for my son, too big to post :D

Now just gotta hope it all arrives in time :sadeyes: All bought using Paypal, just in case something goes missing. :) Really can't get much better, or easier, than that.